Entreq Tellus grounding,in england

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Yes very much so Amir
I appreciate the logic of the base unit but personally would prefer the Silver Minimus with both the copper and silver earth cables as I have found it to be much better.
I don't want to appear greedy or over ambitious but the Silver Tellus would be more representative of WBF Entreq users and in my experience there are cumulative benefits the more sources you are able to ground.
I would quite understand if that is too much to ask
 
Please. THis is a non-profit forum. Steve and I paid out of our own pocket to create the forum. He sells products at premium prices and makes money. And we send him advertising. We are not here to protect manufacturers at the expense of our membership. If members want to talk about and criticize products, they can. No amount of "crying for the little guy" is going to stop that.


I know of no such reality. Apple puts out a phone and the Internet goes nuts with "antennagate." The Internet allows high scrutiny of products. That is the reality of it. If your product has merit, you should create marketing collateral that defend it. If you don't do that and have no response to critiques, then what happens is what happens.

P.S. As I have mentioned before, I invented the Internet. I told Gore at a dinner about it and he ran off with it but the original invention was mine.

Maybe if Per were a retired OB or cashed in his chips at Microsoft he would have more transcendent swagger....lol. You guys do this for entertainment purposes and maybe a good tax write-off? If you have a monopoly, you can spew out buggy software prematurely and suffer NO consequences. Please....
 
The Entreq USB cable thread is comical and pathetic at the same time. For the same reasons. What is clearly a low buck USB cable wrapped in a fancy wrapper and up sold for extra money. Yet more people are defending what appears to be fraud than are decrying it. I have seen this in other tear down threads of such gear. In a few cases the furor over the thread which had facts that should have been exceptionally embarrassing for the vendor instead resulted in a few sales. People who swore it was a positive influence convinced others to buy and try with accolades affirming its usefulness despite its flim-flammy method of operation.

Just proving once gain the idea no publicity is bad publicity as long as they spell your name right.

Also reminds me of this:

Mark Twain fooling people.jpg
 
Maybe if Per were a retired OB or cashed in his chips at Microsoft he would have more transcendent swagger....lol.
What do you know about him? This is what he has written about himself there:

"'Mother nature'

“Essentially, I am a farmer and as a farmer you live with and of nature. That is why it’s not strange that you realise what a fantastic builder Mother Nature is. Mankind cannot match her for either precision or suitability. Nature always follows the laws of physics and never puts design before purpose or the relationship with the environment.

[..]

Today I use Wilson Alexandria loudspeakers, Halcro amplifiers and dCS digital products. A large loudspeaker system with a lot of information being pushed with quite a lot of watts, it’s a far cry from my modest beginnings. "


Far cry indeed. I think this is the first instance of taking lessons from farming and applying it to electronics. You think the dirt in the yard could be packaged in a box and sold to people much like bottled water is. The laws of physics are indeed in play just not in the way one imagines without knowing said laws.

You guys do this for entertainment purposes and maybe a good tax write-off? If you have a monopoly, you can spew out buggy software prematurely and suffer NO consequences. Please....
Yup. It is a lot of entertainment to read posts like this....
 
Yes very much so Amir
I appreciate the logic of the base unit but personally would prefer the Silver Minimus with both the copper and silver earth cables as I have found it to be much better.
I don't want to appear greedy or over ambitious but the Silver Tellus would be more representative of WBF Entreq users and in my experience there are cumulative benefits the more sources you are able to ground.
I would quite understand if that is too much to ask
Understood. I have spent too much already this month on the hobby so can't spent the $800 just now :). I will look at purchasing it next month and look for a dealer in the meanwhile.
 
Thank you. I thought it was a fully balanced system also?
Interested in the results of point 5 when you get a chance

MDAC & NCORE can be used balanced or SE. Balance is obviously better than SE for noise, but even in SE the major difference is a small increase in mains harmonics levels
 
so we can blame the entreq phenomenon on falling EU farming subsidies.

if we only were happy to pay more for our veg all this would never of happened.

King Amir it is customary to levy a tax on peasant farmers in order to raise the king's purse.. however in light of the recent trend for the farmers too down their ploughs and seek very creative ways to earn a living i recommend we think again on this strategy. i fear what might be next if we don't...

boiled egg vibration platforms... mother nature knows best!
 
What do you know about him? This is what he has written about himself there:

"'Mother nature'

“Essentially, I am a farmer and as a farmer you live with and of nature. That is why it’s not strange that you realise what a fantastic builder Mother Nature is. Mankind cannot match her for either precision or suitability. Nature always follows the laws of physics and never puts design before purpose or the relationship with the environment.

[..]

