Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

[dminches]

For those Extreme customers that do not opt for the BPS, the DC section of the new power supply system is an upgrade over the existing one in the Extreme. That has already been stated earlier in this thread.

What is the "new power supply section"? I didn't realize there was a non-BPS power supply upgrade option.

 

[Steve Williams]

What is the "new power supply section"? I didn't realize there was a non-BPS power supply upgrade option.

first I've heard of it as well

 

[matthias]

For those Extreme customers that do not opt for the BPS, the DC section of the new power supply system is an upgrade over the existing one in the Extreme. That has already been stated earlier in this thread.

Agree,
I am curious what Taiko Audio will offer as a basic (non BPS) solution for new Extreme customers.

Matt

 

[7ryder]

What is the "new power supply section"? I didn't realize there was a non-BPS power supply upgrade option.

I'd like to know too since I have one on order...I don't really feel like sending it back as soon as I get it!

 

[matthias]

"Next Gen Technology
DC input power supply
The PCB is a DC input power supply enabling the usage of an external power supply. This utilizes GaN (Gallium Nitrate) FETs, can supply up to 11.500 watts, and run cool while doing it. This PCB would be placed inside the Extreme Music Server."

This new PCB inside the Extreme can be powered by the upcoming BPS (or maybe as a less expensive alternative by an unregulated LPS?)

Matt

 

[Steve Williams]

Agree,
I am curious what Taiko Audio will offer as a basic (non BPS) solution for new Extreme customers.

Matt

I thought that Taiko was going to remove the power supplies from all Extreme users buying the BPS and that these power supplies would be used in new Extremes. Perhaps I’m mistaken

 

[matthias]

I thought that Taiko was going to remove the power supplies from all Extreme users buying the BPS and that these power supplies would be used in new Extremes. Perhaps I’m mistaken

This could be a smart solution, indeed

Matt

 

[MarkusBarkus]

...I understood you need to swap the AC/DC board with the new DC/DC board. The source and location of the DC supply was the TBD aspect. Internal. External. One box. Two box. Eventually, details will appear! In the interim...The Switch! The Network Card!

 

[Steve Williams]

...I understood you need to swap the AC/DC board with the new DC/DC board. The source and location of the DC supply was the TBD aspect. Internal. External. One box. Two box. Eventually, details will appear! In the interim...The Switch! The Network Card!

This I remember

 

[godofwealth]

This is an example of non-sequitor logic: plucking facts and assembling them in a way that doesn’t make sense. Perhaps it’s me, but even as an engineer, tech entrepreneur, and speaker designer, this doesn’t make any sense and I don’t see the point. Neither do I see the link between digital file bit depth and speaker distortion!
Analog does sound better. If you think otherwise, you’ve never heard a well recorded master tape or lacquer on a world-class machine. It’s still a fact.
But the Extreme comes very very close, and we know Taiko and team are getting closer with every new innovation.
(Nothing above is meant to be a personal attack - I‘m just calling out nonsense when I see it.)

Perhaps an analogy to digital cameras might help. Let’s say you buy a fancy high end Hasselblad medium format — I used to own the H6D100c, and that’s a monster that I once lugged to London, Italy and Germany and lived to tell the tale. The images produced by the Hasselblad must be seen to be appreciated. But it requires great matching lenses. Hassy’s lenses are mind blowingly expensive for good reasons. It’s hard to make optically accurate medium format lenses that resolve at high megapixel resolutions.

So, to draw the analogy, if you shoot with the H6D100c using a very fogged up dusty lens through a rainy window, how much of the great medium format 100 megapixel resolution are you likely to see? Similarly to make the connection to the Taiko, if you are hearing improvements from using the Taiko on 24-bit recordings, but through extremely nonlinear speakers and rooms, how is this possible?

Now, I’m not suggesting that you’re not hearing these improvements. I’m merely asking if the average speaker starts to distort at -50 dB, how are you hearing the improvements from the Taiko, except if these improvements have audible consequences through loudspeakers. To me this is a puzzle. To get back to the Hasselblad analogy, it’s like you can still tell you took a picture with the H6D100c, even though the lens was fogged up, dirty, and through a window covered in rain and mist. Could you? Hmmm…

 

[MarkusBarkus]

...I have used different streamers before getting the Extreme. I initially tested proof of concept with a RPi connected to my SACD player dac. Have an Aurender here too.

The Extreme and MSB dac is on another planet compared to the other devices I have had here.

So, what accounts for the improvement, using your paradigm? It may be all in my head, since that's where my ears and brain are, but something accounts for the improvement.

