In wall power cabling advice
- Thread starter NZS
- Start date
...I assumed he "meant" system. That said, my kid sis can get noisy if she gets into the chardonnay too early, so I never invite her into the music room come holiday season, or I'd be listening to The Bay City Rollers all afternoon.
Not even remotely close for a typo... Stupid auto correct.
And no... My sister has never been quiet ever....
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
I don't think you're overthinking things. Rather, I suspect you're really just hoping to perform some due diligence and that's what a performance-oriented industry is all about, right?Hello to all,
This is my first post on your site, after being recommended from another audio site I am registered with, that there may be some people on here with knowledge of in wall wiring.
Emailing cable manufactures and searching on the internet, I haven't being having much luck with information in regard to in wall power wiring as opposed to front of wall power, which is well resourced
The 2 links below had been recommended with helpful knowledge, but doesn't delve into the cables as such.
Electrical System Optimization - Shunyata Research 6
Support
Support documents and RMA information. High-res media downloads. FAQ's. Product Manuals.www.msbtechnology.com
The choice for a mains cable type has unearthed more choices than I expected.
Here, the standard building compliant 240 volt residential mains cable is 7 strand but can be sourced in 3 or up to around 50+ strands.
Does the amount of strands on a 6mm (9 AWG) cable for audio matter?
Does more or less strands have any advantages or disadvantages?
Cable sheath material for in wall cabling?
Advantages/disadvantages in this use?
I will retro fit 2 dedicated mains cables of equal length with a run of approx. 8 metres (24-25') and will keep these apart as much as possible
I could be over thinking this and the various types of in wall mains cable construction choices may or may not make much difference, hence why I can’t find much information.
Any help greatly appreciated. Thanks.
In-wall cabling comparisons I imagine would be rather difficult to properly discern what's best since it's not so easy to swap out for A/B comparisons. For example. Some of us know that electrical wire vibrates when current is flowing. Some of us have reason to think this vibration may harm sonics small or great. IOW, it may not be just what model and/or gauge of house wiring to select but how it's installed / mounted.
Since 2005, I've been having all of my cabling (and other electrical objects) regardless of type cryo-treated and starting in 2006 double-cryo'ed for even greater sonic benefits. But all those cryo-treatments were done via the inferior vapor method. In 2014, I was exposed to the superior full-immersion method and since then I've been having all my cabling cryo-treated via the superior full-immersion method.
In 2002 a friend had some custom 99.99% solid core oxygen-free-copper10g house wiring fabricated and had some extra that I purchased and used for several dedicated lines. At that time being rather new to the hobby I didn't notice any sonic differences over standard solid-core house wiring but I was still glad to have it. But in 2003 we moved and I brought it with me but it's too short so it remains in storage.
In 2007, I remodeled my old kitchen to become my new listening room and since all I knew at that time was cryo-treating via the more popular but also more inferior vapor method I purchased two rolls of 250ft 12g and 14g solid-core Romex (house wiring) from the local hardware store and shipped it out for double-cryo-treatment. Did it make a difference? Darned if I know because it was a new room and also had new speakers so there was no way of me discerning a difference. But knowing what double-cryo-treating via the vapor method did for all of my other cables, outlets, fuses, plugs, inlets, connectors, etc, I knew I was performing some reasonable due diligence to have that done and I'm still glad I did.
I've also had limited experience comparing 10, 12, and 14 gauge house wiring and as a result I really don't care much which gauge I go with but since I do have some 20 amp dedicated circuits/lines, 12 gauge ought to satisfy my needs everywhere and there's an abundance of it.
That said, based on my limited experience as of today, if I were building out a new room I would probably just go with the best solid-core 12 gauge house wiring I could afford, have it cryo-treated via the superior full-immersion method, and ensure the installer ran it taut and also had it rigidly secured every reasonable step of the way. Assuming the studs are open and accessible (no drywall) this might include having horizontal 2x4's anchored between every vertical 2x4 (or 2x6) such that the house wiring runs could be sufficiently anchored all the way to the wall outlets to minimize potential vibrations when current is flowing through the house wiring.
Having done those few things, I'd walk away satisfied that I performed sufficient-enough due diligence in the house wiring sector. But also knowing/realizing that the AC coming in from the street and flowing into and through the components to the speakers is still quite dirty/noisy and there is still much to be done elsewhere along the entire patch of electric current flow.
IOW, conquering the house wiring is not the end to superior electrical mgmt but only the beginning. And it sounds like you're certainly on the right path.
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I thought I’d share a short update of my findings with the in wall mains cables I installed.
Firstly, thank you to who kindly gave their words to date on this thread.
Do I think that a dedicated mains line is worth while, an unequivocally YES.