Today I use Wilson Alexandria loudspeakers, Halcro amplifiers and dCS digital products. A large loudspeaker system with a lot of information being pushed with quite a lot of watts, it’s a far cry from my modest beginnings. "


Far cry indeed. I think this is the first instance of taking lessons from farming and applying it to electronics. You think the dirt in the yard could be packaged in a box and sold to people much like bottled water is. The laws of physics are indeed in play just not in the way one imagines without knowing said laws.


Yup. It is a lot of entertainment to read posts like this....

In essence natural farmers take manure and turn it into a palatable valuable product. I suppose that fits in this case.
 
What do you know about him? This is what he has written about himself there:

"'Mother nature'

“Essentially, I am a farmer and as a farmer you live with and of nature. That is why it’s not strange that you realise what a fantastic builder Mother Nature is. Mankind cannot match her for either precision or suitability. Nature always follows the laws of physics and never puts design before purpose or the relationship with the environment.

[..]

Today I use Wilson Alexandria loudspeakers, Halcro amplifiers and dCS digital products. A large loudspeaker system with a lot of information being pushed with quite a lot of watts, it’s a far cry from my modest beginnings. "


Far cry indeed. I think this is the first instance of taking lessons from farming and applying it to electronics. You think the dirt in the yard could be packaged in a box and sold to people much like bottled water is. The laws of physics are indeed in play just not in the way one imagines without knowing said laws.


Yup. It is a lot of entertainment to read posts like this....

I am not aware of any conflict between learning from Nature and science.
Happens all the time witness the very recent breakthrough in modifying the body's immune cells to destroy cancer cells.
 
I am not aware of any conflict between learning from Nature and science.
Happens all the time witness the very recent breakthrough in modifying the body's immune cells to destroy cancer cells.
I am not in the medical field. Did a farmer develop the breakthrough you mention?
 
You are being obtuse and I suspect knowingly so
Of course it is knowing so. No farmer woke up in the morning and arrived at the medical discovery that you mentioned by using farming knowledge. And patients started to take said discovery to heal themselves without intervention, research and verification of medical science.

So even if there is an idea here, it will take engineers with real knowledge of said physics to analyze it and figure out the useful element. And once there, we get to separate the good from not so good.

I said that I spent my this month's budget. That expenditure was in the form of buying an OLED TV for $3,000. I can't you the joy it brought to my face to see my photographs with a level of contrast and beauty that i had never seen before. You have an extra $3,000 in your pocket? Spend it on something like that which has easy and direct value.

Hope I am not being obtuse anymore.
 
Of course it is knowing so. No farmer woke up in the morning and arrived at the medical discovery that you mentioned by using farming knowledge. And patients started to take said discovery to heal themselves without intervention, research and verification of medical science.

So even if there is an idea here, it will take engineers with real knowledge of said physics to analyze it and figure out the useful element. And once there, we get to separate the good from not so good.

I said that I spent my this month's budget. That expenditure was in the form of buying an OLED TV for $3,000. I can't you the joy it brought to my face to see my photographs with a level of contrast and beauty that i had never seen before. You have an extra $3,000 in your pocket? Spend it on something like that which has easy and direct value.

Hope I am not being obtuse anymore.

Maybe not but but displaying a modern conception of scientists and appearing to prejudge Entreq.
The earliest generations who discovered the efficacy of willow preparations were centuries ahead of aspirin, ditto foxgloves and digitalis, migratory birds/fishes and human navigation aids to mention a few.
That's not to belittle the achievements of modern science, merely to illustrate my point about learning from nature.
PO chooses for whatever reason to describe himself as a farmer which is then used to denigrate him. Now I have never met him but I don't buy the notion that because that is how he chooses to describe himself he cannot possibly have any real scientific knowledge.
My hunch is he has found something that has eluded others, probably much to their chagrin and irritation, and I hear the benefits every day.
As for your new TV I am sure it is as good as you say from your experience. To date your only experience of Entreq is listening to about four short files provided by Fiddle Faddle using the most basic of the Entreq product range and under difficult circumstances as FF has explained and been entirely open about.
Trust your latest comments won't affect your objectivity if and when you are able to try Entreq.
 
Would folks find value in me testing the starter unit, minimus or whatever it is called?

Yep, that could be interesting, especially if you manage to test it with a few systems (balanced, unbalanced, etc...).
 
Maybe not but but displaying a modern conception of scientists and appearing to prejudge Entreq.
The earliest generations who discovered the efficacy of willow preparations were centuries ahead of aspirin, ditto foxgloves and digitalis, migratory birds/fishes and human navigation aids to mention a few.
That's not to belittle the achievements of modern science, merely to illustrate my point about learning from nature.
PO chooses for whatever reason to describe himself as a farmer which is then used to denigrate him. Now I have never met him but I don't buy the notion that because that is how he chooses to describe himself he cannot possibly have any real scientific knowledge.
My hunch is he has found something that has eluded others, probably much to their chagrin and irritation, and I hear the benefits every day.
As for your new TV I am sure it is as good as you say from your experience. To date your only experience of Entreq is listening to about four short files provided by Fiddle Faddle using the most basic of the Entreq product range and under difficult circumstances as FF has explained and been entirely open about.
Trust your latest comments won't affect your objectivity if and when you are able to try Entreq.

