That's great. Are the more reasonably priced Sylvania 5687-GB Gold Brand Black Plates NOS or CFS 5687wa Black Plates, Grid gold, Copper Rods NOS tubes the same quality as the original Bendix 6900 which generally run EXPENSIVE ($500-$2000 each)? I could try the Sylvania or CFS if it is sonically equivalent to the originals.
Introducing the LampizatOr Poseidon DAC
- Thread starter Lukasz "Lampizator" Fikus
- Start date
Thanks. So, still available?no they are 6900
it was Lukasz favorite for signal
Lampizator announcement: launch of our all new TOTL HORIZON DAC
Probably the least important thing to consider when auditioning new gear. As it was phrased so well in the movie Beauty and the Beast as well as Lukasz in an earlier post above ....."Beauty comes from within" Maybe that's why I listen with lights out so that I am not distracted by looking at the...whatsbestforum.com
Hello,
I'm a new owner of a Lampizator Poseidon. I'm delighted.
I have an Innuos Statement server.
I'm looking for advice on the USB cable.
Thank you.
I'm a new owner of a Lampizator Poseidon. I'm delighted.
I have an Innuos Statement server.
I'm looking for advice on the USB cable.
Thank you.
I have the latest Sablon, along with a handful of other in the $1-2k range with my Poseidon (and other great dacs), and I easily prefer this USB from Audio Sensibility. Of course, YMMV, as cables are very system dependent/personal preference.
I can make the strong recommendation for Final Touch Audio, either the Callisto or, if budget allows, the SiNOPE. We frequently show with Innous (as recently as the South West AudioFest last week actually...) and use this between our devices as the best we've heard.
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I thought I’d share a recent experience I had with the Lampi Poseidon DAC. A few months ago, I had to return my Horizon 360 to Lampizator for some modifications. Fred Ainsley was kind enough to lend me a Poseidon he had on hand so I wouldn’t go into music withdrawal. I’m based in NJ and Fred is on Long Island which was a nice convenience as it’s a reasonable drive by car which allowed for an easy pick-up and no need for an expensive shipping service. Since I have an Olympus server, I was able to use the Taiko XDMI output (via a special KBL cable) to drive the Poseidon. Since the Olympus is not yet widely available, I am probably one of only a few who have experienced the Poseidon/Olympus combo using the XDMI cable. Fred was very generous in allowing me to use the Poseidon for about a month, so I think I have a good handle on its performance.
If you have or are considering a Poseidon and have an Olympus with the XDMI, you will be absolutely delighted with this combination. Sonically, I was extremely impressed with the Poseidon/XDMI linked Olympus. Value wise, the Poseidon/HDMI is off the charts. The obvious question to ask is- does it sound as good as the Horizon360? Honestly, nobody should expect the Poseidon, at about half the price of the Horizon, to sound equivalent. The better question to a consider is not if it sounds “as good”, but rather, is it as musically compelling and satisfying? The answer is unquestionably yes. The main differences between the units are mainly the degree of refinement that the H360 provides, which shouldn’t surprise anyone. But in the Poseidon, what Lampi has done is provide an astounding DAC that offers an extremely high degree of sonic equivalence magic at about half the price of the H360. In my book, that’s a hell of an accomplishment. Put another way, I certainly didn’t go into musical withdrawal while my Horizon was off my shelf for a month as the Poseidon is a superb instrument that is so musically compelling, that any craving for more was just not present. There isn’t a genre of music that the Poseidon doesn’t do well. In fact, very well. Put more directly, I didn’t feel I was missing much of anything while my H360 was in service. The Poseidon is just eminently satisfying and damn good.
A few miscellaneous comments. First, the thing is built very well. Yes, its lighter than the H360 most likely due to more modest transformers, but it’s very solid. In fact, to be honest, I was surprised that since it came with a substantial aluminum top plate, it actually had less spurious vibrations than my copper top Horizon. I didn’t see that coming and it was an unexpected perk. Next, I can’t say enough about the stock tube set that Lukasz provides with the Poseidon. While many of us have spent a long-time optimizing tubes for their Horizons, my sense is that for the Poseidon, any buyer can have great confidence that the factory supplied tubes are a “set it and forget it” affair. Lukasz did the work. Take advantage of it. I was particularly impressed by the Svetlana 5Y3 rectifier that can easily be found for about $18 each. (I bought 2 although paradoxically, they don’t work as well in my H360 as they do in the Poseidon. Not sure why, but who cares? In the Poseidon, they're outstanding and allows the Poseidon to show off the excellent dynamics that it’s capable of achieving.) Bottom line, it's just so nice to find a great tube sounding products that sounds great with stock tubes. No uber tubes are needed.
