SOtM sNH-10G Network Switches x2 : The NEW KING of USB/Network Gadget Setup

[asiufy]

Have you tried not connecting the clock cable to SOTM switch and hear the same improvements? The clock input in SOTM IS 10Mhz. I don’t think MSB clock can generate 10 MHz. They are incompatible. One should be using Mutec Ref 10 or CH Precision T1. What you hear the improvement is simply the cleaning of signals by SOTM switch.

adyc,

I did use just the switch for a while, because I had no BNC cable. Slight improvement, fuller bass, nothing dramatic.
Plug the BNC in, and voilà. Magic. You're welcome to come to the store and I'll show you how incompatible they are.

 

[Jetstream]

so back to my original question, since I have an ‘ancient ‘ MSB Diamond DAC V, how would the switch better the gigafoil?

 

[asiufy]

I haven't tried on the DAC V, so I don't know how it's going to behave there. It's still an awesome DAC. Are you using the Renderer with it? Because my tests/results apply only with the use of the Renderer, NOT USB or other ports.
With the Reference DAC, the effect was akin to a clock upgrade, like going from Femto 77 to 33. Even better musical flow, an overall increase in naturalness and smoothness.

 

[adyc]

This is the answer I just got from Jonathan:

No, the Select cannot generate a 10MHz clock. A 10MHz clock is not useful for audio conversion as audio is not recorded at a division of 10MHz.

I assume you got the SOtM switch? This seems to be popular with the need for a 10MHz clock.

Best regards,
Jonathan

 

[asiufy]

Thanks for that.
I stand by what I wrote. It's a significant improvement, with the BNC cable. Without it, it's a minor upgrade.

 

[Jetstream]

I’m using the v2 renderer, so gigafoil, for instance, would go in just before dac

 

[SCAudiophile]

I wrote a thread about 3 months ago : The Best USB/Network Gadget Setup I have auditioned in 2018 : SOtM+Cybershaft+Uptone.
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/thre...itioned-in-2018-sotm-cybershaft-uptone.27025/

It has been surpassed in just 3 months' time!
I listened to the following setup last night :


View attachment 49979

Most of the components used are the same : Cybershaft Limited2 OP20 10M clock, SOtM tx-USBultra usb conditioner, Habst 5N Silver Cryo clock cables & coaxial digital cables; Lessloss C-Marc Supercord with Firewall 64X module, Chord Blu2 for upscaling before entering a Chord DAVE dac ...etc
Please refer to my previous post.

The only difference was that TWO SOtM sNH-10G Network Switches were used.
These audiophile switches have got SFP sockets for optical transceivers.
So they were linked up in-series by a single-mode optical cable.
View attachment 49980

The Cybershaft Limited OP20 has three 10M clock outputs so the two SOtM switches and one SOtM tx-USBultra were clocked/syned by it.

The effect is phenomenal!
Once we have heard the dual-switches config, nobody are willing to go back to single-switch config!

The sonic improvement was in every aspects but most importantly the background quietness.
Suddenly much much more could be heard and the sound becomes so natural.

I am not a tech guy but I speculate that the optical connection has isolated most if not all of the noise coming from the CAS components & home network.

The two SOtM switches and the tx-USBultra clocked/syned by the extremely accurate Cybershaft 10M clock may be acting as reclockers.
An analogy may be the tweak of cascading/stacking multiple Mutec MC3+ together (https://www.mutec-net.com/artikel.php?id=1388254422).

My friends and I also did the following comparison : One SOtM switch+Cybershaft Clock vs Two SOtM switches (no Cybershaft Clock).
We found that the latter performed better! The sound was more natural.

If I can get hold of more SOtM sNH-10G Switches, I will try using three or four of them together for sure!
But of course I expect the Law of Diminishing Returns will kick in.

Anyway I am confident to say that this Dual-SOtM Switches is currently the best CAS network setup I have ever encountered.

That's one very ingenious setup....well done. Thinking it must sound amazing!

