Best audiophile switch

[kennyb123]

While I haven't conducted any formal testing, I suspect that acoustically, these hollow boards might not be the best choice.

Well of course a $21.99 cutting board is not the best choice for audio. The audiophiles who have actually tried them though, tend to come away with the impression that they deliver one heck of a bang for the buck.

I had been so impressed with what I heard from the various bamboo cutting boards, that a few years back I purchased a Quadraspire rack with bamboo shelves. I was left with a pile of cutting boards that were leftover after that.

That Typhon sitting on the floor was not a component I was planning to purchase. I got incredibly lucky in that a member here offered it at a price I could not refuse. The APTITLIG cutting board underneath it was just a stopgap as I didn’t want to place the Typhon directly on the carpet. I couldn’t be happier with the bang for the buck I got from the Typhon sitting on that $21.99 cutting board.

 

[Superdad]

I had been so impressed with what I heard from the various bamboo cutting boards...

Bamboo is actually pretty good for loudspeaker enclosures also. (Small desktop sizes don't need any bracing, but larger enclosures benefit from some off-midpoint braces of dis-similar material.)

 

[Di-fi]

I couldn’t be happier with the bang for the buck I got from the Typhon sitting on that $21.99 cutting board.

A well-designed rack or board shouldn't alter the sound in any way. My comment is directed at those who use them for that purpose, without really comparing them to solid boards that can effectively stop or absorb vibrations, whether or not they're combined with spikes or other specialized footers. Meanwhile, they put great effort into using footers under other components. It's just an observation to consider looking at things from a different perspective.

 

[Di-fi]

Bamboo is actually pretty good for loudspeaker enclosures also. (Small desktop sizes don't need any bracing, but larger enclosures benefit from some off-midpoint braces of dis-similar material.)

I must admit, I'm not an expert—except perhaps when it comes to also cutting my bamboo speakers in half to investigate. The key idea here is to use sandwiched bamboo panels with large air gaps to prevent vibrations, unlike other panels or boards, which, as far as I know, are solid. These IKEA boards appear solid but are actually not and to some people, they apparently sound great.

I'll leave it at that for now to avoid taking up too much space off-topic here.

 

[kennyb123]

A well-designed rack or board shouldn't alter the sound in any way.

Audiophile tend to seek racks that deliver sound quality benefits. There is no audiophile rack that doesn’t alter the sound because that’s why they exist.

I must admit, I'm not an expert—except perhaps when it comes to also cutting my bamboo speakers in half to investigate.

Might the fact that you didn’t actually evaluate how this cutting board benefits audio limit your understanding of how helpful it can be?

without really comparing them to solid boards that can effectively stop or absorb vibrations

Solid boards ring at their resonant frequency. If you hit it hard with your knuckle you will hear that.

Quoting Roy Gregory from this: “What makes bamboo so effective in the audio world is its structure and the process that allows us to turn what is basically a massive fibrous grass into a flat board. The bamboo itself is formed from long bundles of cellulose fibers, bound together by lignin, a natural thermoplastic resin. The closer to the surface you get, the greater the density of those fibers. The result is not unlike natural carbon fiber, but considerably heavier. Take that structure and cut it into strips that can then be stacked face to face to create a single flat board and you have a random, composite, variable-density material -- which is just about ideal for dissipating mechanical energy effectively without converting it into a single, dominant resonant frequency….”

We are way off topic here so this is my last post on this.

 

[Di-fi]

Audiophile tend to seek racks that deliver sound quality benefits. There is no audiophile rack that doesn’t alter the sound because that’s why they exist.


Might the fact that you didn’t actually evaluate how this cutting board benefits audio limit your understanding of how helpful it can be?



Solid boards ring at their resonant frequency. If you hit it hard with your knuckle you will hear that.

Quoting Roy Gregory from this: “What makes bamboo so effective in the audio world is its structure and the process that allows us to turn what is basically a massive fibrous grass into a flat board. The bamboo itself is formed from long bundles of cellulose fibers, bound together by lignin, a natural thermoplastic resin. The closer to the surface you get, the greater the density of those fibers. The result is not unlike natural carbon fiber, but considerably heavier. Take that structure and cut it into strips that can then be stacked face to face to create a single flat board and you have a random, composite, variable-density material -- which is just about ideal for dissipating mechanical energy effectively without converting it into a single, dominant resonant frequency….”

We are way off topic here so this is my last post on this. Please create another thread if you want to discuss use of a cutting board that you haven’t actually tried under an audio component.

As I mentioned earlier, I will refrain from adding further comments on this topic. However, it seems there may be a tendency to continue the conversation in a particular direction. While you are welcome to guide the discussion as you see fit, I was the one who compared the IKEA board, including cutting it in two. I hope this did not offend any other audiophiles.