The attraction of the Poseidon using a good USB cable is obvious, but it simply must be said that once you use the XDMI link, the performance was elevated beyond my expectations (and is similar to what I found with the H360). For me, the biggest benefit was the clarity and transparency of the top end, which has what one might call analog qualities that simply cannot be reproduced by using a USB or AES/EBU connection. It delivers sound with the ease that is very reminiscent of real instruments. It is truly fortunate that Lukasz has taken advantage of Emile’s proprietary XDMI link to offer this commercial opportunity at such an approachable price. This, in my view, is the raison d’etre for acquiring this remarkable technology. Yes, I know in Taiko land, the built-in XDMI enabled DAC board is all the rage, but if you are committed to a tube DAC for whatever reason (overall system sound etc. or you just like to watch your electronics glow in the dark), the XDMI connection is a genuine revelation. That Lampi managed to enable this in an excellent sounding DAC at the price of the Poseidon, is a genuine accomplishment.
In high end audio, one thing that becomes apparent to every hobbyist who has done this for a few years, is that there is always something better out there (although not nearly as many as the reviewers would like you to believe). But when something comes along that delivers incredibly good music reproduction as the Poseidon/XDMI link does at this price, I doubt you will be spending your listening time wondering what you are missing by not buying one of those $350K server/DACs that are now becoming more abundant. Many listeners will simply not need more than the Poseidon or may seek to invest elsewhere (such as their room) to gain the most sonic improvement and enjoyment for the buck. One thing is for certain. The Poseidon with the built-in XDMI link is a very impressive plug and play product right out of the box.
If you have or are considering a Poseidon and have an Olympus with the XDMI, you will be absolutely delighted with this combination. Sonically, I was extremely impressed with the Poseidon/XDMI linked Olympus. Value wise, the Poseidon/HDMI is off the charts. The obvious question to ask is- does it sound as good as the Horizon360? Honestly, nobody should expect the Poseidon, at about half the price of the Horizon, to sound equivalent. The better question to a consider is not if it sounds “as good”, but rather, is it as musically compelling and satisfying? The answer is unquestionably yes. The main differences between the units are mainly the degree of refinement that the H360 provides, which shouldn’t surprise anyone. But in the Poseidon, what Lampi has done is provide an astounding DAC that offers an extremely high degree of sonic equivalence magic at about half the price of the H360. In my book, that’s a hell of an accomplishment. Put another way, I certainly didn’t go into musical withdrawal while my Horizon was off my shelf for a month as the Poseidon is a superb instrument that is so musically compelling, that any craving for more was just not present. There isn’t a genre of music that the Poseidon doesn’t do well. In fact, very well. Put more directly, I didn’t feel I was missing much of anything while my H360 was in service. The Poseidon is just eminently satisfying and damn good.
A few miscellaneous comments. First, the thing is built very well. Yes, its lighter than the H360 most likely due to more modest transformers, but it’s very solid. In fact, to be honest, I was surprised that since it came with a substantial aluminum top plate, it actually had less spurious vibrations than my copper top Horizon. I didn’t see that coming and it was an unexpected perk. Next, I can’t say enough about the stock tube set that Lukasz provides with the Poseidon. While many of us have spent a long-time optimizing tubes for their Horizons, my sense is that for the Poseidon, any buyer can have great confidence that the factory supplied tubes are a “set it and forget it” affair. Lukasz did the work. Take advantage of it. I was particularly impressed by the Svetlana 5Y3 rectifier that can easily be found for about $18 each. (I bought 2 although paradoxically, they don’t work as well in my H360 as they do in the Poseidon. Not sure why, but who cares? In the Poseidon, they're outstanding and allows the Poseidon to show off the excellent dynamics that it’s capable of achieving.) Bottom line, it's just so nice to find a great tube sounding products that sounds great with stock tubes. No uber tubes are needed.
The attraction of the Poseidon using a good USB cable is obvious, but it simply must be said that once you use the XDMI link, the performance was elevated beyond my expectations (and is similar to what I found with the H360). For me, the biggest benefit was the clarity and transparency of the top end, which has what one might call analog qualities that simply cannot be reproduced by using a USB or AES/EBU connection. It delivers sound with the ease that is very reminiscent of real instruments. It is truly fortunate that Lukasz has taken advantage of Emile’s proprietary XDMI link to offer this commercial opportunity at such an approachable price. This, in my view, is the raison d’etre for acquiring this remarkable technology. Yes, I know in Taiko land, the built-in XDMI enabled DAC board is all the rage, but if you are committed to a tube DAC for whatever reason (overall system sound etc. or you just like to watch your electronics glow in the dark), the XDMI connection is a genuine revelation. That Lampi managed to enable this in an excellent sounding DAC at the price of the Poseidon, is a genuine accomplishment.
