A world first? Passive v active isolation platforms test

[spiritofmusic]

Peter, the changes here have been so radical, that each seem invaluable compared to the next
Remember also that the comparison to my last room are beyond night and day
New room acoustics > power delivery
When I set up in the new room, I didn't have my dedicated lines installed, and just used El Cheapo PCs straight into domestic wall sockets
On a non optimised system w old set of amps, things were already well in advance of London
So, sub par power, but my room was already dominant as an impvt
And this impvt was staggering, w warm extended non lumpy bass, and smooth non sharp treble, and proper see thru mids for the first time
I would have been truly happy to step off right there
Then dedicated lines, 8kVA balanced pwr, and my chosen US plug Sablon Reserva PCs went in, plus US plug Furutech duplexes
Now a big impvt in bass and dynamics, w the room still facilitating transparency, imaging, staging and overall air
I'd say on balance room acoustics more critical than power, whereas in London where I was oblivious to acoustics (and would have struggled to address this anyhow), power was king
Interestingly Entreq grounding is of more marginal value, again v decisive in London
I believe this is because the power is quiet and pure here already, in London was seriously adulterated, and Entreq somewhat surplus to requirements
Shun Mooks great in London, abs a negative here
I believe because they maxxed resonance band warmth which masked my previous room coldness, but euphonic and counterproductive here
And so finally active Kuraka and passive Stacore trial
Kuraka in final analysis seems a little coloured/unsuited to my room, but Stacore up there w acoustics in its overarching effects
I genuinely believe the Stacore is the final link in room acoustics rather than being a "seperate" upgrade like pwr, and so feels equally radical
And the way I rate it is that room acoustics provide the flow and air, the Stacore completes the effect by sifting low level gloopiness and haze
So room acoustics and Stacore interchangeable/interlinked > power grid
I really can't easily seperate acoustics and Stacore
But if I had to decide, Stacore wouldn't shine as much w'out the room treatment
Barry's set up suggestions Im still taking in, but things much more relaxed and mid hall which I like
So let's conclude
Room acoustics > Stacore >> power grid >>Barrys setup tips >>>>>> Entreq grounding

 

[XV-1]

Marc

Room looks superb and nice and large. btw - why do you use the BPS? 240volt power in the UK should be pretty good I would have thought.

 

[spiritofmusic]

XV, in London I was surrounded by multiple broadband and light industry, booster aerials etc
My nominal 230V fluctuated +/-7% moment to moment
Balanced pwr was a Godsend
It's of less use in my new low population/purely domestic area, but when I bypass it natural warmth and bass heft drops off

 

[Zero000]

A friendly welcome, country air, good beer, and excellent local food awaits in addition to a sound to rival yr Interstellas (I know how much you love tone )

This is not possible. How can the Zus compete with a loudspeaker system conceived by a Matrioshka Brain?

System looking pretty cool from the snaps especially in the dark. Love to come round but that 10 hr round trip...??? Hm. Anyway the GF would love a 10i inch thick slate floor. I doubt she'd hear much LOL.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

thanks Barry, for all the 'hard truth' and support of our friend Marc, and the nice write up.

and congrats to Marc, on all the enormous effort and commitment, and it paying off and getting to a nice point of achievement. a balanced lively, refined sound for 'your' music.

the pictures look very fine.

I am very happy for you, and can relate to life affecting commitment levels as a kindred spirit.

now time to enjoy for awhile and not think too much.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Mike, thanks for the supportive comments
These two Stacores may just be the start
There's a good possibility there will be an accumulative effect here Stacore-ing cdp, pre, monos, even my Zus in due course
The way I see it is that I've got components synergy, acoustics, and pwr sorted, this avenue feels like a bit of a final frontier solution, esp w my overall flr dimensions being 35 X 55, flr borne vibrations must be a major factor, and Stacore is the best solution yet I've tried
Certainly better than active in my situation

 

[Tango]

So let's conclude
Room acoustics > Stacore >> power grid >>Barrys setup tips >>>>>> Entreq grounding

For me speakers and audio electronics aside it's
Room acoustic > Siltech power products = Tripoint grounding products+Dalby ground wires.

 

[spiritofmusic]

About to fire off a second order
This will enable me to put 165kg capacity Stacore Basic PLUS under my 85kg bpt, and test the 65kg Advanced under cdp, pre, pre psu, in turn, ahead of going permanently under my tt in time
This trial will really allow me to determine if the impvts of multiple isoln truly worthwhile

 

[theophile]

Spirit,

Bravo for taking the leap and doing this. I'll regard this thread as the higher expression of what Zog did on Audio Asylum over ten years ago.