 

[Empirical Audio]

I thought the MSB renderer buffered and reclocked, so wouldn’t that take jitter reduction by the switch out of the equation?

In an ideal world, but that's not the world we live in.

 

[Empirical Audio]

And this from the MSB Diamond DAC V Manual

Clock Interface
After years of experimenting with inputting and outputting clocks we now strongly recommend not doing this. A low jitter clock must be physically close to the DACs. There is no lower jitter clock than the MSB clocks, and even if there were, once the clock was transmitted from an external box so much jitter would be introduced in the cable that the clock would be marginal at best. So we are confident that no benefit would be gained from an external clock.
A different set of problems exist with outputting clocks. A paradox is created as a source needs a clock to transmit data, but when the DAC sees the data, which can be at any sample rate, it adjusts the clock to match. No source can handle its clock adjusted on the fly. Only the MSB Transports can handle this as the PRO I2S interface is smart and negotiates the proper clock to be sent back to the transport. But, if you do have a need to access this clock, it can be done.
Within the MSB Network connection is a clock interface that allows multiple Platinum products to be synchronized, allows the Plati- num Clock to be input or output. The interface is a LVDS format clock interface with a signal level of 250 mV pp.
Pin Identification - The pins shown in the figure below are identified as follows: 1. M Clock + (Positive side of balanced Master Clock)
2. M Clock - (Negative side of balanced Master Clock)
Clock Frequencies - The clock can be selected to be either an input, output or turned off in the setup menu. The output frequencies are as follows:
· 44.1, 88.2 or 176.4 kHz sampling frequency source outputs or inputs a clock frequency of 22.5792 MHz · 48, 96 or 192 kHz sampling frequency source outputs or inputs a clock frequency of 24.576 MHz.

I don't buy it. If the cable is the right cable and the clock is the right clock, it should make a difference. The advantage is that the external clock is powered from it's own supply. Ground-loops can be problematic however. There is one created by the coax connection.

Steve N.

 

[microstrip]

Thanks for that.
I stand by what I wrote. It's a significant improvement, with the BNC cable. Without it, it's a minor upgrade.

I am now really confused by this thread.

If the MSB Select II has no 10 MHz clock output and the SOtM Ethernet Switch only accepts 10 MHz external clocks how does connecting both improve sound?

Apologies if I am completely misunderstanding any of the arguments!

 

[Taiko Audio]

I am now really confused by this thread.

If the MSB Select II has no 10 MHz clock output and the SOtM Ethernet Switch only accepts 10 MHz external clocks how does connecting both improve sound?

Apologies if I am completely misunderstanding any of the arguments!

I was wondering about that too, maybe the Sotm just ignores the input and there’s a ground related weird thing going on netting to a positive perception of sound quality? You would expect the opposite but it’s high end

 

[Legolas]

If external clocks are of little use according to MSB, how does the dCS system work, and Esoteric, all those external boxes, up samplers and clocks....

 

[microstrip]

If external clocks are of little use according to MSB, how does the dCS system work, and Esoteric, all those external boxes, up samplers and clocks....

There are many strategies and implementations in DACs. We pick what we find that sounds better or believe that sounds better.

 

[caesar]

Does anyone have any thoughts on the proximity of switch to the equipment? Should it be closer to the modem / router (where the service comes into the house) or closer to one's streamer / server in the listening room? Thanks

 

[ngamountains]

Does anyone have any thoughts on the proximity of switch to the equipment? Should it be closer to the modem / router (where the service comes into the house) or closer to one's streamer / server in the listening room? Thanks

I asked this question of the SoTM engineers at AXPONA. They said put longer cable between router and switch; decent quality CAT7 or better, doesn’t need to be stratospherically expensive. Then use the better, shorter cable such as their high quality (~1-1.5m) cable between switch and streamer/digital player.

