Should a member be allowed to make a post which is AI generated or AI mixed without disclosing such use of AI as part of the post?

[andromedaaudio]

Can somebody please ask AI whats the best cable ?

 

[Ted Denney III]

When the debate becomes not about the content of something that was said, but rather the tone in which it was expressed, and once the capricious label of AI is applied, it can be used as a censorship tool.

Case in point: after being attacked by a forum member that turned out to be a competitor I had never heard of, I took umbrage and responded in kind. This exchange heated up, and a ridiculous claim was made that encompassing Teflon dielectric is superior to air because pure silver, when oxidized, becomes a poor conductor. This is a false argument on so many levels, and I dismantled it as such. Instead of my response being replied to, instead of the points I made being refuted (which they could not be), it was asserted that my response was written with AI.

The point of free speech is more speech. Points should be analyzed and debated, not attacked because it is presumed that they may have been made either with the help of or exclusively through AI. People who have a history of writing ad copy for many decades, or who are well-versed in communicating complex ideas, will always come across as “AI.”

Better to address the content of points made than to attack the style of delivery.

The above was verbally dictated to my iPhone, and then corrected for punctuation and grammar.

No Ted, you just proved that you don't understand how silver corrodes, yet you offer cables with an air dielectric anyways. This is called incompetence. You are not qualified or competent to design and build the products you sell. But it goes further than that. You are selling a product that will not last because it will corrode, which is unethical.

I could easily rebuke the flawed logic your AI model used, but I refuse to argue with AI.

This is AI, and nobody needs an AI detector to understand that you didn't write this post:

Ted Denney III said:
Thank you for sharing your perspective. However, I must respectfully disagree with several points in your response, as they contain inaccuracies and unfounded personal attacks.

Firstly, your focus on the specific composition of silver tarnish misses the broader point about dielectric properties. While you’re correct that silver sulfide is more common than silver oxide in everyday environments, this distinction doesn’t invalidate the core argument about air versus Teflon dielectrics.

Your claim that I lack the technical background for cable design is both unfounded and irrelevant to the discussion at hand. It’s a classic ad hominem fallacy that attempts to discredit the argument by attacking the person rather than addressing the actual points raised.

The 2001 forum post you’ve cited, while interesting, is not a credible scientific source. It’s an informal, outdated discussion that doesn’t reflect current research or advancements in audio technology over the past two decades.

Your statement about my competence is not only unnecessarily personal but also demonstrates a logical fallacy known as the argument from authority. My points stand or fall on their own merits, not on your perception of my qualifications.
The core argument about air versus Teflon dielectrics remains valid and is based on well-established principles of electromagnetic theory. The lower dielectric constant of air compared to Teflon can indeed lead to less signal alteration in certain circumstances.

I’d encourage you to engage with the actual technical points raised, rather than resorting to personal attacks or outdated sources. A constructive dialogue based on current research and empirical evidence would be far more beneficial to the audio community.

Let’s focus on advancing our understanding of cable design through respectful, fact-based discussions. This approach serves everyone better and contributes to the collective knowledge in our field.

Like I said, I’ve never heard of you. Never ever, and I’ve been doing this since I was in my 20s, and I’m now 60. And you are completely wrong that an all-encompassing PTFE dielectric around a solid silver conductor is preferable to air. The incursion that the PTFE creates on the electromagnetic transfer—it’s not electrons running down a wire, Dave; it’s the EM field around the wire. That’s what signal is, Dave. And when you put a solid dielectric around the conductor, that impedes the electromagnetic transfer more so than do various types of silver oxide in an air dielectric. In other words, the deleterious effects of PTFE outweigh any negative consequences of silver when it tarnishes in an air dielectric.

The above was verbally dictated to my iPhone, and corrected for punctuation and grammar.

 

[DaveC]

When you encounter posts such as Ted's that are very obviously AI, a detector isn't required.

I also think it's not required for almost every single member here. But Ted has demonstrated he's willing to lie about it. I think he's a group of ONE. He's the reason this thread exists, and his denial of his obvious use of AI is problematic.

