Sublime Sound

KeithR

VIP/Donor
May 7, 2010
4,413
1,671
628
Marina del Rey, CA
Fair enough, Peter. That threads digress into other topics is natural. My own system thread has digressed too various times, at some point even into discussing vintage speakers , which I enjoyed. Even in the face of apologies by others for the diversion by the latter topic I did not take steps to impede the momentum until it faded on its own.

Personally I would feel more comfortable starting a thread about SETs/horns if I had more experience with both (I have some experience, but it is very limited). I am just curious. Certainly from posted videos I cannot gather much, they all sound just bad in my view. My system sounds 10 x better than any of those videos -- make that 50 x better -- but what do you expect from iPhone mics and A/D converters, and the YouTube compressed digital format?
100% agree on the videos.

The great thing about where you guys live is the ability to hear lots of them within a few hour circumference. Old Forge, OMA, Jeffrey Jackson, Jeff Catalano, In Living Stereo, Viking, etc. Draw your own conclusions.
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 7, 2011
7,695
3,202
760
North Shore of Boston
100% agree on the videos.

The great thing about where you guys live is the ability to hear lots of them within a few hour circumference. Old Forge, OMA, Jeffrey Jackson, Jeff Catalano, In Living Stereo, Viking, etc. Draw your own conclusions.

Thanks for the ideas, Keith. I heard some of Jeff Catalano's horns once. Way too colored for my taste. He has great music though. Don't know about the other folks.
 

Al M.

VIP/Donor
Sep 10, 2013
6,156
1,542
483
Greater Boston
100% agree on the videos.

The great thing about where you guys live is the ability to hear lots of them within a few hour circumference. Old Forge, OMA, Jeffrey Jackson, Jeff Catalano, In Living Stereo, Viking, etc. Draw your own conclusions.

Good idea, thanks Keith. We once discussed a day trip, but should follow through once it's feasible again. I'm intrigued by OMA and Jeffrey Jackson, for sure.
 

Al Stewart

Well-Known Member
May 14, 2017
43
43
83
Peter,
A comment and a question. My comment--I respect what you are doing and I appreciate you sharing the journey with others. My question--before going to David's did you have previous exposure to horn/SET systems and they simply not appeal to you at the time? Forgive me if you were asked this earlier. I didn't read the entire thread before typing out the question.
 
  • Like
Reactions: christoph

howiebrou

Well-Known Member
Jun 29, 2012
1,876
1,732
550
Thank you very much, Scott. I do not yet know the answer to that question. I will likely sell the SME, but we will see. If anyone is interested, please PM me.
If you get the chance it would be great to hear some videos comparing the two with the same arm and cart.
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 7, 2011
7,695
3,202
760
North Shore of Boston
If you get the chance it would be great to hear some videos comparing the two with the same arm and cart.

Howie, I may get around to that once the new turntable arrives and has settled in. It surprises me how great the divide is between those people who absolutely hate system videos and see no purpose to them and others who request them for specifically the reason you do.
 
Last edited:

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 7, 2011
7,695
3,202
760
North Shore of Boston
Peter,
A comment and a question. My comment--I respect what you are doing and I appreciate you sharing the journey with others. My question--before going to David's did you have previous exposure to horn/SET systems and they simply not appeal to you at the time? Forgive me if you were asked this earlier. I didn't read the entire thread before typing out the question.

that’s a great question Al. I did hear a few SET/horn systems, but I was underwhelmed. I think I just needed more exposure and to hear the right combinations set up properly.

My taste and appreciation for what is important has also changed over time. In many ways, I still have a lot to learn.
 

jeffrey_t

VIP/Donor
Jan 29, 2012
2,080
1,449
535
Thanks for the ideas, Keith. I heard some of Jeff Catalano's horns once. Way too colored for my taste. He has great music though. Don't know about the other folks.
Peter,
The Cessero Wagner would be a speaker for you to hear at Jeff Catalano's in NYC. The speakers have all TAD drivers and a back loaded horn. These small horns mated with Tron SET's have excelled at shows with rooms about your size.

While not Lamm, I do believe that the Tron SET's have a similar character. It could be an interesting demo for you.
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
12,539
3,110
703
E. England
Jeffrey, I've heard Cessaro Liszts three times. The second time was with Tron 211s in a largish room, I believe our fearless leader Ron was with me that day. I found the Cessaros unengaging with the Tron amps in tow.
 

gestalt

Active Member
Aug 4, 2019
61
52
25
Nashville, TN
gestalt.audio
Peter,
The Cessero Wagner would be a speaker for you to hear at Jeff Catalano's in NYC. The speakers have all TAD drivers and a back loaded horn. These small horns mated with Tron SET's have excelled at shows with rooms about your size.

While not Lamm, I do believe that the Tron SET's have a similar character. It could be an interesting demo for you.
Jeff is a great guy and worth the trip. If you find yourself in the Nashville area I have Cessaro Wagner IIs, a Tron Atlantic 300B, and a full set of Lamm LL1.1/LP1/ML2.2/M1.2s on display.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tima and PeterA

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 7, 2011
7,695
3,202
760
North Shore of Boston
Jeff is a great guy and worth the trip. If you find yourself in the Nashville area I have Cessaro Wagner IIs, a Tron Atlantic 300B, and a full set of Lamm LL1.1/LP1/ML2.2/M1.2s on display.