 

[Empirical Audio]

Does anyone have any thoughts on the proximity of switch to the equipment? Should it be closer to the modem / router (where the service comes into the house) or closer to one's streamer / server in the listening room? Thanks

You want the best quality shorter cable from the switch to your renderer/server.

 

[Tecknik1]

W4S makes a LPS with multiple outputs, adjustable voltages between 5v & 12v maximum 4 amps I believe. I currently using 2, one for the modem, switch & FMC and the 2nd on the FMC, Aqvox switch near my Melco server. The Aqvox switch as with the SOTM switch which Im very interested in getting sounds best nearest your server or dac.

 

[jackson_k]

I wrote a thread about 3 months ago : The Best USB/Network Gadget Setup I have auditioned in 2018 : SOtM+Cybershaft+Uptone.
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/thre...itioned-in-2018-sotm-cybershaft-uptone.27025/

It has been surpassed in just 3 months' time!
I listened to the following setup last night :


View attachment 49979

Most of the components used are the same : Cybershaft Limited2 OP20 10M clock, SOtM tx-USBultra usb conditioner, Habst 5N Silver Cryo clock cables & coaxial digital cables; Lessloss C-Marc Supercord with Firewall 64X module, Chord Blu2 for upscaling before entering a Chord DAVE dac ...etc
Please refer to my previous post.

The only difference was that TWO SOtM sNH-10G Network Switches were used.
These audiophile switches have got SFP sockets for optical transceivers.
So they were linked up in-series by a single-mode optical cable.
View attachment 49980

The Cybershaft Limited OP20 has three 10M clock outputs so the two SOtM switches and one SOtM tx-USBultra were clocked/syned by it.

The effect is phenomenal!
Once we have heard the dual-switches config, nobody are willing to go back to single-switch config!

The sonic improvement was in every aspects but most importantly the background quietness.
Suddenly much much more could be heard and the sound becomes so natural.

I am not a tech guy but I speculate that the optical connection has isolated most if not all of the noise coming from the CAS components & home network.

The two SOtM switches and the tx-USBultra clocked/syned by the extremely accurate Cybershaft 10M clock may be acting as reclockers.
An analogy may be the tweak of cascading/stacking multiple Mutec MC3+ together (https://www.mutec-net.com/artikel.php?id=1388254422).

My friends and I also did the following comparison : One SOtM switch+Cybershaft Clock vs Two SOtM switches (no Cybershaft Clock).
We found that the latter performed better! The sound was more natural.

If I can get hold of more SOtM sNH-10G Switches, I will try using three or four of them together for sure!
But of course I expect the Law of Diminishing Returns will kick in.

Anyway I am confident to say that this Dual-SOtM Switches is currently the best CAS network setup I have ever encountered.

The Cisco 24-port model has much better internal circuitry than the 8-port model and so is the sonic performance when they are modded by Clones Audio.
I strongly recommend audiophiles to choose the Clones Audio 24-port model (SG112-24 MOD).
I myself am a Clones Audio SG112-24 MOD user.

BTW emplty/idling ethernet sockets can be portals for EMI so Clones Audio has shut down/disconnected the upper row of 12 ethernet ports of the SG112-24 MOD switch.

I am also using the Sotm switch... have the 12 volt version but using an external Linear supply on it. Have been tempted to go dual switch but so happy already. Really good.

Bro ,,, with the SOTM switch , what major difference do you see, is it the back ground darkness or , quality of the SQ ? Also is there a moderate audiophile switch that we should put at the server room ? ( I have my network in a server room and then ethernet cable to the audio room , in the audio room is where I plan to use the SOTM , but what if I just use it as front as possible ?

 

[jackson_k]

I wrote a thread about 3 months ago : The Best USB/Network Gadget Setup I have auditioned in 2018 : SOtM+Cybershaft+Uptone.
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/thre...itioned-in-2018-sotm-cybershaft-uptone.27025/

It has been surpassed in just 3 months' time!
I listened to the following setup last night :


View attachment 49979

Most of the components used are the same : Cybershaft Limited2 OP20 10M clock, SOtM tx-USBultra usb conditioner, Habst 5N Silver Cryo clock cables & coaxial digital cables; Lessloss C-Marc Supercord with Firewall 64X module, Chord Blu2 for upscaling before entering a Chord DAVE dac ...etc
Please refer to my previous post.