In high end audio, one thing that becomes apparent to every hobbyist who has done this for a few years, is that there is always something better out there (although not nearly as many as the reviewers would like you to believe). But when something comes along that delivers incredibly good music reproduction as the Poseidon/XDMI link does at this price, I doubt you will be spending your listening time wondering what you are missing by not buying one of those $350K server/DACs that are now becoming more abundant. Many listeners will simply not need more than the Poseidon or may seek to invest elsewhere (such as their room) to gain the most sonic improvement and enjoyment for the buck. One thing is for certain. The Poseidon with the built-in XDMI link is a very impressive plug and play product right out of the box.
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My thoughts concerning the stock tubes are the same. Especially when I plug in my analog into the Poseidon as the pre-amp. Are you using the Poseidon as the pre-amp or are you sending the DAC signal to a separate pre-amp? I find that even playing CDs through either the SPDIF or AES cables the highs and bass are phenomenal. When you use the Horizon, is it through a separate pre-amp or directly into your amps?
I bypassed the preamp sections of both the Poseidon and the H360 and rely on my 727 preamp for gain to my amps.
Hi @marty, what's not fully clear to me: have you been able to compare Poseidon over XDMI vs. Horizon 360 over XDMI?
Well, I heard the original Horizon and it doesn't have nearly as engaging pre-amp section as the Poseidon (I heard it with a separate pre-amp and the Horizon was unbelievably super dynamic). The Soulution 727 is a highly articulate and transparent sounding pre-amp. I am more interested in a warmer, more organic sound like the Poseidon (which works great with analog inputs but everyone appears to recommend a separate pre-amp for the DAC), possibly the Westminster Labs Quest which is said to have a warmer, more organic sound. I suspect that the choice is very system dependent.
Let me know if you are looking to unload those Svetlana 5Y3 tubes. I have a Poseidon and I am in NJ
I have a quad of Bendix 5992 tubes available. PM me if interested.
I was an early adopter of the Poseidon, upgrading from a Golden Atlantic TRP. I received my dac in Jan. 2024. Since then I’ve tried a lot of tubes, and I’d like to report on those that have given me the most pleasure. I was not totally convinced by the tubes that came with my dac: Russian 6n1p inputs and 5C3S rectifier along with Chinese 6V6 outputs. On the other hand, I am completely overjoyed with the Poseidon and the tubes that I am using now. It is a fabulous dac.
My dac has single ended interconnects going to my amps, and in this case one can remove tubes from the negative phase sockets, but having tubes in these sockets sounds better to me than leaving them empty; so I have tried to use less expensive tubes in those spots. Here are my top two sets of tubes. For me, Set A is quite a bit better than Set B. However, Set B is very, very good.
Set B: Inputs - Melz 6S2B-V. These are single triodes and need to be mounted in pairs. (Pinouts can be found on the web, but if one has doubts, they should buy adapters from a pro rather than diy.) These tubes are the subminiature microphone tubes which were popularized through the writings of Takacs and Pinter. They are a joy to listen to. I use these in all four input sockets for Set B.
Outputs: +’ve phase - Osram yellow paper L63
-‘ve phase - GEC L63’s as supplied with the Poseidon to some lucky buyers. The old Osrams are a clear step up for me.
Rectifier: Tungsram PV200/600. This tube sounds very good and is inexpensive. Beware — you cannot use the same adapter as for an RGN2004 or a G2504! This rectifier does not come close to the rectifier in Set A, however.
Set A: Inputs: +’ve phase - Sylvania 7963 subminiature double triodes. In my opinion this is a fantastic tube, and I like it much more than the Melz 6S2B-V. The one proviso is that without precautions it will cause hum in the Poseidon, probably due to parasitic oscillation. I was able to correct this by adding two 100 ohm resistors to each adapter, one in series with each of the grid leads. (I am not claiming that this resistor value is optimum, but it worked for me.) Adapters can be made by either soldering the flying leads of the 7963 directly to a 9-pin socket saver (using the correct pinouts), or, as I did, make an adapter with an 8 pin subminiature socket and a 9 pin base and incorporating the resistors. The 7963 tube is inexpensive but it is quite difficult to find. This tube is definitely worth the hunt!
-‘ve phase - Melz 6N16B-V. This is another subminiature double triode. There are many tubes to try in this spot, another good one is the Mullard CV3986/ 6021. I liked the 6N16B-V better. By the way, I didn’t find that using four 7963s was an improvement over two 7963s and two 6N16B-Vs.
