Should a member be allowed to make a post which is AI generated or AI mixed without disclosing such use of AI as part of the post?

[tima]

Adding one more question:

c) it appears the AI detectors that I tried rate a given text for AI content on a percentage basis. Do you think a threshold rating must be met to gauge the text as a product of AI?

I went to 3 AI detectors with text from a review I am working on. Two said it was likely 100% human generated and the third said it was 98% human generated. (fwiw, I wrote all of the text myself.) That's what led me to my question.

It might be transparent to provide links to the AI detectors that WBF uses.

What I tried:

Free AI Detector

Scribbr AI Detector: Identify AI-generated content from ChatGPT, Copilot, and Gemini with our advanced AI Checker. Try it for free!

www.scribbr.com

AI Detector by Copyleaks - Detect AI Text With Confidence

Instantly check and analyze AI content with Copyleaks AI Detector to uncover AI-generated text from ChatGPT, Gemini, and more. Start free today!

copyleaks.com

AI content detector

Check what percentage of your content is seen as human-generated with this free AI content detector tool. Paste in text or a URL to find out.

writer.com

 

[msimanyi]

Steve, like @tima I'm inclined to agree with your proposal. I don't see any direct issues with those standards.

It does beg the question though: how will Mods detect the use of AI and proceed with enforcement?

 

[Ron Resnick]

If Ai is not disallowed and nobody can tell the difference between AI and humans online, then forums will be obsolete because most humans will decline to participate

Sorry, but this doesn't make any sense. If nobody can tell the difference between AI generated posts and original human written posts, then what is the problem? In the scenario you are postulating you have absolutely no idea whether this post you are reading from me right now was written by me or was written by AI. So in that case it doesn't matter, does it?

You will have a forum full of AI bots talking to one another.

This is even more nonsensical. Who is talking about AI bots? The topic is AI generated information in response to a member written question.

Let me put your mind at ease. It is highly likely that Steve and I will agree unanimously that we will not allow a robot to register as a member of WBF.

This isn't catastrophizing, AI talking to one another

Yes, it is catastrophizing, because what you are getting hysterical about is not even what we are discussing here.

if AI can't be differentiated from human, it's the only logical conclusion.

Please see my first answer, above. Pretty soon AI text probably won't be able to be differentiated from human text. This is the reality that the old folks on this thread don't seem to be able to understand.

Try to process what godofwealth is writing.

 

[Ron Resnick]

perhaps atleast choose to take something of a stand against it here.

What stand would you like to take?

 

[tima]

This is even more nonsensical. Who is talking about AI bots? The topic is AI generated information in response to a member written question.

Let me put your mind at ease. It is highly likely that Steve and I will agree unanimously that we will not allow a robot to register as a member of WBF.

Maybe a little more depth ... ?

What about AI generated response to an AI written question.

How do you know a member is not a robot? Or the representative of a robot?

 

[thedudeabides]

If nobody can tell the difference between AI generated posts and original human written posts, then what is the problem? Try to process what godofwealth is writing.

Hopefully, AI posts won't be as pretentious, ignorant and ill advised as the one above.

 

[Ron Resnick]

This is what Tom meant when he said "How far are you going to let this slide", how many Teds are going to get on here and do what he just did?

As an extremely important and valued senior member of WBF Tom is entitled to his personal views, and his personal views are valued, appreciated and taken into account.

As our super-moderator Tom's role is to rise above his personal views, and to apply the Terms of Service with the utmost fairness, even-handedness and consistency.

 

[Ron Resnick]

What about AI generated response to an AI written question.

If the process doesn't start with a breathing WBF member, then I don't care what the ultimate AI output is -- it's not kosher to me.

How do you know a member is not a robot?

I will ask David Blumenstein to figure out how to filter out robots from the WBF registration process

 

[tima]

The more I look at this topic the more interesting it becomes...

With the advent of AI and AI detectors comes the interest in avoiding AI detection.

Here is what the Goggle AI says to my questions: how to avoid ai detection:

"To avoid AI detection in writing, focus on creating content that appears more human-like by varying sentence structure, avoiding repetitive phrases, paraphrasing text, incorporating personal anecdotes, and using a thorough editing process to add nuance and complexity, while also checking with AI detection tools to identify potential areas for improvement; essentially, "humanize" your content"

More from the robot here:

Google Search

and another site:

10 Actionable Tips To Avoid AI Detection In Writing

Avoid AI content detection in your writing with these 10 steps

surferseo.com

 

[Ron Resnick]

That just about sums it up. At some point, the line between deciphering the difference will effectively vanish. AI generated text needs to be banned. It really is that simple.

No, it's not that simple. How do you ban AI if you can't detect it -- if, as you suggest, the line between the difference vanishes?

And do you really mean only that AI generated text which is not conspicuously disclosed as AI generated text should be banned?

 

[Ron Resnick]

The more I look at this topic the more interesting it becomes..

I agree.

Members who reflexively say "ban it" simply are not grasping the complexities.

With the advent of AI and AI detectors comes the interest in avoiding AI detection.

This is why it is important for WBF as a community to take as long as we (the collective we, not you and me, Tim) need to think through these issues and to discuss these issues together.

