Neutral power amp recommendations?

[vermaxis]

Hi everyone,

I’m back after my DAC journey post and I’m now looking for a power amp recommendation.

In short, I’m looking for something more neutral without being cold or analytical. Important to have a low noise floor and to sound good at low volumes (in my experience some amps need to be cranked up to hear what they’re capable of).

About me: I have aggressive tinnitus and it is triggered pretty easily by harsh highs. I do all my listening in quiet at low volumes (~50db). Want to stay away from anything hyper detailed, dry, analytical, etc. I originally architected my system around a ‘warmer’ sound but have come more recently to appreciate neutrality and transparency.

Edit: Also forgot to mention, looking for solid state, not tubes. And price would be under $30k.

Current setup
Source: Innuos Pulsar
DAC + volume control: Playback Designs MPD-8
Speakers: Vienna Acoustics Beethoven Concert Grand Reference (90db, 4ohm)
Power: Transparent Powerwave
Cabling: Various, no single loom (yet). Have Raven Audio, Transparent, Wireworld, FTA, Inakustik, Acoustic Revive

Thanks in advance!

 

[andromedaaudio]

Transistor.

CH precision and also Pilium are very neutral to my ears .
The new Krells sounded nice too KSA I 400

Neutral and warm id say the Gryphon and R Koda.

I ve done a renewed power amp investigation over the past 3 years .

Tubes relatively neutral and warm

Regarding tubes its hard to beat the CAT JL5 black path in $$$ value .
VAC and ARC power amps are great too.

Less neutral more warm JADIS

After listening again a lot to my CAT JL5 on my new ( more revealing speakers ) i honestly dont see a real reason to switch.
On the 8 ohm tap that is

 

[chuck]

Boulder works very well with my Playback Designs MPT8/MPD8, gets the most from a great DAC.

 

[LL21]

Transistor.

CH precision and also Pilium are very neutral to my ears .
The new Krells sounded nice too KSA I 400

Neutral and warm id say the Gryphon and R Koda.

I ve done a renewed power amp investigation over the past 3 years .

Tubes relatively neutral and warm

Regarding tubes its hard to beat the CAT JL5 black path in $$$ value .
VAC and ARC power amps are great too.

Less neutral more warm JADIS

After listening again a lot to my CAT JL5 on my new ( more revealing speakers ) i honestly dont see a real reason to switch.
On the 8 ohm tap that is

I would agree on the description of Gryphon and Robert Koda, as we own Robert Koda K15EX/160 Monos, and they replaced the CJ/Gryphon Mephisto combination of nearly 12 years.

Robert has really done a remarkable job creating what Alan Sircom called the world's most powerful tubed Single Ended Triode (but without tubes). Low noise measurements are among the industry leading, and yet he has used (I have read) no negative feedback global or local. I have no idea how that is possible. But I will say, the sound is quite remarkable in exactly the original poster's areas of focus.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Hi vermaxis,

Do you want tube or solid-state or hybrid, or are you completely agnostic?

What MSRP price range are you looking at?

 

[bonzo75]

This thread is hilarious. Look at the OP’s system before recommending CH and Boulder and references to Koda and Mephisto

 

[andromedaaudio]

DAC + volume control: Playback Designs MPD-8
Speakers: Vienna Acoustics Beethoven Concert Grand Reference (90db, 4ohm)

??? so whats the problem Bonzo.
A the Gryphon recommendation would include a Essence which is 12 K used .
CH can be had second hand under 20 K

 

[bonzo75]

??? so whats the problem Bonzo

the retail of those is 4500 USD. You can look up for the streamer etc

 

[fast.freight]

Hi Vermaxis!
Some great knowledge and advice here. I love my Audionet, and have a pair of MAX's and a pair of Heisenbergs.

In short, I’m looking for something more neutral without being cold or analytical. Important to have a low noise floor and to sound good at low volumes (in my experience some amps need to be cranked up to hear what they’re capable of).

