Best audiophile switch
- Thread starter Frankie67
- Start date
I don't have the technical knowledge to judge that, but can accept it as true. I assume that proximity has something to do with the result -- that is, keep the clock far away from other circuitry and/or shield it extensively.
But I'm curious about the measurements for noise. Can the various forms of noise be measured and identified, and, if so, how is this done via instruments other than the very sensitive human ear?
If the overall sound signature that is desired from switches is neutrality, then is that "measured" via ear exclusively?
When one looks at the cost of audiophile switches, skepticism can be one obvious reaction. But I'm starting to think of the audiophile switches as a category of gear similar to power conditioning (also pricey). It takes resources to research and perfect these designs (in addition to manufacturing and after-sales support) . Whether they are worth the investment cannot be known except through a demo, like all other gear. Everyone's network is unique.
Back to the best audio switch money can buy, now I am using a Telegärtner M12 Premium, the latest verisone of the famous M12 Gold!
it comes with two Telegärtner MFP8 Gold IE cables, this because the switch is a non-standard adopting the industrial M12 contacts.
It replaces an Ansuz POWERSWITCH D-TC SUPREME, an Ansuz DIGITALZ LAN D-TC SUPREME network cable and an Omega cable from Shunyata Research.
The M12 Premium is connected with the above mentioned MFP8 Gold cables and the standard medical grade switching psu. We adopt a basic configuration.
My digital configuration has various steps, from a router provided to me by the ISP Iliad (I could only transform it into an ONT, but I can not replace it, it will be the next upgrade step) I go to a Netgear R9000 router that manages all the routering and wifi processes, it will have to be upgraded, but it is not easy to find something valid without going crazy in the settings!!! from the Netgear then a first Ansuz D2 switch and from these in the M12 Premium, up to the ROON rock NUC (I'm waiting for the Lucas Audio Lab server) and with TOTALDAC's usb gigafilter inside the first sublime reclock that goes into the second sublime reclock of the TOTALDAC Sublime dac!
Just added the M12 Premium the system's performance improved slightly towards naturalness of sound emission, but after about a week of use the performance was at a higher level than the previous configuration with Ansuz supreme switch and Ansuz supreme and Shunyata cables!
If I had to insist on its sound signature I would speak of closeness to music, naturalness and less digital sound (I was surprised to learn that my system still had a digital component!)
I can say without doubt that if you have the right money, get the M12 Premium, there will be no second thoughts!
it comes with two Telegärtner MFP8 Gold IE cables, this because the switch is a non-standard adopting the industrial M12 contacts.
It replaces an Ansuz POWERSWITCH D-TC SUPREME, an Ansuz DIGITALZ LAN D-TC SUPREME network cable and an Omega cable from Shunyata Research.
The M12 Premium is connected with the above mentioned MFP8 Gold cables and the standard medical grade switching psu. We adopt a basic configuration.
My digital configuration has various steps, from a router provided to me by the ISP Iliad (I could only transform it into an ONT, but I can not replace it, it will be the next upgrade step) I go to a Netgear R9000 router that manages all the routering and wifi processes, it will have to be upgraded, but it is not easy to find something valid without going crazy in the settings!!! from the Netgear then a first Ansuz D2 switch and from these in the M12 Premium, up to the ROON rock NUC (I'm waiting for the Lucas Audio Lab server) and with TOTALDAC's usb gigafilter inside the first sublime reclock that goes into the second sublime reclock of the TOTALDAC Sublime dac!
Just added the M12 Premium the system's performance improved slightly towards naturalness of sound emission, but after about a week of use the performance was at a higher level than the previous configuration with Ansuz supreme switch and Ansuz supreme and Shunyata cables!
If I had to insist on its sound signature I would speak of closeness to music, naturalness and less digital sound (I was surprised to learn that my system still had a digital component!)
I can say without doubt that if you have the right money, get the M12 Premium, there will be no second thoughts!
@PYP,
Since you no longer (?) mention the use of a switch or clock (and possibly ethernet cables, fibre etc.) in your current signature except for a filter I'm curious if your previous observations still hold true with your current system:
NA Muon Pro > Grimm Audio MU2 > Mola Mola Makua > Mola Mola Kaluga > B&W 803D3
Regardless the quality/provenance of a music file, does sq remain consistent, regardless of whether it is or NOT passed through a (best?) audiophile switch, clock, or any other upstream component before reaching the MU2?
In other words, with your setup, do these devices make a discernible difference in the final sound, or does the music always sound the same?
edit:
Grimm Audio suggests that most noise is effectively suppressed within the streamer/DAC itself, outperforming what upstream devices or combinations of devices can achieve. Apparently this noise suppression occurs in the analog domain (not the digital domain), and is further enhanced by a high-quality power supply.
