Active isolation, another report

[spiritofmusic]

Any thoughts out there re potential effect of a ballast plate on SQ of component placed above it?
Unfortunately for this trial, the only Minus K BM-8 available in the UK on loan is the "up to 48kg" version
My Eera cdp is all of 7kg, so I need to preload w a 41kg slab to max Minus K performance
I'm thinking of going down to a builders merchants or garden centre and getting a 20" sq concrete or granite block
Any suggestions which material to look for/avoid?

 

[Rodney Gold]

I would spend a further 5 grand on the room/speakers/dsp over isolation for a cdp ..

 

[spiritofmusic]

Room, £50k spent, major upstick, done and dusted
Spkrs, love my Zus, stick
DSP, run a tt, no go

 

[murphys33]

I have been exploring adding another isolation and considered the minus k as it is a lot cheaper. One of the biggest drawback is that the payload needs to be optimum and the center.of gravity centralised. Otherwise it would not be optimum. The 2 drawbacks may be difficult to mitigate. I would now consider only active platforms. But I am watching this space and am curious how Marc's experiment pans out.

 

[spiritofmusic]

The Minus K surely is a Royal pain in the butt re ease of use
W my 32 kg tt, I need 16kg ballast plate to take it up to 48kg limit, and fact that centre of gravity is assymetric means it's hard to get right esp w so little tolerance to reposition
For these reasons I'm cooling on it, and likely to choose straight btwn Stacore Adv passive and Kuraka active (w the option of upgrading latter to active/passive hybrid w addition of Symposium Quantum Signature)

 

[spiritofmusic]

Aiming to fire off funds for Stacore Adv on Tue to finally run straightfwd a/b v active Kuraka on cdp
Will then extend trial to pre, pre psu, monos, bpt
For the sake of my finances I hope compelling results limited to cdp (and prev to tt)

 

[dctom]

Hi Marc

Have you any experience of this isolation unit?

http://www.strattontechnologies.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/100319_Silencer_EN.pdf

 

[murphys33]

I have heard this before. Its essentially an Accurion without auto levelling. It is also thicker and more expensive than an accurion i4

 

[spiritofmusic]

Out of the q for me
Pricier w'out auto levelling
Misses the point somehow

 

[dctom]

good to know

 

[spiritofmusic]

Had quite the epiphany moment today
Tuned my Zus down a bit, subs crossovers 37Hz, level 3/10
Symposium Acoustics steel/Al pucks under cdp
But most critically, I popped the on-loan active Kuraka under my 85kg 8kVA Westwick balanced power transformer
Here the chassis has some ongoing vibration from the massive toroidal coil, and I believe this is where the Kuraka performed its magic
And magic it is
Just a stripping away of yet more grunge that again unless you become aware of its absence would mean nothing to you
This clarifying of the fundamental low frequencies seems to do two big things
Bass becomes less a swamp of energy and more an organic entity leading to music truly having more meaning and emotion
And this apparent lubrucating of the spectrum further up, allowing mids to become more transparent than ever, and highs to sparkle and shimmer w abs no hint of edginess
Communication really shines thru big time, and for my part, it's a final frontier upgrade that I have to consider applying to each component
The consequence of all this is that funds I would have diverted into pricey components upgrades is just not needed anymore, I have the tonal and character I like, and funds now invested into progressive components' active or passive isolation will allow me to truly max out my system signature
Even at my jaded level of audiophile cynicism, this truly is a real eye/ear opener

 

[Ron Resnick]

I am delighted that you feel you are closer to audiophile nirvana! But I just do not understand how putting a balanced power transformer on an active isolation platform is going to result in the seemingly significant sonic improvements you describe.

With a friend it would be easy to check this result in a test blind to you. I would be more persuaded if you were able to correctly identify blind when the active isolation device was on or off by listening to the music.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I am delighted that you feel you are closer to audiophile nirvana! But I just do not understand how putting a balanced power transformer on an active isolation platform is going to result in the seemingly significant sonic improvements you describe.

With a friend it would be easy to check this result in a test blind to you. I would be more persuaded if you were able to correctly identify blind when the active isolation device was on or off by listening to the music.

Amir? is that you? what did you do to my friend Ron?

active isolation does not discriminate about what it removes resonance effects from. it only does what it does. if that item has an influence on the signal path performance, and the system is sufficiently resolving, you will hear it.

 

[adyc]

I am delighted that you feel you are closer to audiophile nirvana! But I just do not understand how putting a balanced power transformer on an active isolation platform is going to result in the seemingly significant sonic improvements you describe.

With a friend it would be easy to check this result in a test blind to you. I would be more persuaded if you were able to correctly identify blind when the active isolation device was on or off by listening to the music.

I think it makes perfect sense. There is massive magnet inside the transformer. Any vibrations will be converted to electrical energy through the magnet.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Hahaha, Mike.

That is an answer to a different question. I have no doubt that an active isolation platform reduces the resonance of everything you place on it.

My question asks why reducing resonance in an isolation transformer box materially changes the sound one hears out of one's loudspeakers.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Mike's right, where's Ron? LOL
Ron, at this point in my upgrading history, I really know what I'm hearing and what I'm not
Shun Mooks shown to be deleterious here, no need for any blind testing
And the same w active isoln
I'm afraid it's just not going to be enough for you to actively isolate yr Io main box, you're going to need to do the psus too
I really wish I could report no positives in isolating non source components
For the sake of my sanity, bank account and poker face justifying these spends to my GF , it would suit me just fine to leave platforms spend at just tt and cdp
But the transformer benefits just as much, which suggests pre, pre psu, Straingauge cart energiser and psu, and monos will too
All swings and roundabouts
These platforms extinguishing any need for me to upgrade components, so overall spend if I go 8 X Kuraka or Stacore Adv w no spend on new tt, digital, amps, spkrs means I remain up on the deal
My GF prob wouldn't put this positive spin on it

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Hahaha, Mike.

That is an answer to a different question. I have no doubt that an active isolation platform reduces the resonance of everything you place on it.

My question asks why reducing resonance in an isolation transformer box materially change the sound one hears out of one's loudspeakers.

'prove it' just ought not to be where we initially start our response to a sincere listening perception.

at least for most of us.

no doubt it is where some/a few/one of us start.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Ron
My transformer is 85kg of vibrating toroidal coil
It hums away like a living thing
Active isoln seems to calm it down meaning maybe less noise or spikes in the supply to amps and hence spkrs
W my room being so quiet and forensic compared to London, these changes are well beyond cosmetic, truly radical
Drop yr resistance to three Herzans for yr three-box Io
It's just a matter of time...

 

[microstrip]

Ron
My transformer is 85kg of vibrating toroidal coil
It hums away like a living thing (...)

This is not a good thing. I am astonished that such an expensive unit hums so terribly. Probably some inexpensive pneumatic isolators and a thick platform will have the same effect, you are dealing with frequencies above 50 Hz. Or just appropriately damping the box.

 

[Ron Resnick]

'prove it' just ought not to be where we initially start our response to a sincere listening perception.

at least for most of us.

no doubt it is where some/a few/one of us start.

Mike, I think you know that I rarely start there. This is a rare exception.

Here we are discussing not vibrations of a source or of a pre-amp or of an amplifier or even of a speaker, but vibrations of a transformer -- which simply outputs electricity. So my hyperbole antenna received a signal.