 

[audiopro92]

NETGEAR makes great switches.

Network switches vary quite a bit in terms of internal quality and external casework / lifespan.
If you want something that will last forever (practically) go for something that is Cisco Small Business - enterprise grade.
Performance should be identical unless you buy a very inexpensive or defective network switch.

 

[wackerd]

Hello everyone. I will try to answer as best as I can. However, Roy Gregory recently wrote a review about the Reiki Products which goes into a lot of detail. You might find that interesting to read. https://gy8.eu/review/magnificently-minimalist/

Yes, the products are CE certified.

Reiki takes noise supression to the Nth degree. The case is CNC aluminum lined with copper. There is one input and one output and one IEC plug. There are no other holes in the case. There are no LED's. The board is designed to minimize noise. Everything is about miniizing the noise as much as possible. This is an original design. He is not simply modding some other switch.

The switch I was using prior to the Reiki is the Silent Angel NX. This is a good switch. I wasn't sure what to expect from the Reiki but a friend told me I needed to check it out as it was "the real deal". When I plugged it into the system I was pretty shocked at what it did. The noise floor dropped very dramatically. The music picked up a lot of body and smoothness. In my main room I use the Wadax server/streamer. For the most part I listen to ripped files. As such I really didn't think changing things in the network would affect my listening. I was wrong about that. Appartently, noise is getting into and affecting the server through the network. (I guess I should not be too surprised by that.) Playing ripped files sounds better with network improvements and streaming is a whole different thing.

Hello, have you used the original LPS from Reiki? If not which LPS is to be recommended?

 

[sbnx]

Hello, have you used the original LPS from Reiki? If not which LPS is to be recommended?

The LPS from reiki is very, very good. He offers the small iFi LPS as an option that is basically $50. It is ok but the one from Reiki is in a different universe.

The LPS was formerly supplied with a basic DC cable to connect the LPS to the switch. He is now offering a much improved DC cable that is shielded. I have one on the way. I will let you know what the impact is but I am expecting a little lower noise floor and overall better perfromance.

On another note, the Reiki ethernet cable (called the Raku) is extremely good. I have compared it against several high profile brands and the Reiki is better. It is lower noise and very dynamic sounding. It is punching way above its price point.

 

[gionaz]

so it seems that after more than 200 posts there is still no switch that is better than the others! I use a couple of Ansuz switches with satisfaction, I would like to compare them to a M12 gold (you need to find a way to insert the RG45 network cables, maybe there is also an adapter for that...).
more than a better switch it is more useful to use two!

 

[NigelB]

NETGEAR makes great switches.

Network switches vary quite a bit in terms of internal quality and external casework / lifespan.
If you want something that will last forever (practically) go for something that is Cisco Small Business - enterprise grade.

All true.

Performance should be identical unless you buy a very inexpensive or defective network switch.

How did you get to this conclusion? Digitally, yes of course; the data will arrive safe and secure with all the 1s and 0s in the right sequence, none dropped - and none added! If this wasn’t the case, the internet wouldn’t work. I think we all know this.

But the whole point of the audiophile switch, and of this thread about them, is that there is more going on in (and around) a switch than digital. Install one 5m of Cat 5 or 6 before your streamer; then reinstall it 0.5m before your streamer. The sound quality will be audibly better when it’s just before the streamer, but the digital signal will be identical. This experiment works with a Netgear (other brands are available, check local stockist for details!) switch but repeat it with a true audiophile switch and the difference will be even more obvious, the improvement even more self-evident. It’s all about RFI noise.

 

[sbo6]

But the whole point of the audiophile switch, and of this thread about them, is that there is more going on in (and around) a switch than digital. Install one 5m of Cat 5 or 6 before your streamer; then reinstall it 0.5m before your streamer. The sound quality will be audibly better when it’s just before the streamer, but the digital signal will be identical. This experiment works with a Netgear (other brands are available, check local stockist for details!) switch but repeat it with a true audiophile switch and the difference will be even more obvious, the improvement even more self-evident. It’s all about RFI noise.

And clock accuracy

 

[treitz3]

And leakage, common mode noise, jitter....the list goes on. All of which matter to the end result as to what hits your ears.

Tom

 

[sbnx]

Gy8 just published a review of the reiki raku cable. His observations align with what I hear. The raku is quite the streaming cable.

End Of The Road? - Gy8

The Reiki Audio RakuStream+ network cables

gy8.eu

 

[Synaxis]

And leakage, common mode noise, jitter....the list goes on. All of which matter to the end result as to what hits your ears.