My experiments with beneath turntable isolation have driven home to me the absolute necessity of effective isolation. Vinyl is a high res medium when utilised under these conditions. Transformative. Paradigm shifting. Resetting one's understanding of the capability of reproduced music. Literally frightening dynamics with exceptional recordings. True tonality of instruments much, more naturally conveyed. The strong impression that the artificiality of reproduced music was pared away, leaving a more pure unforced relaxed yet more vibrant presentation of the recorded event. Throw in also subtle sonic texture, now unambiguously to the fore. Greater intelligibility of vocal lines/instrumental lines, from the front of the soundstage, to the extreme rear and side to side. Greater musical intelligibility. Ensemble musical items portraying a heightened sense of interplay both melodic and rhythmic. Greater emotional connection with the music. Seemingly more expressiveness of the music. I find that musical items seem to 'last longer' due to one being drawn to pay closer attention/perceive more in a shorter space of time. It becomes very difficult not to stop everything and focus exclusively. No wandering mind. The replayed 'event' is emotionally gripping.

My approach is purely passive. Taking inspiration from Barry Diament. Very difficult to optimise( I say this under an ever evolving understanding of 'optimum'). Worth taking the time if you are very patient.

You have a vast advantage over me, in living in one of the planet's major metropolitan cities. I'd love to find one of the items that you reviewed was being delivered from a close distance. This is the price I pay for living in a nature-rich beachside region of Australia. No cutting-edge anything nearby.

I also want to hear what you have to say about turntable isolation.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Theophile, thanks for the words of support
I'm as suprised as anyone by how powerful the effects of the Stacore is
My tt yet to be reinstalled, so reports on that will have to wait
But w second Stacore winging its way to me, testing under cdp, pre, and pre psu, is imminent

 

[spiritofmusic]

Second Stacore on its way
Time to try the Kuraka active back in the system
So Stacore passive under bpt, Kuraka now on flr under cdp
And unfortunately for my bank balance, isoln is again weaving its magic spell, giving more in addition to the ongoing effects of Stacore
So again a cleaning up and all round improving of bass leading to more intelligibility, a kind of uber neutral truthfulness, just reducing yet another significant barrier to fuller enjoyment
Abs no euphonic colouration, and it'll be fascinating to see when Stacore Adv arrives and I replace the Kuraka w it whether I get the impvt I heard doing the same initially uber bpt
I suspect I will
What I'm sure of now is that this expenditure, steep as it is, totally justified itself in my system but esp w my room and esp flr demands (my 18 X 38 space central on an existing 156 yr old 35 X 55 roof joist structure), and seems to be eliminating any natural energy build up/release, and flexy tendency

 

[PeterA]

Marc did you directly compare the active to the passive under your CDP yet?

 

[spiritofmusic]

Next week Peter
Stacore in transit
Bad news for those like me trying to wrap up audio spending
Good news for those who want to get another elusive step closer to the music
In my room at any rate isolation platforms are truly radical
When Stacore 2 arrives, it'll go under cdp, and I'll test drive the Kuraka for final test under pre, and pre psu
I can really see myself putting all other spending aside to prioritise isolation platforms to all my gear
I hope my GF is not reading this LOL

 

[spiritofmusic]