 

[DaveC]

Like I said, I’ve never heard of you. Never ever, and I’ve been doing this since I was in my 20s, and I’m now 60. And you are completely wrong that an all-encompassing PTFE dielectric around a solid silver conductor is preferable to air. The incursion that the PTFE creates on the electromagnetic transfer—it’s not electrons running down a wire, Dave; it’s the EM field around the wire. That’s what signal is, Dave. And when you put a solid dielectric around the conductor, that impedes the electromagnetic transfer more so than do various types of silver oxide in an air dielectric. In other words, the deleterious effects of PTFE outweigh any negative consequences of silver when it tarnishes in an air dielectric.

The above was verbally dictated to my iPhone, and corrected for punctuation and grammar.

Ted, what are your actual credentials? You have a very basic, elementary understanding of electrical phenomenon that makes me believe you have no real education or knowledge of the subject.

 

[microstrip]

When the debate becomes not about the content of something that was said, but rather the tone in which it was expressed, and once the capricious label of AI is applied, it can be used as a censorship tool.

Case in point: after being attacked by a forum member that turned out to be a competitor I had never heard of, I took umbrage and responded in kind. This exchange heated up, and a ridiculous claim was made that encompassing Teflon dielectric is superior to air because pure silver, when oxidized, becomes a poor conductor. This is a false argument on so many levels, and I dismantled it as such. Instead of my response being replied to, instead of the points I made being refuted (which they could not be), it was asserted that my response was written with AI.

The point of free speech is more speech. Points should be analyzed and debated, not attacked because it is presumed that they may have been made either with the help of or exclusively through AI. People who have a history of writing ad copy for many decades, or who are well-versed in communicating complex ideas, will always come across as “AI.”

Better to address the content of points made than to attack the style of delivery

The above was verbally dictated to my iPhone, and then corrected for punctuation and grammar.

Curiously this text is analysed as not AI-generated writing and filled with human writing. Please go on!

BTW, only now noticed the silver comment. As far as I know silver oxide is a p-semiconductor and as such, is consider a poor conductor. Apologies if I am out of the context of your discussion, but is looks clear to me.

 

[italia]

I like Conrad Johnson's marketing moto. It just sounds right.

Is Lew still around? I recall meeting him when I worked for a dealer many decades ago. Seems like his McCormack Audio thing didn't survive after he left C-J. So many interesting people in the industry back in the day

 

[Ted Denney III]

Ted, what are your actual credentials? You have a very basic, elementary understanding of electrical phenomenon that makes me believe you have no real education of knowledge of the subject.

So now you’re committing the fallacy of reasoning: appeal to authority. I’ll tell you what my credentials are: I sell more in a good week than you do in a year. The market votes with its dollars, Dave.

And to anyone thinking of buying Dave’s cables, if you’re curious about Synergistic Research cables that occupy similar or lower price points, reach out to me. As a point of honor, I will make certain you can audition my products versus Dave’s products.

 

[DaveC]

So now you’re committing the fallacy of reasoning: appeal to authority. I’ll tell you what my credentials are: I sell more in a good week than you do in a year. The market votes with its dollars, Dave.

And to anyone thinking of buying Dave’s cables, if you’re curious about Synergistic Research cables that occupy similar or lower price points, reach out to me. As a point of honor, I will make certain you can audition my products versus Dave’s products.

Here's what you've proven:

-You are here lying to all of us about your use of AI

-You have no education or credentials to share, which results in design decisions like "air dielectric" without any understanding of the compromise you're making by doing so. Your use of air dielectric will result in a better sounding cable at first, but it will corrode. This is unethical.

I will refrain from making judgements based on the above information as it would be against the TOU, but I think people can come to their own conclusions.

Finally, I encourage comparisons and offer free demos.

 

[wil]

Curiously this text is analysed as not AI-generated writing and filled with human writing. Please go on!

BTW, only now noticed the silver comment. As far as I know silver oxide is a p-semiconductor and as such, is consider a poor conductor. Apologies if I am out of the context of your discussion, but is looks clear to me.

Why is it "curious" that the above text did not test as AI? It doesn't sound the least AI. I've read a couple of others on WBF over the last couple of weeks that assuredly do have the stilted, overly smooth non-human AI signature. It's impossible not to spot imho -- but I'm sure not for long.