Tom

THIS x10000%.

Thank you Tom for pointing out what so many people seem to ignore when they lecture about how it's only "1's and 0's and nothing else".

 

[Superdad]

THIS x10000%.
Thank you Tom for pointing out what so many people seem to ignore when they lecture about how it's only "1's and 0's and nothing else".

Tom--and many others--began to understand this stuff from our paper of more than 4 years ago:
Understanding how perturbations on digital signals can affect sound quality without changing bits...
Just sayin'...

 

[Synaxis]

Tom--and many others--began to understand this stuff from our paper of more than 4 years ago:
Understanding how perturbations on digital signals can affect sound quality without changing bits...
Just sayin'...

I have read that paper and shared that link with literally DOZENS of people and link to it in some of my videos to share with people.

It's a very well-done piece.

Unfortunately the loudest voices online are those who stay intentionally daft about the subject while attacking others who actually have a clue.

 

[sbnx]

Regarding clocking switches with external clocks. It is not a thing. It doesnt mean that you cant hear a difference with an external click on your switch. But it is bot click accuracy in this case but rather lowering the noise that the internal clock is making.

 

[sbnx]

For those that would simply blow off a youtube person, aka Hans B, as not technical enough; Nigel will be thrilled to share his 30+ years experience as a network communications engineer.

 

[Superdad]

Regarding clocking switches with external clocks. It is not a thing. It doesnt mean that you cant hear a difference with an external click on your switch. But it is bot click accuracy in this case but rather lowering the noise that the internal clock is making.

Well I like Hans--and he has reviewed many of our products--but in that video he somehow is not comfortable with two things being true at the same time. His enjoyment of the Network Acoustics filter for some reason made him leave behind what he learned and heard previously and conclude that clocking now does not matter. Here was my response to him in the YouTube comments section 10 months ago:

Hello again Hans:
Alex from UpTone here. Thank you for your efforts and for your kind nod to my engineer partner John Swenson (he was a senior chip engineer for LSI Logic>Avago>Broadcom for 31 years, specializing in the power networks of both large and small scale logic chips, including Ethernet and USB PHY chips).

I watched your current video and wish to clarify one key point. You conclude that clocking improvements of Ethernet does not have an effect--yet you were only showing measurement with the Muon transformers. As explained in our paper (and also in a subsequent one we published about sine vs. square wave clocks, impedance, etc.), the mechanism by which jitter/phase-noise on packet-data interfaces (Ethernet, USB, etc.) has an impact on the jitter/phase-noise at the DAC's master clock pin is indirect. As you correctly point out, it is not about timing of the bits.Rather, the cause is the propagation of ground-plane noise--through all the chips, over the cables, and onto the ground-plane of the DAC. This is the mechanism for why a great many aspects of audio interface variation is heard. We like to call it "clock threshold jitter" and I will explain why.

As you know, most all digital logic chips run from clocks. They utilize the clock by triggering at a specific voltage somewhere along the clocks waveform. But that clock waveform is far from perfect. Even a near-perfect square-wave clock does not have a perfectly vertical rising edge. And since a clock is simply a waveform voltage referenced from "ground," even the most minute noise on that clock's ground plane will cause a "bounce" of the clock waveform. (Visual analogy: Hold your hand at an angle, the base of your palm is the ground; move your hand up and down--to simulate ground-plane bounce--and you will also have side to side movement.) THAT IS JITTER! But it does not just come from the clocks: All CMOS chips themselves are generating noise--which gets put into the ground-plane--and leakage currents (common-mode AC noise traveling over DC connections) is another common source of significant ground-plane-noise propagating through the chain and into the DAC (hence the benefit of optical connectors and extra "filter" devices such as the custom transformers used in the Muon boxes).

So to repeat:
While the jitter/phase-noise from the clocking of interface logic chips is quite different than a DAC's audio sample rate clock, the upstream (analog) voltage effects--propagated through those digital connections--do indeed affect the jitter/phase-noise at the DACs master clock input pin. And it is audible.Hence the benefits of not just the EtherREGEN's very high quality differential clocking circuits and proprietary ultra-low-jitter reclocking flip-flops (running at 250MHz), but also of our unique active-differential-isolation "moat"--which also effectively blocks leakage. It is also the reason why we include he ability for users to connect a very low phase-noise 10MHz external reference clock to EtherREGEN. Many have done so and report positive results. With over 3,300 EtherREGENs in systems worldwide, there is plenty of consensus that Ethernet isolation and clocking makes a difference.

For those who wish to engage in technical conversations with UpTone and its users, we invite you over to the forum we call home:https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/forum/25-uptone-audio-sponsored/

Thank you again Hans, and wishing you well.