The only difference was that TWO SOtM sNH-10G Network Switches were used.
These audiophile switches have got SFP sockets for optical transceivers.
So they were linked up in-series by a single-mode optical cable.
View attachment 49980

The Cybershaft Limited OP20 has three 10M clock outputs so the two SOtM switches and one SOtM tx-USBultra were clocked/syned by it.

The effect is phenomenal!
Once we have heard the dual-switches config, nobody are willing to go back to single-switch config!

The sonic improvement was in every aspects but most importantly the background quietness.
Suddenly much much more could be heard and the sound becomes so natural.

I am not a tech guy but I speculate that the optical connection has isolated most if not all of the noise coming from the CAS components & home network.

The two SOtM switches and the tx-USBultra clocked/syned by the extremely accurate Cybershaft 10M clock may be acting as reclockers.
An analogy may be the tweak of cascading/stacking multiple Mutec MC3+ together (https://www.mutec-net.com/artikel.php?id=1388254422).

My friends and I also did the following comparison : One SOtM switch+Cybershaft Clock vs Two SOtM switches (no Cybershaft Clock).
We found that the latter performed better! The sound was more natural.

If I can get hold of more SOtM sNH-10G Switches, I will try using three or four of them together for sure!
But of course I expect the Law of Diminishing Returns will kick in.

Anyway I am confident to say that this Dual-SOtM Switches is currently the best CAS network setup I have ever encountered.

Bro ,,, so how do you connect the two SOTM together? I see that its a fiber cable so how do you do that , can you please share with us , could it be also because of the fiber cable that it sounded better?

 

[jackson_k]

I wrote a thread about 3 months ago : The Best USB/Network Gadget Setup I have auditioned in 2018 : SOtM+Cybershaft+Uptone.
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/thre...itioned-in-2018-sotm-cybershaft-uptone.27025/

It has been surpassed in just 3 months' time!
I listened to the following setup last night :


View attachment 49979

Most of the components used are the same : Cybershaft Limited2 OP20 10M clock, SOtM tx-USBultra usb conditioner, Habst 5N Silver Cryo clock cables & coaxial digital cables; Lessloss C-Marc Supercord with Firewall 64X module, Chord Blu2 for upscaling before entering a Chord DAVE dac ...etc
Please refer to my previous post.

The only difference was that TWO SOtM sNH-10G Network Switches were used.
These audiophile switches have got SFP sockets for optical transceivers.
So they were linked up in-series by a single-mode optical cable.
View attachment 49980

The Cybershaft Limited OP20 has three 10M clock outputs so the two SOtM switches and one SOtM tx-USBultra were clocked/syned by it.

The effect is phenomenal!
Once we have heard the dual-switches config, nobody are willing to go back to single-switch config!

The sonic improvement was in every aspects but most importantly the background quietness.
Suddenly much much more could be heard and the sound becomes so natural.

I am not a tech guy but I speculate that the optical connection has isolated most if not all of the noise coming from the CAS components & home network.

The two SOtM switches and the tx-USBultra clocked/syned by the extremely accurate Cybershaft 10M clock may be acting as reclockers.
An analogy may be the tweak of cascading/stacking multiple Mutec MC3+ together (https://www.mutec-net.com/artikel.php?id=1388254422).

My friends and I also did the following comparison : One SOtM switch+Cybershaft Clock vs Two SOtM switches (no Cybershaft Clock).
We found that the latter performed better! The sound was more natural.

If I can get hold of more SOtM sNH-10G Switches, I will try using three or four of them together for sure!
But of course I expect the Law of Diminishing Returns will kick in.