 

[exupgh12]

According to ChatGPT there is a high probability you wrote the above using AI.View attachment 145504View attachment 145505View attachment 145506View attachment 145507

Let me make it easier for you, I usually use AI to polish my english messages. I doubt anyone here would prefer reading my messages in my native language

 

[Ted Denney III]

Curiously this text is analysed as not AI-generated writing and filled with human writing. Please go on!

BTW, only now noticed the silver comment. As far as I know silver oxide is a p-semiconductor and as such, is consider a poor conductor. Apologies if I am out of the context of your discussion, but is looks clear to me.

Your question is best answered with a simple AI query using Perplexity Pro. In other words, this is well understood electrical theory best addressed through a non biased search result.

The hypothesis that a silver wire in an air dielectric subjectively outperforms the same silver wire in a sealed PTFE (Teflon) dielectric can be explained by considering several mechanical and electromagnetic factors. These factors align with both theoretical principles and empirical observations from audiophiles. Below is an explanation framed in accessible terms for the average ultra-high-end audio enthusiast:

1. Dielectric Constant and Signal Propagation

• Air vs. PTFE: Air has a dielectric constant of approximately 1.00059, which is extremely close to a vacuum—the ideal environment for electromagnetic wave propagation. In contrast, PTFE has a dielectric constant of about 2.1. This difference means that air introduces far less interference with the electromagnetic field surrounding the conductor.

• Impact on Sound: A lower dielectric constant reduces energy storage and signal delay caused by the interaction between the conductor and its insulation. This allows the signal to propagate more faithfully, preserving subtle details in the music, which audiophiles often describe as “openness” or “naturalness” in sound.

2. Dielectric Absorption and Energy Storage

• PTFE’s Drawback: Solid dielectrics like PTFE can absorb and release small amounts of electrical energy as the signal passes through, a phenomenon known as dielectric absorption. This process can smear or distort the timing of high-frequency components, creating what some listeners perceive as a “sterile” or “compressed” sound.

• Air’s Advantage: Air does not store or release energy in this way, ensuring that the signal remains unaltered as it propagates along the conductor.

3. Electromagnetic Field Interaction

• Signal as an Electromagnetic Wave: Audio signals are primarily carried by the electromagnetic field around the conductor rather than by electron flow through it. The quality of this field is influenced by the surrounding material.

• PTFE’s Influence: PTFE, being a solid material, interacts more with the electromagnetic field than air does, potentially altering its characteristics. This interaction is minimal in air, allowing for cleaner and more accurate propagation of high-frequency details.

4. Oxidation of Silver

• Silver Oxide vs. Pure Silver: While silver oxidizes to form silver oxide (Ag2O) or silver sulfide (Ag2S), these compounds are still conductive—unlike copper oxide, which is highly resistive. Thus, even if oxidation occurs on a silver conductor in an air dielectric, it has minimal impact on signal propagation.

• PTFE Heat Effects: The process of applying PTFE insulation often involves heat, which can accelerate oxidation on the surface of the silver wire before it is sealed inside the dielectric. Once sealed, any further oxidation is prevented but at the cost of locking in an already altered surface layer.

5. Subjective Listening Experience

• Audiophiles often describe cables with air dielectrics as sounding more “open,” “dynamic,” and “natural.” This subjective perception aligns with the reduced interference and lower energy storage effects provided by air as a dielectric.

6. Practical Challenges

• While air dielectrics are theoretically superior, they are harder to implement because they leave conductors exposed to environmental factors like oxidation and mechanical instability. Manufacturers use PTFE because it provides durability and consistency over time, albeit at some cost to sonic performance.

Conclusion

The subjective superiority of silver wire in an air dielectric likely stems from its minimal interaction with the electromagnetic field around the conductor compared to PTFE’s higher dielectric constant and absorption characteristics. Air allows for purer signal propagation with less distortion or smearing of high-frequency details, resulting in what listeners perceive as greater openness and clarity.

However, practical considerations like durability and long-term stability often lead manufacturers to favor PTFE despite its slight compromises in performance. For audiophiles who prioritize sonic purity above all else—and are willing to accept potential challenges like oxidation—air dielectrics remain an appealing choice for achieving optimal sound quality.

 

[PYP]

Let me make it easier for you, I usually use AI to polish my english messages. I doubt anyone here would prefer reading my messages in my native language

good to mention that. hadn't thought about that use of AI.

