Who's buying the UpTone Audio ISO REGEN?

[pkane]

What galvanic isolation do you have between PC & DAC - what is your configuration?

Have you asked Uptone your questions directly? They have a strong presence on ComputerAudiophile forum & specifc threads about the ISO Regen & you are a member there! So why come here with your questions?

Sorry, I didn't realize this was a private forum for fighting with Amir. My apologies.

 

[jkeny]

I assume Uptone Audio has access to DACs and can run tests with and without ISO Regen in the circuit. A test with a few common DACs would be nice, but even one would be better than none.

And you wouldn't have a similar complaint if they used a DAC which wasn't your DAC?
After all, you had a problem with the eye diagram plot from a Lenovo laptop because it wasn't one you had?

"unknown to me USB device (I don't have a Lenovo Thinkcentre)"

 

[jkeny]

Sorry, I didn't realize this was a private forum for fighting with Amir. My apologies.

Now that you realise it's not a private forum of any sort, I'll repeat the questions:
- What galvanic isolation do you have between PC & DAC - what is your configuration?
- Have you asked Uptone your questions directly? They have a strong presence on ComputerAudiophile forum & specifc threads about the ISO Regen & you are a member there!
- So why come here with your questions?

 

[pkane]

And you wouldn't have a similar complaint if they used a DAC which wasn't your DAC?
Afterall, you had a problem with the eye diagram plot from a Lenovo laptop because it wasn't one you knew?

Of course it would be better with my DAC(s) but with any DAC, a before and after plot would be great. In fact, I'd welcome it if they would pick the worst performing DAC to illustrate the effect (or the best, whichever better demonstrates what ISO Regen does).

 

[pkane]

Now that you realise it's not a private forum of any sort

I realize no such thing The question was posted on the CA forum already, where it was not met with a flurry of personal attacks. I posted the request here, in the hopes that Uptone Audio is paying attention and to elevate the original request above the noise. Not sure that was such a good idea anymore.

 

[jkeny]

I realize no such thing

Well you're still here.

The question was posted on the CA forum already, where it was not met with a flurry of personal attacks.

Got a link?

I posted the request here, in the hopes that Uptone Audio is paying attention and to elevate the original request above the noise. Not sure that was such a good idea anymore.

An it's worth repeating the question you dodged before how will a jitter spectrum answer this for you? "The claim on Uptone website is that ISO Regen will deliver "dramatic musical benefits"."

 

[opus112]

I assume Uptone Audio has access to DACs and can run tests with and without ISO Regen in the circuit. A test with a few common DACs would be nice, but even one would be better than none.

You were earlier on talking about a 'jitter spectrum'. You don't think that's a function of the choice of DAC? If you don't do please explain why not.

 

[pkane]

You were earlier on talking about a 'jitter spectrum'. You don't think that's a function of the choice of DAC? If you don't do please explain why not.

I'm not sure why this is such a difficult concept. If ISO Regen does anything in a system where bits are not mangled, it has an effect on jitter. This effect can be measured with ANY quality DAC by comparing jitter with and without ISO Regen. But I already said this at least a few times.

 

[opus112]

I'm not sure why this is such a difficult concept.

I'm not sure which 'concept' you're referring to.

If ISO Regen does anything in a system where bits are not mangled, it has an effect on jitter.

This looks to me like a major assumption. What has led you to believe this?

 

[pkane]

This looks to me like a major assumption. What has led you to believe this?

Give me an example of a non-jitter-related effect ISO Regen can have at the output of a DAC where leakage currents are not an issue between digital and analog and no bits are damaged in transit.

 

[opus112]

What measurement would be used to confirm that leakage currents 'were not an issue' ? Its a terribly vague expression 'not an issue'.

 

[pkane]

What measurement would be used to confirm that leakage currents 'were not an issue' ? Its a terribly vague expression 'not an issue'.

Assume galvanic isolation on USB and Uptone LPS-1 as the power source.

 

[opus112]

'Galvanic isolation' only tells me its got isolation at DC. So I'm still none the wiser about the magnitude of those leakage currents (which of course will be AC).

 

[pkane]

'Galvanic isolation' only tells me its got isolation at DC. So I'm still none the wiser about the magnitude of those leakage currents (which of course will be AC).

Do you have a way to measure these?

 

[opus112]

It depends what frequency band's of interest. 50/60Hz can be measured with a multimeter for example. So what frequency band interests you?

 

[pkane]

It depends what frequency band's of interest. 50/60Hz can be measured with a multimeter for example. So what frequency band interests you?

All audible frequencies, of course. I have measurements at the output of my DAC up to 22KHz. No spurious frequencies from mains or other sources that rise above -120db. Now what?

 

[jkeny]

But you already told us that you have galvanic isolation between PC & DAC - do you not think it's effective & are looking at the ISO Regen?
Or why are you interested in the ISO Regen if it is already effectively isolated?

What before & after measurements at the output of your DAC did you conduct on this galvanic isolation to show this one way or the other?
Care to post them?

As I asked before, what is your configuration?

 

[opus112]

I can't figure out why you'd only be interested in 'all audible frequencies' - excepting mains frequency (because that's coming from high voltage, at least 115V depending on your country) plus its harmonics they're going to be at fairly low levels as the capacitance across the isolation barrier is typically single digits pF. So if you're not getting mains hum audible at the output of your DAC then I reckon its fair to say audible frequencies via the leakage path aren't a significant issue. Just my opinion mind.

 

[pkane]

So if you're not getting mains hum audible at the output of your DAC then I reckon its fair to say audible frequencies via the leakage path aren't a significant issue. Just my opinion mind.

Leakage currents can be of any frequency generated by any device that's connected either directly (e.g., through USB cable) or indirectly (coupled through the ground plane or the mains). There is no hum at all in my system. Checked by ear next to the speaker and by FFT at the output of the DAC.

Back to my question, if leakage currents are not an issue, what can I expect ISO Regen to change at the analog output that would result in "dramatic musical benefits"? Please give me an explanation that does not involve phase noise.

 

[opus112]

You've yet to convince me that 'leakage currents are not an issue' - simply you noticing there's no audible break-through in the absence of music playing is insufficient.

So your 'if' is yet to be demonstrated.

In my limited understanding of the Regen its reduced leakage currents which very much ARE the issue in terms of audible benefit. But then again, my understanding of the Regen is fairly limited.