 

[tima]

If the process doesn't start with a breathing WBF member, then I don't care what the ultimate AI output is -- it's not kosher to me.


I will ask David Blumenstein to figure out how to filter out robots from the WBF registration process

You do know that WBF is already crawling with robots. Likely gathering content to feed an AI.

 

[Ron Resnick]

You do know that WBF is already crawling with robots. Likely gathering content to feed an AI.

Of course. AI engines that utilize the Internet scour everything including WBF.

 

[tima]

What will most people do? Well, here’s what the Bay Area billionaires themselves have said on this topic.

Open AI is a proponent of Universal Basic Income. You get a basic living wage salary because you are a human. They have funded studies on this idea.

The scary part is Bay Area billionaires.

These robots are programmed by humans with agendas.

 

[Lagonda]

The more I look at this topic the more interesting it becomes...

With the advent of AI and AI detectors comes the interest in avoiding AI detection.

Here is what the Goggle AI says to my questions: how to avoid ai detection:

"To avoid AI detection in writing, focus on creating content that appears more human-like by varying sentence structure, avoiding repetitive phrases, paraphrasing text, incorporating personal anecdotes, and using a thorough editing process to add nuance and complexity, while also checking with AI detection tools to identify potential areas for improvement; essentially, "humanize" your content"

More from the robot here:

Google Search

and another site:

10 Actionable Tips To Avoid AI Detection In Writing

Avoid AI content detection in your writing with these 10 steps

surferseo.com

I just add a few bad jokes and intentional misspelling's, no one has ever suspected i am really a robot !

 

[Al M.]

I also propose that once this new TOS is put into effect, we will highlight it in our ANNOUNCEMENTS forum and alalso be placed in our next 3 monthly newsletters. This way everyone will be aware and I believe it will become a non issue or a minimal issue at most

All good ideas. Why not have a running banner on top of the forum, "only human generated posts and discussion, no AI allowed"?

 

[Rensselaer]

We are already living in an Orwellian dystopia where alternative facts prevail. As the internet is already chalk-full of diametrically opposed “facts”, AI can easily build a case/reality which proves whatever the programer/media owner or politician asks it to establish.

We heavily rely upon AI with our internet searches already. It is already happening so fast all around us. Very soon now, if not already, we will all be like the North Korean soldiers sent to augment Russian troops in Ukraine; having no idea where they are, no idea it isn’t a training exercise and no idea why but (for deniability) that they must kill themselves rather than be captured. At the mercy of the oligarchy.

So, to answer the question as to whether or not to suspend then remove folks that use AI on this forum, I don’t believe you will soon be able to spot it, let alone stop it. When I get to a point where I can no longer spot the lies I will have to then decide whether to take the red pill or the blue pill.

 

[DaveC]

Sorry, but this doesn't make any sense. If nobody can tell the difference between AI generated posts and original human written posts, then what is the problem? In the scenario you are postulating you have absolutely no idea whether this post you are reading from me right now was written by me or was written by AI. So in that case it doesn't matter, does it?

If this is what you believe you're never going to be able to understand my pov on this. If I can't tell the difference, I won't participate, and I'm not alone on this. Most humans will not participate.

This is even more nonsensical. Who is talking about AI bots? The topic is AI generated information in response to a member written question.

It's not nonsensical to most people here Ron.

Let me put your mind at ease. It is highly likely that Steve and I will agree unanimously that we will not allow a robot to register as a member of WBF.

If you think you can tell the difference you are mistaken. Either now or next week, but it's inevitable. If AI detectors are inaccurate you think you can really sus out who's a real human and who is not?

Yes, it is catastrophizing, because what you are getting hysterical about is not even what we are discussing here.

Can't catastrophize about what's already happening.

Please see my first answer, above. Pretty soon AI text probably won't be able to be differentiated from human text. This is the reality that the old folks on this thread don't seem to be able to understand.

Try to process what godofwealth is writing.

Not sure where the disconnect is here, but it seems to me like you're the one who needs to process what godofwealth is saying. You seem to be blind to the possible consequences and unable connect A to B.

 

[Ron Resnick]

If this is what you believe you're never going to be able to understand my pov on this. If I can't tell the difference, I won't participate, and I'm not alone on this. Most humans will not participate.



It's not nonsensical to most people here Ron.



If you think you can tell the difference you are mistaken. Either now or next week, but it's inevitable. If AI detectors are inaccurate you think you can really sus out who's a real human and who is not?



Can't catastrophize about what's already happening.



Not sure where the disconnect is here, but it seems to me like you're the one who needs to process what godofwealth is saying. You seem to be blind to the possible consequences and unable connect A to B.

Hello Dave,

Are you saying that bots presently are talking to each other on WBF?

(I am not talking about the BonzoBot on horns.)

Thank you.

 

[bonzo75]

Hello Dave,

If bots talking to each other on WBF is already happening would you please copy and paste for us here a sequence of posts on WBF which is an example of one bot writing something not initiated or originated by a person posting to another bot whose replies were not initiated or originated by a person.

Check the acoustical coupling videos thread