New SME Flagship Model 60

Dogberry

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I know I'll never own one of the more expensive SME tables unless I start buying lottery tickets, but that's OK as I'm happy to have two Model 10s, one with a Series V and one with the M10(309) arm. I think I can speak a little to the culture of the company and the UK buyers they serve. Their traditional demographic was largely middle-aged or older men who still read every page of Gramophone. They aspired to buy what they were told was good equipment and tended not to change it until it wore out. This meant either Linn or SME, Quad or Naim, and for speakers Quad or B&W. They would describe themselves as music-lovers rather than as audiophiles. SME have always understood this crowd, and while they know they can't expect to upsell them every couple of years, they will pay a good price for reliable and accurate engineering. Reliability and quality come far in advance of flashiness. The only experience SME have had with dealing with other buyers has been through tonearm sales, and sometimes I think they found that more bother than it was worth, especially as they were convinced that their arms couldn't possibly sound as good on other kinds of table. The mindset was 'every Series V sold alone is one less turntable sale'.
But the times, they are a-changin' and new ownership means a new way of doing things. This has led to some awkward decisions and results for companies like Quad, who have lost some reputation as a result. Maybe SME will be a bit more careful about changes, and I hope so as I wish them well.

BTW, there used to be a very affordable device that let you add a second arm to the Model 10, but it is no longer made. That company told me that SME had 'taken away their dealership' so they didn't see any purpose in making it any more. I'm reading between the lines, but I think I'd be right in guessing the dealership was 'taken away' because they made that device! I mentioned it to someone I know at SME and the official response was that the company had no knowledge of it.

Chris
 

Loheswaran

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Dec 19, 2014
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I know I'll never own one of the more expensive SME tables unless I start buying lottery tickets, but that's OK as I'm happy to have two Model 10s, one with a Series V and one with the M10(309) arm. I think I can speak a little to the culture of the company and the UK buyers they serve. Their traditional demographic was largely middle-aged or older men who still read every page of Gramophone. They aspired to buy what they were told was good equipment and tended not to change it until it wore out. This meant either Linn or SME, Quad or Naim, and for speakers Quad or B&W. They would describe themselves as music-lovers rather than as audiophiles. SME have always understood this crowd, and while they know they can't expect to upsell them every couple of years, they will pay a good price for reliable and accurate engineering. Reliability and quality come far in advance of flashiness. The only experience SME have had with dealing with other buyers has been through tonearm sales, and sometimes I think they found that more bother than it was worth, especially as they were convinced that their arms couldn't possibly sound as good on other kinds of table. The mindset was 'every Series V sold alone is one less turntable sale'.
But the times, they are a-changin' and new ownership means a new way of doing things. This has led to some awkward decisions and results for companies like Quad, who have lost some reputation as a result. Maybe SME will be a bit more careful about changes, and I hope so as I wish them well.

BTW, there used to be a very affordable device that let you add a second arm to the Model 10, but it is no longer made. That company told me that SME had 'taken away their dealership' so they didn't see any purpose in making it any more. I'm reading between the lines, but I think I'd be right in guessing the dealership was 'taken away' because they made that device! I mentioned it to someone I know at SME and the official response was that the company had no knowledge of it.

Chris
that’s quite true apart from the fact they first sold arms (in audio that is)
I’m about the only person who finds SME decks a bit dull -
 
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Dogberry

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That's right, the arms came first. If A R-A had come up with a table first the arms would never have been sold separately.
 

PeterA

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that’s quite true apart from the fact they first sold arms (in audio that is)
I’m about the only person who finds SME decks a bit dull -

I really enjoyed my Model 10 and Model 30/12. Eventually, I concluded that they are a bit damped sounding. Lots of contrast but it comes at the expense of energy and nuance.
 

Audiophile Bill

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Mar 23, 2015
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I really enjoyed my Model 10 and Model 30/12. Eventually, I concluded that they are a bit damped sounding. Lots of contrast but it comes at the expense of energy and nuance.

Hi Peter. I think that rubberised polymer that they glue to the underside of the main chassis is what causes the overly damped phenomenon - I hear that too.

Best.
 

PeterA

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Hi Peter. I think that rubberised polymer that they glue to the underside of the main chassis is what causes the overly damped phenomenon - I hear that too.

Best.

Hello Bill, Yes and also the dampening material on the platter. I regret not experimenting with the tension of the rubber band suspension and also actually defeating it. Is a very competent design that results in a very specific sound which I enjoyed for years. It was not until the big Micro Seiki that I heard a turntable I liked more. Admittedly I did not do a lot of direct comparisons but I did hear some other expensive turntable efforts that I did not like very much in other systems. I much preferred the SME to the Technics SP 10 mk 3 in my system. And I am curious to hear the new SME turntable and arm.
 
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Audiophile Bill

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Hello Bill, Yes and also the dampening material on the platter. I regret not experimenting with the tension of the rubber band suspension and also actually defeating it. Is a very competent design that results in a very specific sound which I enjoyed for years. It was not until the big Micro Seiki that I heard a turntable I liked more. Admittedly I did not do a lot of direct comparisons but I did hear some other expensive turntable efforts that I did not like very much in other systems. I much preferred the SME to the Technics SP 10 mk 3 in my system. And I am curious to hear the new SME turntable and arm.
Yes I would like to hear it too. Mik on this forum has one now. Would like to hear it soon.
 