I dont think he is being denigrated, its a valid point. Whilst I dont think being a farmer and an electrical/electronic engineer is mutually exclusive, I do wonder what his expertise and experience in this area is. Why would he describe himself as a farmer when, if he is an experienced electrical/electronic engineer, that would be the relevant way to describe himself?

I dont think he has stumbled on anything. The product joins equipment grounds together. This is not new, it is not special. The kitty litter and precious metals are a complete red herring and for the purpose of marketing and justifying higher costs and margins - which are already stellar.
 
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I dont think he has stumbled on anything. The product joins equipment grounds together.

It deals with signal 'grounding', it doesn't 'join equipment grounds together'.

This is not new, it is not special.

Yet you say it doesn't work?
 
It deals with signal 'grounding', it doesn't 'join equipment grounds together'.



Yet you say it doesn't work?

Thats pedantry in the extreme. You know precisely what I was referring to. So "dealing" is the new term for "joining"?

Actually if you have paid attention to my posting you will find what I have said is that it doesnt do anything over what can be achieved with cheap ordinary cable and a connector block. Also that if it is necessary you need to be looking at a more fundamental level at the (signal :rolleyes:) grounding regime in your system as it is obviously deficient. You should be asking "why do I need this"? Your equipment clearly isnt effectively performing a pretty fundamental function.

As an aside, most wont know if they have a noise issue anyway. Without measurement most wont know if the Entrail has made this better or worse or no different. Yet Im sure they will convince themselves its a massive improvement, especially after spending thousand of $ on it.... ;)
 
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My hunch is he has found something that has eluded others, probably much to their chagrin and irritation, and I hear the benefits every day.
Let's talk about what we hear.

I am home sick while working at Microsoft and managing the audio group among others. Someone gave me a file that did not encode well with WMA codec. I go to my team and ask them if we can improve it. They said they had a new psychoacoustics model in the encoder that might. They give me the new encoder and it makes some difference but still the problems remain. I go back to the manager of the team and say we still not there. He said they were a lot of tunable variables and it was still work in progress. I said I am home sick with nothing to do so give me the parameters and I will optimize them.

I get the encoder and it has a dozen or so floating point parameters to mess with. I zoom into a few of them and start encoding and doing before and after testing, all sighted. I optimize the one number and notice that if I changed the fractions, it too would make things better or worse. Make a long story short, during a full week of listening I optimize the values down to 4 or 5 decimal places. Just changing 1.29485 to 1.29484 would change the sound.

I gave my results to my guy and he is very surprised. In the nicest tone he can he says that none of those fractions are used! I say no way. I can hear the difference down to so many decimal places and what I have now is far, far better than what I started with. He says fine and goes away for a day and then sends me two sets of files and asks me which one is better. I tell him one set was a lot worse. He turns around and tells me that was the set that I had "optimized!" Not only did the fractions make no difference but the decimal values were so wrong as to completely screw up the encoder.

He proceeds to give me two new sets of files. I find one set better and he says that was the results of them optimizing the same parameters. This was the time I decide I need to resign from doing the testing for the audio team :).

The process PO has followed is just like what I did with the encoder. He had some "idea," built the box and the sound improved to his ears. He makes one and gives it to others and they too hear improvements. So he convinces himself he is on the right track and builds a few more variations, and the more expensive and fancy the components, the better it sounds. So he puts those on sale and positive reports of those materialize too. There is no doubt in my mind that you and others "hear" these improvements.

The issue is that unlike me, you have not had a way to have that assumption validated. And that such validation may show no improvement or as it was in my case a detriment. We have processes and systems in place to do that both subjectively and objectively. We must embrace them to get to the truth to know if we are better off buying an OLED TV or a plywood box for the same price. Anyone who seems harm in this puts more value on their ego being bruised than serving fellow members. More information and validation can't possibly be bad.

And yes, I will evaluate the box when I get it and test any hypothesis people have for why it might make an improvement.
 
I just saw one of the graphs Amir posted and now can't find it again - looks like I missed in during the flurry of messages posted while I was away for a day or two. Anyway, I found it really interesting because of the asymmetry between low frequency and high frequencies in the graph because the purported goal of the device by P is that it somehow deals with high-frequency noise or currents (can't remember his precise words but I believe it could be in one of his videos).

Now, the intriguing part of the graph is the high-frequency part because it doesn't seem to correlate with the purported goal.

The question here would be whether part of its appeal is 'euphonic' to the detriment of accuracy.
 
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