In this context, when considering the role of the best audiophile network switch, it seems to me that while it might not achieve the same level of noise reduction as a well-designed streamer/DAC, it can still contribute to improved sound quality in other ways however an audiophile switch may not drastically lower noise levels to the extent possible by the server or streamer and it can offer other benefits.
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Very interesting thread. I don’t understand a lot of the technical discussions but understand that this part of the music chain is very complex and technical very much more complicated than at least I believed.
My switch story:
First my Ethernet setup: Internet providers router, 15 meter Supra cat8 to a Netgear router which distribute Ethernet to the rest of the house including a 20 meter Supra Cat8 direct to my audiophile switch.
First “audiophile” switch I bough, about 7 years ago, was a Cisco. Made a small positive difference. Bought a second Cisco when installing them in série it made a further small improvement. Then when the EtherRegen came out I bought it. Clear improvement over the Ciscos. So the Ciscos got stored away. Got a good price on an EE8. Was not as good as the ER but kept them in série. ER as the last one. Bought a Farad Super3 to feed the ER. Huge improvement.
Late 2020 I felt it was possible to make even more out of “switches”. At that time WBF spoke very well of the Melco S100 modified by Pink Faun. So went for it together with 2 Super3. It needs two. One for the switch and one for the internal PF clock. After listening I installed the S100 between my Melco NAS and the Naim streamer. As close as possible to the streamer. Sounded better there than before the Melco. An incredible improvement. My wife looked at me and said “I don’t know how much you paid but it’s worth it”. Total cost including the Farad silver dc cables was around 6000 Euro.
Then started forum members to speak of converting to fibre and reconverting back to Ethernet. So bought an ADOT and later a fourth Super3 to feed the ADOT. Thereafter I upgraded the transceivers to Finisar 1318 and the fibre cable to a glass fibre. Both upgrades, the ADOT and the second step with the Finisar transceivers gave an uplift in the sound.
Now I have Netgear -> ER -> Melco -> ADOT -> S100 PF -> Naim streamer. I think I am done for a while ……
During the switch upgrades I also tried some power cords and got surprised of the importance of power cords for LPS. The LPS have Vertere RedLines with upgraded plugs.
So my Super Switch is the modified Melco. I don’t regret it. For sure it would be interesting ro compare it to the Telegärtner or other Super Switches but too complicated for me to do so.
Gunnar
My switch story:
First my Ethernet setup: Internet providers router, 15 meter Supra cat8 to a Netgear router which distribute Ethernet to the rest of the house including a 20 meter Supra Cat8 direct to my audiophile switch.
First “audiophile” switch I bough, about 7 years ago, was a Cisco. Made a small positive difference. Bought a second Cisco when installing them in série it made a further small improvement. Then when the EtherRegen came out I bought it. Clear improvement over the Ciscos. So the Ciscos got stored away. Got a good price on an EE8. Was not as good as the ER but kept them in série. ER as the last one. Bought a Farad Super3 to feed the ER. Huge improvement.
Late 2020 I felt it was possible to make even more out of “switches”. At that time WBF spoke very well of the Melco S100 modified by Pink Faun. So went for it together with 2 Super3. It needs two. One for the switch and one for the internal PF clock. After listening I installed the S100 between my Melco NAS and the Naim streamer. As close as possible to the streamer. Sounded better there than before the Melco. An incredible improvement. My wife looked at me and said “I don’t know how much you paid but it’s worth it”. Total cost including the Farad silver dc cables was around 6000 Euro.
Then started forum members to speak of converting to fibre and reconverting back to Ethernet. So bought an ADOT and later a fourth Super3 to feed the ADOT. Thereafter I upgraded the transceivers to Finisar 1318 and the fibre cable to a glass fibre. Both upgrades, the ADOT and the second step with the Finisar transceivers gave an uplift in the sound.
Now I have Netgear -> ER -> Melco -> ADOT -> S100 PF -> Naim streamer. I think I am done for a while ……
During the switch upgrades I also tried some power cords and got surprised of the importance of power cords for LPS. The LPS have Vertere RedLines with upgraded plugs.
So my Super Switch is the modified Melco. I don’t regret it. For sure it would be interesting ro compare it to the Telegärtner or other Super Switches but too complicated for me to do so.
Gunnar
The price varies by country. Where are you located?
I bought the review sample when I did the first review on it last year.
I LOVE this switch.
I also have the OPT BRIDGE to go with it which takes it to the next level.
France close to Germany. Should have added that I saw the pricelist but didn’t understand what to buy if the top
Since I like simplification, I first used the streamer built into a Mola Mola Tambaqui DAC (ethernet cable straight into the DAC). That sounded pretty good. Adding an optical converter, switches, external clock and associated LPSs improved the sound considerably, but that setup became burdensome to operate during frequent summer power outages which required a lot of fiddling with turn-on sequences, sometimes included the router.
