Rockport Orions with a subwoofer?

[LL21]

IMO and IME it very much depends on your room size / dimensions and speaker type. The Arrakis' woofers, if memory serves act almost as subs, I think they cross around 100Hz. Also, Arnie's room was quite large so placement was not as critical as in most rooms with room modes. Putting subs right next to woofers in mains in most rooms is not the most ideal positioning as you're exacerbating the woofers' bass from essentially the same location.

Very fair point on rooms. As for placement of subs next to mains, that is good to know. I have almost never had our sub next to the main but in the opposite corner. Mainly due to living room configuration.

That said, I admit I was actually thinking dual subs, 1 near/slightly behind each speaker...so glad to know about your point here. Will make sure to think about placement very carefully if we go thru the trouble of a major upgrade of the sub to the next level.

 

[VPN]

IMO and IME it very much depends on your room size / dimensions and speaker type. The Arrakis' woofers, if memory serves act almost as subs, I think they cross around 100Hz. Also, Arnie's room was quite large so placement was not as critical as in most rooms with room modes. Putting subs right next to woofers in mains in most rooms is not the most ideal positioning as you're exacerbating the woofers' bass from essentially the same location.

I have listened to Arnie's system twice over the years. Amazing system and room. The integration of this six pack of subs with the Rockport Arrakis is impeccable, completely seamless. Some people recommend the dual subs besides the main speakers for time alignment sake, if the room has enough space.

 

[sbo6]

I have listened to Arnie's system twice over the years. Amazing system and room. The integration of this six pack of subs with the Rockport Arrakis is impeccable, completely seamless. Some people recommend the dual subs besides the main speakers for time alignment sake, if the room has enough space.

The integration of subs is not overly complex, if you know what you're doing (by ear doesn't cut it IME). In general, a larger room makes the process less complex (assuming fewer and less severe room modes). In Arnie's case, with the 6 - pack and also with his previous subs, they both integrated seamlessly. Are the 6 pack better subs (and 3x as many as previously)? Sure. Also, setting the XO point so low makes it that much easier.

WRT subs behind the mains, I have 2 of 4 set up this way primarily for corner loading and to minimize room modes. But putting the subs right next to the mains (like Rel recommends) is to be frank, idiotic, again unless you have a large room, which most of us don't (even then it's questionable if it's the optimal positioning). I think most people do it because it looks cool. See Toole's book for more details.

 

[VPN]

Who do you guys think is the best audio setup person in the world for positioning main speakers and subwoofers?

 

[John T]

Given the fact that Arnie (of Arrakis, REL 6-pack fame) found that set to 24hz or 27hz, the 6-pack was a big plus for his Arrakis, I think it is safe to say if you like what the 6-pack is doing for you now...then you owe it yourself to start with the full 6-pack if you ever drop in the Lyras.

IMO and IME it very much depends on your room size / dimensions and speaker type. The Arrakis' woofers, if memory serves act almost as subs, I think they cross around 100Hz. Also, Arnie's room was quite large so placement was not as critical as in most rooms with room modes. Putting subs right next to woofers in mains in most rooms is not the most ideal positioning as you're exacerbating the woofers' bass from essentially the same location.

Lloyd your most likely spot on starting with the 6 pack. I have had them now for almost 2 years. This January it will be 24 months. It would be difficult to enjoy listening now without them. The only small obstacle is to somehow obtain the Lyra's!! Wouldn't that be nice. I couldn't agree more with @sbo6 regarding room size. As I have previously shared my room is 30' X 26' X 26'H. A frame 9/12 pitch, with an open loft. We're talking somewhere in the 15K-20K cubic feet range. This open concept needs subs. Placement is an entirely other different interesting aspect. I know guys who do setups for Rockports with Subs and they like the subs (regardless of brands) parallel with the Lyra's fronts. I had them that way for quite some time but I now have them 7" recessed back from the fronts. Every room is different and no right or wrong. Just be patient and let your ears be the guide...

 

[JiminGa]

I would only recommend subs with Lyras depending upon choice of music. Lyra is very different animal from Arrakis. Acoustic jazz and small group format better without. Full orchestra yes

 

[sbo6]

I would only recommend subs with Lyras depending upon choice of music. Lyra is very different animal from Arrakis. Acoustic jazz and small group format better without. Full orchestra yes

If any subs are integrated appropriately with any speakers why would the genre of music matter?

 

[JiminGa]

Because nothing is free. Subs help reproduce the sensation of a full orchestra in front of you. They also help the concussive impact of various instruments. However, no matter how perfect the dial the midrange in particular suffers a bit. So, whether the trade off is worth it or not depends upon what you are listening to. It also matters how sensitive you are to this and what your equipment choices are. If you don’t hear any issues by all means go for it. With Rockports whose strength is transparency and timbral accuracy you will notice it more. The people who buy them tend to be in this camp. The creators of them dont make subs or recommend them. Wilson’s forte is scale and impact. Subs accentuate this. People who buy them tend to like subs. Their creators make subs and do recommend them. It’s just a question of personal taste. I prefer my Orions without them but if I had a huge room and listened to full orchestra or frequently blasted some Zep then I’d have a pair handy for that when I did it. Just my thoughts. Others will feel differently