Koetsu

[Be Quiet...Listen]

What a great thread. I've thoroughly enjoyed reading this from the first to last page!

I'm a relative newcomer to high end analogue and admittedly a little on the novice side of cartridge/tonearm set-up. But, I'm motivated to learn the in's and out's.

I happened upon my first Koetsu (Rosewood Signature) some 2.5 years ago and have enjoyed it so much it has curious about others. Since then I have procured a Rosewood Signature Platinum and Onyx Platinum Diamond. All great in their own ways.

Now, my curiosity extends to the two in the Urushi camp (Wajima & Vermilion) and wonder if the Sugano era made units are different/better?
And which of the stone bodied carts would ultimately be 'my flavour'. After having read about the Coralstone, Blue Lace & Tiger Eye I really have no clue!
Can anyone help to shed some light here?

Thanks!

 

[jadis]

What a great thread. I've thoroughly enjoyed reading this from the first to last page!

I'm a relative newcomer to high end analogue and admittedly a little on the novice side of cartridge/tonearm set-up. But, I'm motivated to learn the in's and out's.

I happened upon my first Koetsu (Rosewood Signature) some 2.5 years ago and have enjoyed it so much it has curious about others. Since then I have procured a Rosewood Signature Platinum and Onyx Platinum Diamond. All great in their own ways.

Now, my curiosity extends to the two in the Urushi camp (Wajima & Vermilion) and wonder if the Sugano era made units are different/better?
And which of the stone bodied carts would ultimately be 'my flavour'. After having read about the Coralstone, Blue Lace & Tiger Eye I really have no clue!
Can anyone help to shed some light here?

Thanks!

Welcome to the thread and glad you liked it here.

There are a few here who could shed more light on the differences of the 3 stone bodies you mentioned. I've heard them before, but in different systems so it's pretty hard to give a good assessment as to which is doing what, but certainly, you cannot go wrong with any one of them.

 

[Nemal1]

I own a wajima, but going back to your earlier mention of Sugan-San, my late father had both the original rosewood and onyx long bodied versions (£500 and £800 respectively) which were the only 2 models available. Used on an oracle premier and sumiko “the arm” replaced with a triplanar 3. They were both far beyond the current state of the art at the time (not too much competition) but recall how musical the system was. Great memories.

 

[Syntax]

Brothers ...



Koetsu Blue Lace DC

Koetsu Blue Lace Mono​

Koetsu Blue Lace DC

Koetsu Coralstone DC​

​

 

[jadis]

Brothers ...



Koetsu Blue Lace DC

Koetsu Blue Lace Mono​

View attachment 91689

Koetsu Blue Lace DC

Koetsu Coralstone DC​

View attachment 91690

​

Awesome!

 

[jadis]

Helped install this Coralstone Diamond for a friend. He bought it brand new from me in 2006 and was kept in storage till now when his main listening room was finally completed. Sounds magnificent out of the box!

 

[Lxgreen]

What a great thread. I've thoroughly enjoyed reading this from the first to last page!

I'm a relative newcomer to high end analogue and admittedly a little on the novice side of cartridge/tonearm set-up. But, I'm motivated to learn the in's and out's.

I happened upon my first Koetsu (Rosewood Signature) some 2.5 years ago and have enjoyed it so much it has curious about others. Since then I have procured a Rosewood Signature Platinum and Onyx Platinum Diamond. All great in their own ways.

Now, my curiosity extends to the two in the Urushi camp (Wajima & Vermilion) and wonder if the Sugano era made units are different/better?
And which of the stone bodied carts would ultimately be 'my flavour'. After having read about the Coralstone, Blue Lace & Tiger Eye I really have no clue!
Can anyone help to shed some light here?

Thanks!

I started with the Black and went with urushi Wajima last year. Recently broke the stylus off and rebuilt cartridge just returned so have some breakin time. My dealer, Audio-Element in Pasadena, CA told me to stick with the Wajima rather than replace the broken Wajima. His rationale was that the Wajima is excellent and going to stone body will give me a different, not necessarily better sq. I still eventually want to try stone body or maybe the rosewood signature platinum.

 

[jadis]

His rationale was that the Wajima is excellent and going to stone body will give me a different, not necessarily better sq. I still eventually want to try stone body or maybe the rosewood signature platinum.

I have the exact sentiments as you. I have the Urushi Tsugaru, previously a Black and a Rosewood Signature, non platinum. Somewhere as I graze beyond the fields, I'd like a Jade.

 

[Don_Camillo]

2) The cartridge that might sound closest to a Koetsu if I were to guess might be Supex. Supex was the cartridge that Sugano San designed before he started Koetsu.