 

[italia]

What about Monica which employees GPTzero and two or three other AI detectors on a composite analysis basis?

Seems like the Monica thing has favorable reviews this past several months. I can't help but feel like it's a bit of a 'flavor of the day' thing where people have their favorite, and the favorite flavor changes frequently. Perhaps they should be named like hurricanes, in alphabetical order. Monica ... Naomi ... Ophelia ... Penelope ...

"That Penelope b!tch caught my AI post. Sure wish Ophelia was still here!" LOL

 

[DaveC]

Your question is best answered with a simple AI query using Perplexity Pro. In other words, this is well understood electrical theory best addressed through a non biased search result.

For audiophiles who prioritize sonic purity above all else—and are willing to accept potential challenges like oxidation—air dielectrics remain an appealing choice for achieving optimal sound quality.

I think this is an unethical solution. Do you warn customers their silver wire will corrode and their cable will sound worse and worse as time goes by and eventually it'll just be expensive trash?

 

[Ted Denney III]

I think this is an unethical solution. Do you warn customers their silver wire will corrode and their cable will sound worse and worse as time goes by and eventually it'll just be expensive trash?

I think this combined with your lies about using AI mean you're a conman. Not my judgement, it's just the definition of conman:


noun: conman

1. a man who cheats or tricks someone by gaining their trust and persuading them to believe something that is not true.

Dave, we’ve been building cables with Air String geometries for over a decade. Part of our evaluation protocol is listening to Air String geometries in our library that are 1, 2, 3, even 5 years old to determine if anything has deteriorated. There is an extremely slight loss of performance after one year, almost imperceptible. But this does not come close to the performance hit that occurs when PTFE is applied to the same silver conductor, which causes oxidation due to heat present at application, where this corrosion is locked in, and the significant loss of performance from the PTFE dielectric itself.

Prior to Air String geometries, which are handmade in my Southern California factory I might add, we used PTFE dielectrics, and still do on lower-cost cables. However, this is not the best option for ultimate resolution but rather, a faster and less expensive way to build a cable.

 

[DasguteOhr]

Can somebody please ask AI whats the best cable ?

I asked my Uncle Al..bert, boy just no cable is a good cable...use wifi

 

[Al M.]

Like I said, I’ve never heard of you. Never ever, and I’ve been doing this since I was in my 20s, and I’m now 60. And you are completely wrong that an all-encompassing PTFE dielectric around a solid silver conductor is preferable to air. The incursion that the PTFE creates on the electromagnetic transfer—it’s not electrons running down a wire, Dave; it’s the EM field around the wire. That’s what signal is, Dave. And when you put a solid dielectric around the conductor, that impedes the electromagnetic transfer more so than do various types of silver oxide in an air dielectric. In other words, the deleterious effects of PTFE outweigh any negative consequences of silver when it tarnishes in an air dielectric.

The above was verbally dictated to my iPhone, and corrected for punctuation and grammar.

While you may never have heard of Dave, it is clear to me that he is a highly competent cable designer. In repeated shootouts that I witnessed over the years, his ZenWave cables routinely beat more expensive ones from other manufacturers.

All my analog signal cables and all my power cords are from Dave's ZenWave Audio (D4 interconnects, SSR-11 silver ribbon speaker cables, PL-11 power cords, Clear Bass power cords). I am extremely happy with the sound.

Another audio designer who had been skeptical about Dave's ZenWave cables did some cable comparisons last summer upon a visit to my place and he came away being very impressed. He liked Dave's cables the best and congratulated me on my great choice.

 

[Al M.]

And to anyone thinking of buying Dave’s cables, if you’re curious about Synergistic Research cables that occupy similar or lower price points, reach out to me. As a point of honor, I will make certain you can audition my products versus Dave’s products.

That should be fun shootouts.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Ron,
Did you use AI to polish? There is a moderate probability this was at least partially written by AI according to ChatGPT.

What nonsense this is.

No, I have never used AI to polish a draft. I didn't even know AI polishing existed until about a week ago, thanks to this thread.

 

[PeterA]

In the end you will need so many Mods and administrators that cost will go up substantialy .
In due time it will then need a DOGE intervention and AI will be subsequently used anyway

Al has been an audiophile for a long time and never expressed any interest in moderation. He is extremely satisfied with his system.