Thank you Gestalt. I have cousins in Nashville and they love it there. I should really visit someday. I like your list of gear and will certainly visit if nearby. BTW, wonderful moniker too.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gestalt

howiebrou

Well-Known Member
Jun 29, 2012
1,876
1,732
550
Howie, I may get around to that once the new turntable arrives and has settled in. It surprises me how great the divide is between those people who absolutely hate system videos and see no purpose to them and others who request them for specifically the reason you do.
I wouldn't loose any sleep over it. The difference between the videos after your new found technique was pretty dramatic and consistent and obvious on even a compressed YT video plus it's always nice to see someone's system in action :)
 

Al M.

VIP/Donor
Sep 10, 2013
6,156
1,542
483
Greater Boston
Howie, I may get around to that once the new turntable arrives and has settled in. It surprises me how great the divide is between those people who absolutely hate system videos and see no purpose to them and others who request them for specifically the reason you do.

There is a large difference between
a) a purpose of the large number of videos to demonstrate, or at least suggest, absolute sound quality of a system (absolutely pointless), and
b) the purpose of videos made to show differences between components while shot under otherwise identical conditions (potentially to some [very] limited extent useful, e.g., for showing obvious differences in tonal balance).

This has been pointed out to you many times, Peter, not just by me but also by others. I don't understand why you stubbornly continue to refuse to acknowledge that distinction made even by some like me who hate videos made for the first purpose (and like others, I have been consistent about that distinction).
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 7, 2011
7,695
3,202
760
North Shore of Boston
There is a large difference between
a) a purpose of the large number of videos to demonstrate, or at least suggest, absolute sound quality of a system (absolutely pointless), and
b) the purpose of videos made to show differences between components while shot under otherwise identical conditions (potentially to some [very] limited extent useful, e.g., for showing obvious differences in tonal balance).

This has been pointed out to you many times, Peter, not just by me but also by others. I don't understand why you stubbornly continue to refuse to acknowledge that distinction made even by some like me who hate videos made for the first purpose (and like others, I have been consistent about that distinction).

Al, I fully understand the distinction you are making, and I can appreciate it. There are some people who see some value in videos whether they are used in either absolute terms or specifically for comparative reasons. This group accepts them and values them in both cases. They like and appreciate the cartridge comparisons, the set up differences, etc. They also like stand alone videos of systems as I posted in the DDK visit thread.

The divide I observe is between these folks and the ones who shout that all videos "SUCK". You seem to be somewhere in the middle and that is fine. I am clear where you stand and what you opinion is. You have explained it many times. Sorry, I meant no offense. The videos are what they are, and people can take them or leave them.
 
Last edited:

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
15,576
5,216
1,115
London
Peter,
The Cessero Wagner would be a speaker for you to hear at Jeff Catalano's in NYC. The speakers have all TAD drivers and a back loaded horn. These small horns mated with Tron SET's have excelled at shows with rooms about your size.

While not Lamm, I do believe that the Tron SET's have a similar character. It could be an interesting demo for you.

Pretty poor speaker imo
 

Al M.

VIP/Donor
Sep 10, 2013
6,156
1,542
483
Greater Boston
Al, I fully understand the distinction you are making, and I can appreciate it. There are some people who see some value in videos whether they are used in either absolute terms or specifically for comparative reasons. This group accepts them and values them in both cases. They like and appreciate the cartridge comparisons, the set up differences, etc. They also like stand alone videos of systems as I posted in the DDK visit thread.

The divide I observe is between these folks and the ones who shout that all videos "SUCK". You seem to be somewhere in the middle and that is fine. I am clear where you stand and what you opinion is. You have explained it many times. Sorry, I meant no offense. The videos are what they are, and people can take them or leave them.

Thanks for this, Peter. I am glad you acknowledge my actual position.

Yet in your reply to Howiebrou you painted all system video critics with the same brush. It would be conducive to a constructive discussion to avoid such things in the future.
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
5,052
1,442
453
Switzerland
Peter,
The Cessero Wagner would be a speaker for you to hear at Jeff Catalano's in NYC. The speakers have all TAD drivers and a back loaded horn. These small horns mated with Tron SET's have excelled at shows with rooms about your size.

While not Lamm, I do believe that the Tron SET's have a similar character. It could be an interesting demo for you.
Horning Eufrodites would be worth auditioning. One of my speakers uses the same main driver as the Wagner (Supravox 215-2000) and it has really excellent mids.
 
  • Like
Reactions: timztunz

timztunz

Well-Known Member
Apr 23, 2018
74
31
85
Texas
Horning Eufrodites would be worth auditioning. One of my speakers uses the same main driver as the Wagner (Supravox 215-2000) and it has really excellent mids.
I sure love mine.
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. A place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss existing and new audio products, music servers, music streamers and computer audio, digital to audio convertors (DACS), turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel to reel, speakers, headphones, tube amplifiers and solid state amplification. Founded in 2010 What's Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing