A world first? Passive v active isolation platforms test

Jarek, audio at this level of enjoyment is part science, part black magic
Fwiw, a few days ago in the middle of the Kuraka trial, I put a cd on and was dismayed immed on how "gloopy" things were
Then occurred to me - I hadn't powered up the Kuraka active under my bpt
On switching it on, order restored to the universe
Despite many brickbats thrown at me for being a sucker for foo (PuriteAudio posting a YouTube video on WBF directed at me pretty much calling me a sucker for investing in "kitty litter" Entreq), I remain confident I'm a pretty astute judge of things - I turn down/choose not to spend, on many more things than I do choose/spend on, and knowing immed something awry re Kuraka being off leaves me w the confidence I know my choice here is made for all the right reasons
 
Just finished a fascinating day's listening to my system w Barry/Blue58
He's always had quite strong opinionated views on my sound, initially finding my presentation back in London to be, ahem, challenged w poor bass and imaging
When I compared my sound at the time to his expressive and balanced 45s tube amps/AG Duos, I really couldn't disagree w him, and had quite the initial inferiority complex
However wrangling my system w Sablon Reservas cables and balanced power, plus Entreq grounding and Shun Mook Giants Diamond Resonators, plus the move to NATs amps, meant that I gradually evolved a lot closer to his presentation, although still not as impressive
Fast forward 18 months later to my new neutral acoustic, quiet power grid, and now uber vibration managing Stacore platform under bpt, and Barry here to enjoy some country air and hospitality, and to give me the benefit of fresh ears and impartial opinion and advice (as impartial as an honest friend can be), w the added factor that his sound has truly gone stellar back in London w SGM server and Oyaide dedicated lines
A whole day's listening later, and Barry really commented on all the things I'm finding so improved esp w the Stacore ie massive drop in noise and bloat leading to fine detail retrieval in particular, admitting things he's hearing not so apparent w his system
And this then led him to suggest some big changes in setup incl Zu subs crossover settings, sitting a good deal further back, and reducing Zus toe in
All leading to greater bass performance, less beaming of treble energy, and better imaging and staging
And this made possible by the Stacore revealing more of the true performance envelope of the system and less obscuring noise
"Noise is the enemy"
 
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Hey Marc, I would like to suggest that you put isolation below your speakers too. I had mine on symposium ultra platforms and gyrotensions to good effect.
 
Alvin, already doing so
Zus on Symposium RollerBlocks on Svelte Shelves
Stacore may have a solution there long term
I'm viewing the whole active/passive isolation as a reflection of my room acoustic, w the most misbehaving part of the equation ie tendency to store and release flr vibns now being properly addressed
The effects continue to astound me, esp w the potential now to sit further back from my Zus and enjoy a more encompassing, less laser focussed, soundfield
I'm having a lot of fun
Thanks Barry
 
Just finished a fascinating day's listening to my system w Barry/Blue58...
A whole day's listening later, and Barry really commented on all the things I'm finding so improved esp w the Stacore ie massive drop in noise and bloat leading to fine detail retrieval in particular, admitting things he's hearing not so apparent w his system

Marc, Did Barry do a direct comparison between your system with and without the Stacore installed? Or did he just hear it with the Stacore in the system? Did he also hear the active platform and compare it to the Stacore?
 
Hi Peter
I could've done an a/b
But tbh I've made up my mind
And this was really an opportunity for Barry to hear these changes in situ
However we did have fun re moving my spkrs
And any potential caveat re midband warmth was answered by my tuning subs in earlier and any caveat re treble beaming by sitting further back
 
A few further thoughts
Stacore vibn isoln IMHO in effect "completing", "complementing", "adding to", the effects of my already uber performing room
Having spent a small fortune on carving the room out of my existing roof attic space, loading eaves floor and walls w acoustic insulation, and a full room set of GIKs, the acoustic was already a revelation
This is the point where I fully got Ked's scathing criticism of my previous London space, and get where uber rooms like M Lavigne's are likely achieving
Despite this, the only remaining acoustics hurdle to jump was a slight nagging sense that a low level layer of bass bloat was holding things back and not giving me full reign on Zu subs adjustments dialling things perfectly
Well, w the Stacore whether under cdp or bpt, this bass bloat is markedly a thing of the past, and I know further Stacore-ing will clear up more bloat, noise, distortion progressively
So now, even small changes in subs settings, spkrs position, toe in, listener position are all easily discernible
I've dialled up the level of my subs, toed the Zus out more, pulled my seat 3' back to 15' from Zus, and I'm achieving hitherto impossible levels of bass depth w agility, and a more immersive mid hall/less tweeter-centric perspective
I really have Blue58 to thank for making me prioritise these
Again, really hard to explain, but it feels like my essential room Achillles' Heel ie vibn prone flexy 35x55 flr is being taken out of the equation by a single Stacore, which suggests additional can only be beneficial
One of the great things about upgrades that really outperform is when you put in a favourite disc knowing it's never broken free in the room due to either poor mastering, challenging room sonics or both, and then goes on to blow yr socks off as its revealed to have so many previously hidden sonic depths
I've just finished up playing Sanguine Hum "Diving Bell" cd and via this Stacore/room effect, its transformed, losing a great deal of its hard sounding earthbound quality
Such a pleasant suprise, and along w room/Stacore combination shining on well recorded music, adds real value to having the product
 
Hi Peter
I could've done an a/b
But tbh I've made up my mind
And this was really an opportunity for Barry to hear these changes in situ
However we did have fun re moving my spkrs
And any potential caveat re midband warmth was answered by my tuning subs in earlier and any caveat re treble beaming by sitting further back

Sorry, to clarify, there was no A/B?
 
That's right Ked
Purpose of his trip was to see/hear where I'd got to after his last visit to me 18 months ago in London
We just weren't in the mood or too bothered to move 85kg plus 65kg on a hot day
His visit to me was like my visit to Divas and Interstellas demos, or to Barry in Essex, or even to you in Central London back in the day, just to chill out, catch up and enjoy some good music
The purpose wasn't to a/b anything
You're v welcome here to do the same thing, bring up some CDs and get some country air
I'm not going to do any component swaps or a/bs when people come over, just swap cds
 
The test CD must surely be Closer by Joy Division for the track "Isolation":D

Marc - replace the 55ft floor with 10 inch solid slate FFS and stop messing around!:)
 
So Justin, you believe in gear caving in on top of my GF's head?
She's long suffering enough putting up w my prog rock w'out dropping in on her unannounced
Btw not just slate w the Stacore, but mixed material CLD, and hydraulic pumps
It's quite the over engineered product

You'll need to bring that cd w you when you visit
You know you want to
A friendly welcome, country air, good beer, and excellent local food awaits in addition to a sound to rival yr Interstellas (I know how much you love tone )
 
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I've known Spirit for almost 2 years and fondly remember his system in his old loft apartment in Hackney where, to be brutally honest, and I was at the time, very disappointed with his systems sound in his concrete shell of a loft. I may have upset him that day but it proved valuable in setting him on the right path to sonic nirvana, albeit an expensive one.
To rapidly jump forward to my listening impression this weekend in his stunning victorian chapel and loft space, I have to say I've never heard the Zus sound this good and in many ways they outperform my Avantgarde Duos, though personally I have a minor reservation. More later.
To help readers who have followed this and many other threads posted by Spirit, here's a couple of shots of his new loft space.
DSC07027.jpgDSC07032.JPG

Initially the sound was VERY focussed and those Zu tweeters were too revealing for me. The soundstage was huge but I detected some phase issues with Genesis, Los Endos, Phil Collins voice very centrally locked but 'in my head' similar to sub-par headphone performance and lower mids standing out too forward. Bass was missing somewhat in action.
With some careful repositioning of the listening chair approximately 3 feet further back and toeing the Zus further out so they crossed behind your head rather than firing into your ear canal helped enormously. This allowed a readjustment of the bass controls to increase the bass without increasing bass bloat and also it increased speed and resolution.
On listening further this morning and using laser guides to accurately position the speakers still further and treat first and second reflection points we both felt we had achieved a significant increase in musicality, resolution and insight into a musical performance.
The system in full flow looks pretty cool with the lights on or off.
DSC07032.JPGDSC07034.JPG
oops!, I forgot to take photos after moving the speakers.