The effect of these 6mm dedicated in wall cables is not a subtle effect. I would say regardless of the usual disclaimers the effect would be noticeable.
The sound has impact, authority, muscle and power to the overall scale, even from the onset.
At the mains switchboard, each cable is connected to an individual 20 amp circuit breaker, that are connected to an RCD (Residual Current Device).
The cables are terminated individually at the wall via 2 x 2 auto (i.e. no on\off switches) double wall socket points.
There were other methods and materials suggested that could also of enhance the sound, but I choose to conform to within the NZ Electrical Standards.
The initial results below, are reference to the Amp and DAC after approx. 80 hours. The other components not as yet.
Nothing scientifically tested, only swapping different power cords combinations between the different wall sockets and listening.
Installing four different 6mm (9 AWG) circular TPS (Thermo-Plastic Sheathed) cables with each cable measuring 8.0m (approx. 26’) in length.
A- https://www.firstflex.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/HDT.pdf
This 190 stranded cable has very good clarity in the mid to high range, modestly better than cables B & D, not harsh or bright, but at the expense of the lower end.
The sound was better with the DAC connected rather than the Amp.
B- https://www.tycab.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/BMM37104.pdf
This 7 stranded cable (Model #37104) and cable D are very close to each other.
These cables faired a lot better in overall sound than cable A from low to high.
Both of these two cables worked as equally well on both the Amp and DAC.
C- https://express.ecsnz.com/downloads/LAPP/CAT2018_2019/LAPP-Main-Catalogue-2018-19 _ 41.pdf
This multi stranded screened 4 core cable (model #1135604) is the pick of the four cables, noticeable. It is equal in the low and high end (possibly slightly better?) of Cable B & D but the mid range has so much more.
The mid range had more presence, weight and clarity. This cable worked equally as good on both the Amp and DAC.
With only one of the two components being able to be plugged into this, the combination of the DAC connected to this cable and the AMP plugged into Cable D worked better overall than visa versa.
D- https://express.ecsnz.com/downloads/lapp/ECS Product Selection Guide 2022-Q4 24.pdf
Model #3803843. As for Cable B
Components connected to date;
Cable A- Antipodes S60
Cable B- Antipodes K30
Cable C- Denafrips Terminator II DAC
Cable D- Kinki Studios Amp
Firstly, thank you to who kindly gave their words to date on this thread.
Do I think that a dedicated mains line is worth while, an unequivocally YES.
The effect of these 6mm dedicated in wall cables is not a subtle effect. I would say regardless of the usual disclaimers the effect would be noticeable.
The sound has impact, authority, muscle and power to the overall scale, even from the onset.
At the mains switchboard, each cable is connected to an individual 20 amp circuit breaker, that are connected to an RCD (Residual Current Device).
The cables are terminated individually at the wall via 2 x 2 auto (i.e. no on\off switches) double wall socket points.
There were other methods and materials suggested that could also of enhance the sound, but I choose to conform to within the NZ Electrical Standards.
The initial results below, are reference to the Amp and DAC after approx. 80 hours. The other components not as yet.
Nothing scientifically tested, only swapping different power cords combinations between the different wall sockets and listening.
Installing four different 6mm (9 AWG) circular TPS (Thermo-Plastic Sheathed) cables with each cable measuring 8.0m (approx. 26’) in length.
A- https://www.firstflex.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/HDT.pdf
This 190 stranded cable has very good clarity in the mid to high range, modestly better than cables B & D, not harsh or bright, but at the expense of the lower end.
The sound was better with the DAC connected rather than the Amp.
B- https://www.tycab.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/BMM37104.pdf
This 7 stranded cable (Model #37104) and cable D are very close to each other.
These cables faired a lot better in overall sound than cable A from low to high.
Both of these two cables worked as equally well on both the Amp and DAC.
C- https://express.ecsnz.com/downloads/LAPP/CAT2018_2019/LAPP-Main-Catalogue-2018-19 _ 41.pdf
This multi stranded screened 4 core cable (model #1135604) is the pick of the four cables, noticeable. It is equal in the low and high end (possibly slightly better?) of Cable B & D but the mid range has so much more.
The mid range had more presence, weight and clarity. This cable worked equally as good on both the Amp and DAC.
With only one of the two components being able to be plugged into this, the combination of the DAC connected to this cable and the AMP plugged into Cable D worked better overall than visa versa.
D- https://express.ecsnz.com/downloads/lapp/ECS Product Selection Guide 2022-Q4 24.pdf
Model #3803843. As for Cable B
Components connected to date;
Cable A- Antipodes S60
Cable B- Antipodes K30
Cable C- Denafrips Terminator II DAC
Cable D- Kinki Studios Amp
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