Neutral: check. Very revealing while being full bodied
Cold or Analytical: Not if you are careful with great DAC and great cabling. All copper works very well. Lifelike and engaging.
Low Noise Floor: Wow here. the most silent I have had or heard.
Low Volume Listening: Again amazing. All the resolution is there at any volume.
Warm: nope.

The Max's are the sweet spot. The Heisenbergs are stunning.

 

[andromedaaudio]

This would be my SS choice second hand off course. 12 K
The weight is also acceptable 45 kg .
I m sick and tired of handling 80 kg power amps

Tubes CAT JL5 Black path under 10K ( 45 kg )

Audiophilia can be great at acceptable prices

 

[chuck]

the retail of those is 4500 USD. You can look up for the streamer etc

And the retail of the Playback Designs MPD8 is $24,000.00. I own one and know what it can do. Thus the Boulder recommendation. The OP lives in Denver. I highly recommend a visit to the Boulder factory, he can hear for himself all the Boulder amps that now start at under $10K.

 

[Treehaus Audiolab]

It might sound odd in the audience of some of the other products listed, but I have really been surprised at how good the various Purifi-based amps can be. They also respond very well to the quality of the input buffer board. Id tend to say they are good-as or better than the variety of GaN based amps.

This is all coming from someone who loves low power SET amps, which unfortunately wouldn't work on 90dB speakers and probably would learn too far from neutral.

 

[vermaxis]

Hi vermaxis,

Do you want tube or solid-state or hybrid, or are you completely agnostic?

What MSRP price range are you looking at?

Those are important pieces of info I left out!

Solid state, I’m really not looking tubes.

Price would be $30k or less.

 

[mtemur]

Unfortunately there is no such a thing like “Neutral Power Amp”. They all have their sound signatures. Some have more distinct than the others.

If you’re looking for warm, not-offensive, in other words a distant sounding amplifier look for solid states. BTW Gryphon, CH or Krell are as neutral as Kim Kardashian’s bottom. Preferable but not neutral.

On the other hand if you can listen live music without your tinnitus is triggered then unnatural, artificial sound might be the real problem. I have tinnitus too and it’s sensitive to oversampling that’s why I don’t prefer digital. But noise up to a level is helping though. In that sense vinyl setup instead of digital might help.

IMHO if you want intimate, lifelike sound without being warm then look for tubes.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Those are important pieces of info I left out!

Solid state, I’m really not looking tubes.

Price would be $30k or less.

Are you open to buying it used?

 

[vermaxis]

Are you open to buying it used?

Yes, absolutely open to buying used.

 

[Ron Resnick]

This is, obviously, totally subjective, but to me "neutral" and "neutral without being cold and analytical" result in two different sets of recommendations.

Neutral solid-state without being cold and analytical to me suggests CH and Soulution.

I consider Boulder to be so neutral as to be sterile and analytical (sorry Chuck!).

I consider Gryphon and darTZeel and Westminster and Hegel (my four favorite solid-state amps) to be just slightly warm of neutral (which is why they are my four favorite solid-state amps).

I consider Vitus warm of neutral.

I also like Infigo, but I have not spent time with it in a familiar system to understand the nuances of its sonic and tonal characteristics and to know whether I would consider it just slightly warm of neutral.

But I am a "tube person," so it might be somewhat unfair from the get-go for me to say anything about solid-state amplifiers.

KeithR has auditioned a wide variety of amplifiers in his own system, so hopefully he will weigh in on the answer to your question.

 

[MarkusBarkus]

Gryphon, CH or Krell are as neutral as Kim Kardashian’s bottom

...now that's March Madness. My top candidate for "Simile of the Month" prize, with one week to go! Carry on.

 

[andromedaaudio]

Preferable but not neutral.

Who cares preferable is whats its about in life

 

[DasguteOhr]

Musical fidelity amps maybe or cambridge audio edge w mono amp fits exactly what you want my opinion.

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