PeterA

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Yes I would like to hear it too. Mik on this forum has one now. Would like to hear it soon.

I have spoken to Mik over the years about SME and the various motor implementations. I think he is or was one of SME‘s largest dealers. I will be curious to read his impressions of the new turntable.
 

CKKeung

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Jun 17, 2011
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mtemur

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it’s an old video shared by absolute sound again. it tells how good the new cnc machines and how comfortable computer aided design are and nothing more.
 

XV-1

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Loheswaran

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Hello Bill, Yes and also the dampening material on the platter. I regret not experimenting with the tension of the rubber band suspension and also actually defeating it. Is a very competent design that results in a very specific sound which I enjoyed for years. It was not until the big Micro Seiki that I heard a turntable I liked more. Admittedly I did not do a lot of direct comparisons but I did hear some other expensive turntable efforts that I did not like very much in other systems. I much preferred the SME to the Technics SP 10 mk 3 in my system. And I am curious to hear the new SME turntable and arm.
I envy you guys having an AS2000 - are there any in the UK i can listen to?

That aside amongst my decks include a Townshend Rock Elite (heavily modified) and it's damping trough does not suck the energy like SME's. I've also heard the Townshend Rock Reference - which is more of the same Tonwshend brilliance. Clearly the choice of material is relevant to the issue.

I hasten to add that I'm only expressing an opinion on what I have heard and I'm sure may will/may disagree. I personally wish i loved them coz they are beautifully built, and but for the Liberaciesque blue a work of engineering art
 

PeterA

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I envy you guys having an AS2000 - are there any in the UK i can listen to?

Hi Loheswaren,

I am not aware of any AS2000s in Europe. I think 10 were sold and then made. And David has two more for himself. There are specific WBF threads about most of them, some in ddk’s subforum.

I lived with the SME Model 30/12 for ten years, then the big Micro Seiki, then the original American Sound, and now the AS 2000. The differences are very interesting.
 
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ddk

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Hi Loheswaren,

I am not aware of any AS2000s in Europe. I think 10 were sold and then made. And David has two more for himself. There is a specific WBF thread about most of them.

I lived with the SME Model 30/12 for ten years, then the big Micro Seiki, then the original American Sound, and now the AS 2000. The differences are very interesting.
Production was limited to 14, two were master units to verify production quality and 12 for sale. None in Europe they all went to US and Far East In equal numbers. I kept two for myself.

david
 
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microstrip

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Loheswaran

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Dec 19, 2014
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Hi Loheswaren,

I am not aware of any AS2000s in Europe. I think 10 were sold and then made. And David has two more for himself. There is a specific WBF thread about most of them.

I lived with the SME Model 30/12 for ten years, then the big Micro Seiki, then the original American Sound, and now the AS 2000. The differences are very interesting.

I have a few more modest turntables than you have had, but I just enjoy the differences - coz sometimes you just want to hear music in a different way. Perhaps a bit 'off piste' but Avids' are often compared with SME's - i find that odd because I heard an Acutus back to back with an SME 20 - the price was comparable - and I just enjoyed the Avid an awful lot more.

Getting back to the SME 60, I wonder why they skipped the 40 and 50 - have they something planned with those numbers in mind?

I just wonder if they are running into that funny above £100K BMW zone. ie BMW struggle to sell their most expensive cars - those sales go to Porsche/Mercedes/Rolls Royce. With SME if I was spending silly money I'd consider the likes of an Air Force One or such like
 

PeterA

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Thanks for posting the link. It seems M Fremer really enjoyed it, but "The only remaining question is, who the hell really designed this thing?" (quote from the review) The high-end needs gurus, not design committees - they are needed for marketing.

It is interesting that he decided to review this. I asked both Stereophile and the absolute sound if they would review the SME 30/12 and neither expressed any interest. That was about 12 years ago.

It is also interesting to compare Fremer’s old review of the original model 30 to this latest review of the model 60. The reviews are quite different.
 

PeterA

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Dec 6, 2011
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I have a few more modest turntables than you have had, but I just enjoy the differences - coz sometimes you just want to hear music in a different way. Perhaps a bit 'off piste' but Avids' are often compared with SME's - i find that odd because I heard an Acutus back to back with an SME 20 - the price was comparable - and I just enjoyed the Avid an awful lot more.

Getting back to the SME 60, I wonder why they skipped the 40 and 50 - have they something planned with those numbers in mind?

I just wonder if they are running into that funny above £100K BMW zone. ie BMW struggle to sell their most expensive cars - those sales go to Porsche/Mercedes/Rolls Royce. With SME if I was spending silly money I'd consider the likes of an Air Force One or such like

The model 30 was named because it’s 30 years after the first tonearm. Perhaps the model 60 is 60 years after the first tonearm and 30 years after the model 30 in 1991 or thereabouts.
 

ddk

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May 18, 2013
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It is interesting that he decided to review this. I asked both Stereophile and the absolute sound if they would review the SME 30/12 and neither expressed any interest. That was about 12 years ago.

It is also interesting to compare Fremer’s old review of the original model 30 to this latest review of the model 60. The reviews are quite different.
It reads more like a PR piece or paid advertising than a review.

david
 

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