I understand your various metaphors, but I'm not quite following your model in the audio realm. That's probably all in my head too. Oh well.

 

[onlychild]

I will be grounding my Switch with the Shunyata Altaira Signal Hub, as I have done for the Extreme and other components. It’s a very impressive solution.

@Taiko, is the ground screw on the switch considered to be a chassis ground or signal ground?

@Zeotrope, are you able to use the Shunyata signal hub with either signal or chassis ground?

 

[oldmustang]

I'd like to know too since I have one on order...I don't really feel like sending it back as soon as I get it!

Sorry for the confusion I generated from my post. To be clear, I don't know that the DC board from the full BPS system will be offered by Taiko as an upgrade to owners who decide not to buy one of the BPS options.

The function of the three boards making up the BPS control sections is explained in post #10,583. I am sure that some time after that Emile mentioned that the DC board from the BPS represents an improved level of performance over the current Extreme DC board.

I used this example (clumsily) in my post about the current Extreme power supply being very, very good but not "the best in the world" and indeed, not the latest state of the art.

Steve Z

 

[matthias]

The function of the three boards making up the BPS control sections is explained in post #10,583. I am sure that some time after that Emile mentioned that the DC board from the BPS represents an improved level of performance over the current Extreme DC board.

IIUC (and if not happy to be corrected) the uppermost board is the new internal DC to DC power supply of the "new" Extreme. This board has basically nothing to do with the new BPS, it must be powered by a certain range of DC power only.

The other two boards belong to the new BPS.

The new internal DC board can be powered by either the new BPS (for highest SQ) or by another suitable PS (which might be less expensive). Maybe it is possible to power it with the power supply of the current Extreme as @Steve Williams mentioned.

Matt

 

[oldmustang]

I'll disagree with you, Matt.

From page 530, post 10,583:

"The top PCB is a DC input powersupply enabling the useage of an external powersupply. This utilises GaN (Gallium Nitrate) Fets, can supply up to 11.500 watts and run cool while doing it. Obviously this is overkill, but overkill is sortoff our thing I guess.

The middle PCB is a BMS (Battery Management System), this allows the usage of a battery pack to power the top DC input powersupply. Why did we go through the trouble of designing this while a BMS is widely available and/or included in virtually every battery pack? Because they sound bad and severely degrade battery supply audio performance to below an elaborate high-end AC-DC supply, that is now no longer the case.

The bottom PCB is a battery charger / controller with a remote control interface controlling the BMS."

(bolded, italicized text mine)

The second paragraph explains that the top board shown -- DC input power supply board -- is allowed to be powered by a battery pack by the second board -- Battery Management System -- which works in conjunction with the bottom board -- battery charger/controller.

So I take this explanation to be showing the three board comprising the Battery Power System (BPS). Nothing in this says the DC input power supply board could not work on its own (without BPS) if given a suitable DC source, such as a linear power supply. However from the post is written it at least strongly points to all three being necessary parts of the full BPS system.

Steve Z

 

[matthias]

Steve,
the uppermost board is basically similar to the Taiko DIY ATX DC to DC board but it is of much higher quality and specs for the Extreme.

This board is as mentioned "a DC input powersupply enabling the useage of an external powersupply". It must be powered by an external power supply which outputs DC into it.

Now you can basically feed it with DC from the BPS for highest SQ or from another DC output PS.

In the case of the Taiko ATX DIY PS it is the advise to feed it with an unregulated LPS.

Maybe @Taiko Audio helps to clarify

Matt

 

[nonesup]

However, Emile himself said in post 10.619 on page 531, that feeding the DC PCB with an external LPS, even if it was the one that is currently inside the Extreme, would not produce a great improvement.

 

[Taiko Audio]

There is no new AC-DC powersupply for the Extreme.

The new DC-DC board has been specifically designed to work with the BMS/BPS as a 2 box solution. We are currently also designing a version to be able to create a 1 box BPS powered Extreme.

The BMS/BPS is not comparable to other battery solutions which are on the market today, as far as Im aware.

 

[Taiko Audio]

However, Emile himself said in post 10.619 on page 531, that feeding the DC PCB with an external LPS, even if it was the one that is currently inside the Extreme, would not produce a great improvement.

Overall even a slight degradation.

 

[matthias]

@Taiko Audio

Emile,
so the new DC to DC PS board is only for Extremes with a BPS and the current Extreme is staying (maybe in a new case) for people who do not want to go for the Extreme with the BPS?
Thx

Matt