You´re right. Supex SD-900 Super sounds very similar to a Koetsu Black Goldline but SUPEX SD-909 is a different cup of tea

 

[Don_Camillo]

Saw a picture of a Koetsu WHITE that my Singapore distributor told me about, and I learned from the guy who posted it, that only 3 were made by Sugano San in those days. The Koetsu lore continues.

View attachment 51590

I bought one of these white body carts recently


Additionally I found another one offered with some pictures showing its original box

Rare Koetsu (光悦) MC Cartridge #026 W/ original Box In Excellent Condition | Reverb

Rare Koetsu (光悦) MC Cartridge #026 W/ original Box In Excellent Condition Item Description: This unit is in excellent condition (please see photos). This Cartridge has been checked and tested confirm working perfectly. Shipping Policy We ship the item via DHL with ...

reverb.com

This box says model name is POEM. Maybe you can ask Fumihiko Sugano about more details and specs? Any other hint on specs and details would be highly appreciated too. Thanks.

 

[Don_Camillo]

Saw a picture of a Koetsu WHITE that my Singapore distributor told me about, and I learned from the guy who posted it, that only 3 were made by Sugano San in those days. The Koetsu lore continues.

View attachment 51590

This originally was posted on Facebook.



Today I got mine and gave it a first try. I can confirm that it just sounds divine. No real comparison to a Black or Black Goldline. It plays finer, more holistic, more delicate and full-bodied. I´m fallen in love





With #032 it´s a quite early Sugano San made piece of heaven

 

[Solypsa]

Congrats on the rare and lovely find!

@Don_Camillo You show a huge amount of gears in your signature, and clearly are a vinyl buff at highest level. Would you want to start a new thread speaking about your vinyl journey, and what system configuration you listen to mostly these days? I am sure it would be a fun read

 

[Don_Camillo]

Congrats on the rare and lovely find!

@Don_Camillo You show a huge amount of gears in your signature, and clearly are a vinyl buff at highest level. Would you want to start a new thread speaking about your vinyl journey, and what system configuration you listen to mostly these days? I am sure it would be a fun read

Sorry, but no. I don´t want to play myself so deliberately in the foreground. Yes, I've come a long way with vinyl, have been doing this hobby for about 40 years or even a bit more now. I probably started like everyone else here. Then I also wanted to understand technicall dependencies and since then I've been doing it a bit differently than others, but always technically correct. This starts with the pickup load for a linear frequency response instead of cartridge auditions to meet my individual taste and does not stop with measuring and DIY.

 

[Solypsa]

Sorry, but no.

Understood. Thanks for sharing what you do, it helps keep wbf vinyl section vibrant!

 

[Don_Camillo]

I agree that Mitch Cotter sut and Koetsu are synergistic.

I can confirm that for M. Cotter/ verion MK1 type P too. That sounds pretty tasty.

 

[Don_Camillo]

The Warlock (Black Goldline), The Poet (POEM) and the Sound of Joy (Onyx Agate Platinum)

 

[MRJAZZ]

You´re right. Supex SD-900 Super sounds very similar to a Koetsu Black Goldline but SUPEX SD-909 is a different cup of tea

View attachment 94908

What table are you using in this picture....Pioneer P10?

 

[Don_Camillo]

Unfortunately I do not own a P-10 or P-3a but a PL-70LII and a PL-50LII only. The picture shows a Denon DP-6000 in DK-200 plinth paired with a Fidelity Research FR-64s, SUT used in this setup is a Cotter/ Verion MK 1 but I also own a DP-80 as well as a DP-7000. The DP-6000 motor unit is almost in any perspective on par with the other Denons.

 

[MRJAZZ]

Unfortunately I do not own a P-10 or P-3a but a PL-70LII and a PL-50LII only. The picture shows a Denon DP-6000 in DK-200 plinth paired with a Fidelity Research FR-64s, SUT used in this setup is a Cotter/ Verion MK 1 but I also own a DP-80 as well as a DP-7000. The DP-6000 motor unit is almost in any perspective on par with the other Denons.

Do you have any experience with a Pioneer Exclusive P10. If so, any sense how they might compare to other DD tables of that era (Denon DP 80, Technics Sp10, etc.)

 

[mountainjoe]

Do you have any experience with a Pioneer Exclusive P10. If so, any sense how they might compare to other DD tables of that era (Denon DP 80, Technics Sp10, etc.)

I have a P10 Exclusive and also an SP10MK3 (with an Artisan Fidelity plinth) - the P10 is overall a very nice sounding TT imo. Does everything quite well though not as resolving as the SP10MK3 and not as much extension in the bass.

Hard to make a direct comparison as I have different tonearms and carts on each table. For the money though, I think the P10 is an excellent value. I would like to also get a P3 or P3a one of these days as they should be very competitive with the SP10MK3.