Outputs: +’ve phase - E55L. Mine are Mullard.
-‘ve phase - E81L. Mine are Amperex PQ 6686.
I learned of these tubes from posts of Takacs and Pinter. They give life to the music.
Rectifier: Klangfilm KL75301/ Telefunken RGN2004 mesh. Airy, beautiful. By far better than any other rectifier that I have tried.
That’s it — there likely are tubes out there that make the Poseidon sing even more beautifully, but I’m done searching for them. Set A makes listening a true pleasure, and that is my goal.
My dac has single ended interconnects going to my amps, and in this case one can remove tubes from the negative phase sockets, but having tubes in these sockets sounds better to me than leaving them empty; so I have tried to use less expensive tubes in those spots. Here are my top two sets of tubes. For me, Set A is quite a bit better than Set B. However, Set B is very, very good.
Set B: Inputs - Melz 6S2B-V. These are single triodes and need to be mounted in pairs. (Pinouts can be found on the web, but if one has doubts, they should buy adapters from a pro rather than diy.) These tubes are the subminiature microphone tubes which were popularized through the writings of Takacs and Pinter. They are a joy to listen to. I use these in all four input sockets for Set B.
Outputs: +’ve phase - Osram yellow paper L63
-‘ve phase - GEC L63’s as supplied with the Poseidon to some lucky buyers. The old Osrams are a clear step up for me.
Rectifier: Tungsram PV200/600. This tube sounds very good and is inexpensive. Beware — you cannot use the same adapter as for an RGN2004 or a G2504! This rectifier does not come close to the rectifier in Set A, however.
Set A: Inputs: +’ve phase - Sylvania 7963 subminiature double triodes. In my opinion this is a fantastic tube, and I like it much more than the Melz 6S2B-V. The one proviso is that without precautions it will cause hum in the Poseidon, probably due to parasitic oscillation. I was able to correct this by adding two 100 ohm resistors to each adapter, one in series with each of the grid leads. (I am not claiming that this resistor value is optimum, but it worked for me.) Adapters can be made by either soldering the flying leads of the 7963 directly to a 9-pin socket saver (using the correct pinouts), or, as I did, make an adapter with an 8 pin subminiature socket and a 9 pin base and incorporating the resistors. The 7963 tube is inexpensive but it is quite difficult to find. This tube is definitely worth the hunt!
-‘ve phase - Melz 6N16B-V. This is another subminiature double triode. There are many tubes to try in this spot, another good one is the Mullard CV3986/ 6021. I liked the 6N16B-V better. By the way, I didn’t find that using four 7963s was an improvement over two 7963s and two 6N16B-Vs.
Outputs: +’ve phase - E55L. Mine are Mullard.
-‘ve phase - E81L. Mine are Amperex PQ 6686.
I learned of these tubes from posts of Takacs and Pinter. They give life to the music.
Rectifier: Klangfilm KL75301/ Telefunken RGN2004 mesh. Airy, beautiful. By far better than any other rectifier that I have tried.
That’s it — there likely are tubes out there that make the Poseidon sing even more beautifully, but I’m done searching for them. Set A makes listening a true pleasure, and that is my goal.
@ronfint
That’s awesome Ron! I’m glad to hear that you overcame the hum issue with the 7193 as the last time we wrote it was becoming a big issue. Great stuff!
That’s awesome Ron! I’m glad to hear that you overcame the hum issue with the 7193 as the last time we wrote it was becoming a big issue. Great stuff!
Hi Todd,
The 7963 tubes are too good to quit on. I asked around to no avail, but although not directly applicable, these wonderful lecture notes gave me the idea for the solution. They would also be very helpful for anyone building adapters pentode —> triode:
https://www.audiodesignguide.com/New2A3/ETF06TS.pdf
Ron
Thanks very much, but I’m not sure that my adapters are so special. The most difficult aspect for me was sourcing materials. I found that it was best to give up trying to find tube bases of the correct size and ended up making the bodies out of carbon fiber tubing. Cutting tools can be found at bicycle shops.Then I found bases (without bodies) and sockets on ebay. I tried to find those of the best construction available, but sometimes had to settle for what was available. If you live in Europe and don’t have to pay large shipping fees, there are better sources. I used silver wire from Jupiter and for rectifiers I used Mills resistors.
There’s really not much to it if you can solder and have good eyes (I don’t, but magnifying glasses help). I haven’t compared with other adapters, but I don’t think you can go wrong if you use good materials and work carefully. Contact me if you have trouble sourcing parts, and I’ll let you know what I used, but I’m not sure that they will still be available in this world of tariffs.
Ron
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