Now, before you all scream about not A-Bing the Stacore, once you see it and the Westwick BPT on top you can imagine what a task it would have been and neither of us were in the mood after a couple of beers. The top plate alone of the Stacore, not in use due to loading limits, was far heavier than I imagined and is heavier than a much larger and thicker piece of granite I have at home. Quite amazing.
I'll add a pic of the Stacore under the BPT which does not do the platform justice. It really does have immaculate fit and finish. I do not doubt Marc's word as to its efficacy.
DSC07029.jpg

Now, just to compare Spirits sound to mine. I am totally impressed with the resolution and soundstage from the Zus and it really does work marvels with his particular choice of music, mainly prog rock and classical. However, I find it a little lacking in harmonics and emotion compared to the Duos but I mainly listen to vocal jazz and singer songwriter plus some EDM. My Duo system does not excel at dense '70s prog rock.
So Spirit should be extremely proud of what has been achieved so far in regards to building his room, did I say it has a wonderful natural acoustic, and in dialling in his system to current satisfying levels.
My hat goes off to him and a huge thanks to his very understanding and lovely girlfriend who puts up with boys and their toys.
Cheers mate
Blue58
 
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Great write up Blue , great space and system spirit...enjoy ....
 
Barry my friend, you certainly told me how it was
In addition to Ked's withering criticism, this all certainly was food for thought
I certainly made up some of the shortfall in SQ before I packed my system up going to NATs SETs, Sablon Reservas cables, Shun Mooks Giants under my cdp, a Westwick bpt and Entreq grounding throughout
But certainly the performance delta was always pretty big to yr Duos
Now you have a caveat w my sound, and I've always had caveats w horns, yr Duos no exception, re tendency to be a bit ungrounded and jittery w flat recorded material like my prog and fusion
12 months of building work, my savings becoming, ahem, a flushed out acct, and a further 6 months sorting out power grid, servicing my tube amps, and getting it all working from scratch, has been a massive stress to say the least
But it's been beyond worth it, and just when I think it couldn't really improve significantly, the Stacore has come along to max out further the big acoustic impvts wrangled so far
Barry was really the first proper critical opportunity for my system, and I was somewhat anxious that I maybe had been fooling myself
But yr enthusiastic response plus suggestions to fine tune further made the experience really worthwhile and put to bed any thoughts I might have had of overselling my changes and resultant sound
However we were v pleased to confirm Barry happy w his sound, and I have no more desire to chuck my Zus out of the window (as I did when I first got wowed by his Duos 2 yrs ago)
Thanks Barry
 
Sure Rodney, cheers
G1 Spirits would wk a treat up here
Might struggle to get them in the space (via 28" wide treads spiral staircase) however
 
28" wide and 35' high, gave me the jitters.
 
Barry, 20' high
Please!
 
Congratulations, Marc! I am very, very happy for you that you have sorted all of this out to a very satisfying conclusion!
 
Thanks Ron
Yes, the Stacore is part of final phase impvts
For me, passive wks better than active
 
Congratulations Marc on moving along your path to musical bliss, and thank you Barry for adding your thoughts and for the photographs. The photos help a lot to put the system and room into some context. Where is the turntable, Marc ;) No worries about not doing an A/B test. I was just curious about a second opinion from Barry about the Stacore.

Marc, how would you rank the following in terms of how each has increased your overall satisfaction with your system?

New room, power deliver, Stacore isolation platform, Barry improving your speaker set up.
 

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