Two Stacores in the listening room
Moved Stacore Basic Plus to under my balanced power transformer, and now able to a/b active Kuraka under cdp followed by tubed pre, versus passive Stacore Advanced under cdp followed by tubed pre
As with the transformer a/b, I started off with the Kuraka for an extended period under the cdp
And as with the transformer, the results were stellar
A pronounced drop in noise floor allowing baselines to emerge and really give music played real drive and emotion
Followed by a reduction in haze and graininess higher up
True increase in resolution, but no hint of edginess or over forensicness
Everything in its place, but revealed in full technicolor glory
As compared to the Kuraka under transformer, more emphasis on detail resolution, microdynamics and transparency, whereas isolation of the transformer produced more heightened bass heft, texture and dynamics
So, would replacing the active Kuraka with the passive Stacore Advanced under the cdp be as dramatic as doing the same with the transformer?
The answer, yes
Again, a moment of "meh" as a certain warmth is stripped away
Losing bass warmth always feels like a gamble that won't pay off
But again, mere seconds later, it's apparent that a whole set of improvements compared to the Kuraka is apparent, and this is not subtle
First of all stripping out euphonic lower midbass bloom just enables the bass to be truly articulate, and blend with the mids so much more organically
Counterintuitively ridding the bass of excessive bloom actually increases the feel of the bass as it begins much more to resemble live unamplified
This then opens everything further up to allow mids and treble to breathe and sparkle with less cloying from below
The great thing about all this is that it's a facet that brings life to previously over challenging hot mastered and brickwalled cds
Albums like Sanguine Hum "Diving Bell" have always felt strangled in the mastering suite
With the two Stacores in play to complement and extend the effects of my stellar acoustics and power grid, albums like this, while never going to be test demo material, become wholly intelligible and fantastically enjoyable
Truly homogenous wall of sound production melts into differentiated and delineated textures, and the souls of the musicians finally enter the listening room
On well recorded music, whole emotions really come to the fore
So, the Stacore Advanced a total triumph under the cdp, a level beyond active Kuraka
Moving onto the same a/b Stacore Advanced v Kuraka under pre, and it's more of the same
More veils lifted, less noise, more information, more emotion
All with the Kuraka, but a whole lot more with the Stacore
In summary, these changes are not subtle, they initially really make you sit up and take notice
Once that jolt of euphoria takes hold, you will rifle thru your record collection to unearth the musical messages previously hidden, disc after disc
I'm totally hooked, and my conclusion is that Stacore is in effect the final frontier to room acoustics improvements which have been phenomenal here, taking care of limiting factor of the floor contributing to noise floor and the components producing noise/vibrations as well
For me the expense I incurred in the room and what I will do with ongoing Stacores are on the same arrow

 

[Ron Resnick]

That surely is great progress, Marc. Congratulations!

 

[spiritofmusic]

Thanks Ron
Stacore are really onto something v special indeed
To say I was a bit skeptical re their claims that broadband isolation was in many ways more critical than sub 1Hz isolation was an understatement
So imagine my total delight to have my doubts put to rest
It really does seem that their solutions on broadband attenuation are more vital for audiophile applications than simply isolating to below 1Hz in my experience of comparing the two
It's not even subtle

 

[XV-1]

XV, unfortunately we don't have an Australian distributor yet. So the only thing I can offer you
is our 2 weeks trial period - if you don't like it you send it back and we pay back the $$$ without questions.
The shipping will be of course the major factor here.

Cheers,

Hi Jarek

Will Stacore be at the Hong Kong hifi show next month?

Regards

 

[Stacore]

Hi Marc,

Extremely happy to hear that you like what Stacore offers in your system!
V proud to represent the state-of-the-art passive technology in your
(to my knowledge first) passive vs active test. A real honor and a BIG thank you choosing us!
Also glad we stand up to the task. Our objective at Stacore is to clean and disappear, leaving
the listener with his system/musical material as they are. For good or for bad

We have been observing the accumulative effect, or rather the progressive stripping off of the parasitic colorations,
with each subsequent part of the audio chain being decoupled just like you describe. This shows both how wonderfully sensitive our
hearing mechanism is and that parasitic vibrations actually affect all the parts of an audio chain.
In different proportions of course and from my experience CDP's are particularly sensitive. This is a bit of a surprise as they have a whole
bunch of hardware and software error correction techniques implemented.

Also you presented very correct IMHO thoughts on anti-vibration solutions as being a part of a system/room interface or room treatment.
The more I work with my platforms the more I appreciate this point of view.

Again, a big thank you for your trust in us and time for describing your findings,
Cheers,

 

[Stacore]

Hi Jarek

Will Stacore be at the Hong Kong hifi show next month?

Regards

Hi XV,

I asked our fresh HK/China distributor - Alex Gaw of HK-based Ascent Luxury Company LTD - if he will be there and will present us
(his evaluation Advanced platform is on the way). Will shout back when he replies.

Thanks for your interest,

 

[spiritofmusic]

Jarek, v glad to fly the Stacore flag
It may be hard to believe from my words, but I went into the active v passive comparison strongly expecting active to win out
1- the data on sub 3Hz and sub 1Hz isoln suggested it
2- the findings from Mike Lavigne and Christian Rockitman have been nothing short of stellar
3- my week long trial just with the active Kuraka was wholly positive
4- the effort of getting 95kg 20' up my 40 spiral steps enough to make me curse Jarek LOL
------------
So for me, it was a truly amazing suprise for the passive Stacore to be not only better than active Kuraka, but better by a large margin, across more range of attributes, and critically beating the Kuraka at its own game ie even better in the bass, where all the positive reports on active contend its superior
----------------
And a real pat on the back to Jarek and the team for going outside the box, and concentrating on getting the broadband isolation concept right, because I truly believe it's the Stacore superiority here over active isolation that really does make their approach vastly more superior for our audio needs