When a Grimm MU1 streamer fed the Tambaqui, I found that the sound improved and by removing the various cleaners one-by-one, then adding them back, I discovered that I preferred the sound when I removed all of them. The cleaners seemed to push my seat closer to the performers, a perspective that did not seem as natural to me. Just a personal preference. Others have preferred this closer perspective.
Later, I saw a video by Hans Beekhuyzen about the MU1. His review told me that he and I shared common goals and listening preferences. After seeing his video about using the Muon Pro with the MU1, I tried it and agreed that it improved the high frequencies without changing the overall listening position perspective. In addition, power outages either required power cycling the MU1 or no intervention at all. Simple and fast.
During an in-home demo of the MU2, I simply kept the arrangement of the Muon Pro feeding the streamer/DAC. To my ears, the improvement of the MU2 streamer/DAC vs. the previous setup of MU1 + Tambaqui was obvious and pleasurable (others have found the opposite). I have not removed the Muon Pro to test if the contribution is small or not, but Hans B reports that it still makes a small difference with his MU2.
Still, I remain curious about whether a one-box switch (custom-built switch, clock, PS) might bring an improvement. I believe this is a vestige of audio nervosa (FOMO). The MM preamp continues to settle in, and as it does the aliveness and life-like quality of the music has me wondering if anything else is needed. Yesterday, listening to the Qobuz stream of the Buena Vista Social Club 2021 remaster (my wife's choice that day) was a nearly completely new experience of a very familiar album. It seemed I finally experienced the joy of the musicians who assembled that day. Truly glorious.
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Thank you for your reply. I understand your perspective—sometimes, it's as if nothing else matters, and you find yourself completely absorbed in the music. In those moments, you’re not just hearing it; you’re truly listening, with no distractions or external thoughts, just the pure experience of sound.
Absolutely, I can definitely also relate to the nervosa Eelco Grimm describes when he talks about the uncertainty of how his streamer would perform at Audio Exhibitions across various (network) setups and with different format files from different sources. It's fascinating to see how he tackled that challenge with the development of the MU1 and MU2. His mission to ensure the same sound quality, regardless of network conditions or file types, really resonates with me.
Aren’t we all on a constant quest to capture the perfect sound, balancing gear upgrades and tweaks to keep music sounding as intended? But there's something reassuring about knowing that, no matter where or how you're listening, the essence of the music remains intact. It's like having a guarantee that what you're hearing is exactly what was intended, free from the variables that typically affect playback. I'm definitely looking forward to experiencing that consistency myself one day and I should shift my focus from discussing noise suppression in networks to choosing a suitable streamer for my audiophile setup
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@Gunnar
Used for USD $3200.00 / 2.890 Euros
There will be duties though
Let us know how it sounds!
Telegartner M12 SWITCH GOLD for High Performance Streaming
For sale, Telegartner M12 Gold Switch for high performance streaming. I enjoyed my time with this state of the art switch’s presentation. Gone were the glare and edge that are often present in streaming. And you get tonally rich, transparent, and detailed sound stage. Once you hear this switch,...
www.usaudiomart.com
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Simple, go to the European distributor's website and put it in your cart!
M12 SWITCH PREMIUM - JCAT . next-gen computer audio
WORLD'S BEST NETWORK SWITCH FOR EXTREME AUDIOPHILES. FREE WORLDWIDE DELIVERY
jcat.eu
this is the Premium version, an upgrade from the previous Gold version
Just when I was going to shift my focus from discussing noise suppression in networks I noticed an alert. I wasn’t expecting this, but it looks like there’s promising news regarding improving sound quality for the XACT S1 server (and other similar servers?).
With a dedicated network switch: XACT N1, it seems we might have a new contender to consider for this thread!
(...)the aim is 6.000EUR, but there might be an adjustment(...)
internals here , but please audition before judging ;-)
Last week I was curious if optimal performance could only be achieved by using two S1 units—one configured as a server and the other as a switch, so I asked Marcin:
Image © : Marcin @ XACT - preproduction unit
With a dedicated network switch: XACT N1, it seems we might have a new contender to consider for this thread!
(...)the aim is 6.000EUR, but there might be an adjustment(...)
internals here , but please audition before judging ;-)
Last week I was curious if optimal performance could only be achieved by using two S1 units—one configured as a server and the other as a switch, so I asked Marcin:
Image © : Marcin @ XACT - preproduction unit
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I suspect most switches would resposd positively to "grounding" boxes. It is all about pulling noise out of the system -- either by hook or by crook as they saying goes.
The Reiki switch also responds positively to some type of grounding box for those that are interested in experimenting.
yes indeed it does, in this case it does it a lot! listening to a succession of tracks on some of them the energy is really a lot, on some high efficiency systems it might be extreme, on most other medium or medium-low efficiency systems this change will be blunt!
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