Anyway I am confident to say that this Dual-SOtM Switches is currently the best CAS network setup I have ever encountered.

The Cisco 24-port model has much better internal circuitry than the 8-port model and so is the sonic performance when they are modded by Clones Audio.
I strongly recommend audiophiles to choose the Clones Audio 24-port model (SG112-24 MOD).
I myself am a Clones Audio SG112-24 MOD user.

BTW emplty/idling ethernet sockets can be portals for EMI so Clones Audio has shut down/disconnected the upper row of 12 ethernet ports of the SG112-24 MOD switch.

I wrote a thread about 3 months ago : The Best USB/Network Gadget Setup I have auditioned in 2018 : SOtM+Cybershaft+Uptone.
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/thre...itioned-in-2018-sotm-cybershaft-uptone.27025/

It has been surpassed in just 3 months' time!
I listened to the following setup last night :


View attachment 49979

Most of the components used are the same : Cybershaft Limited2 OP20 10M clock, SOtM tx-USBultra usb conditioner, Habst 5N Silver Cryo clock cables & coaxial digital cables; Lessloss C-Marc Supercord with Firewall 64X module, Chord Blu2 for upscaling before entering a Chord DAVE dac ...etc
Please refer to my previous post.

The only difference was that TWO SOtM sNH-10G Network Switches were used.
These audiophile switches have got SFP sockets for optical transceivers.
So they were linked up in-series by a single-mode optical cable.
View attachment 49980

The Cybershaft Limited OP20 has three 10M clock outputs so the two SOtM switches and one SOtM tx-USBultra were clocked/syned by it.

The effect is phenomenal!
Once we have heard the dual-switches config, nobody are willing to go back to single-switch config!

The sonic improvement was in every aspects but most importantly the background quietness.
Suddenly much much more could be heard and the sound becomes so natural.

I am not a tech guy but I speculate that the optical connection has isolated most if not all of the noise coming from the CAS components & home network.

The two SOtM switches and the tx-USBultra clocked/syned by the extremely accurate Cybershaft 10M clock may be acting as reclockers.
An analogy may be the tweak of cascading/stacking multiple Mutec MC3+ together (https://www.mutec-net.com/artikel.php?id=1388254422).

My friends and I also did the following comparison : One SOtM switch+Cybershaft Clock vs Two SOtM switches (no Cybershaft Clock).
We found that the latter performed better! The sound was more natural.

If I can get hold of more SOtM sNH-10G Switches, I will try using three or four of them together for sure!
But of course I expect the Law of Diminishing Returns will kick in.

Anyway I am confident to say that this Dual-SOtM Switches is currently the best CAS network setup I have ever encountered.

Dear CKKEUNG

brother, man you have so many good ideas ! hahahah ! I am also using MUTEC as well with the REF10, and trying to get a better sound with Roon
do you have the best solution?

Currently I am using the AURALIC G2 ,,but ... I don't feel that its sound is that exceptional to be honest. ( I think my MERIDIAN 508 old cd transport is not any worse lol )

So I am trying to figure out whats the best way to build the proper ROON endpoint,For now this is what I am thinking can you give me some advice.

1. SOTM Switch ( possible x2 like you and then sync them all to the REF-10. ) but how do you route the ethernet cable between the two switches? via fiber?
2. All router is down in a server room in my house, should I also do a SOTM at the front end as well ? or should I focus all the power at the Roon end ?
2. SONORE SE -> Sotm USB Ultra and then sync to REF 10 -> Mutec mc3+ ( maybe x2 ) as well , then VIA SPDIF into my DATASAT RS20i ( what USB cable do you use? )

& if we did multiple MC3 , do we connect it via USB or AES? UM... Sorry for all the question man , but I am trying to go all out ,, hahahahah !


but accordingly to my friend at datasat, they say that before it hits the internal dac , it re-clock again so all these re-clocking we did down the front ,,, what does it really compute to ? hahahah ! ,,,

Thank yo brother for all your time !