State of the industry - Roy Gregory Editorial

[Kingrex]

I get Al point. No one watches a video of a static system playing. Maybe 1 or 2 people. But millions watch the Kardashian. Every day. Too see the story.
Jay tells a story. Just like Audiophiliac.

I don't doubt for a second 99% of the US has 0 idea what a stereo is outside Boss or Sonos or McIntosh. And those that do say we are stupid or worse to spend the money on high end gear.

I would venture a guess, and I may be 100% wrong, this is a guess. Music Direct and Upscale make the bulk of their assets of $300 TT and $300 integrated amps and speakers. That is what the rest of the country that enjoys music listens on. And headphones. When I'm on plane, lots of people have headphones. Mostly a $150 with noise cancelling. Or so the ones I ask tell me.

I don't agree with Elliott that video of manufacturer will grow industry recognition and get young people interested.

The Kardashian girls playing a system and.dancing to it would sell equipment. A friend got a plug on Opera. In order to get that plug, he had to have 10,000 boxed and ready to ship product in Operas wearhouse. Operas team knows her audience will grab up that much just by her saying she uses something.

 

[andromedaaudio]

That's your point and it is valid; however, it is not what most posters here (and not the posts referenced) are suggesting. Their point seems to be that posting video recordings of high-end systems will somehow persuade viewers/listeners that better sound is available to them, which seems obviously counter-intuitive to me (and others)

Videos can give an impression , but its hardly a good representative of the real thing.

Thats why dealers are important / real life experience , printed paper / digital reviews / You tube vids only go so far.
I personally go only on real life expirience.
The time that i bought of reviews and took 5 K on the chin after a fast resell are long gone

 

[howiebrou]

If we follow your advice then then high end is doomed as the aging audiophiles will die off.

We must provide a path to gain a younger generation.

I didn't really offer any advice, more commentary on what i think makes people tick these days. In the golden years of hifi there was not that much else available to compete. Nowadays there are so many other things people can get into, most of these things are much cheaper than hi end audio, most are more visible and most are more portable. Therein lies a major problem.

 

[Lee]

I didn't really offer any advice, more commentary on what i think makes people tick these days. In the golden years of hifi there was not that much else available to compete. Nowadays there are so many other things people can get into, most of these things are much cheaper than hi end audio, most are more visible and most are more portable. Therein lies a major problem.

There is more competition for the scarce entertainment dollar. But that is an argument in favor of influencers.

 

[PeterA]

I think the idea of influencing someone with a video of my music system is nonsense. Why would someone watch my video vs. a music video of the performers? Only somebody who’s already an audio geek.

As to sharing music and great sound—its what I love doing...

I got a text late Sunday afternoon from a young woman who wanted to know if the “listening room” was open. Turned out she was thinking of the new “vinyl bar” concept popping up in metro areas, popular in Japan. I tried to see if she was a potential customer before saying the room “could be” open — turned out she was killing time before a flight later in the evening and had been to a vinyl bar in San Diego and had fun. I decided I’d have her by for an hour and play some music, and she was willing to make the drive from town. I admired her chutzpah. Turns out she works with folks in the music industry.

We shared a glass of wine and she was astounded at the sound. (I had the Alsyvox Botticelli setup after Bob.east visited a couple weekends back.)

Tonight, a few folks from the Portland Audio Club stopping by for tunes.

Bob, have you watched any of the system videos from Jay’s audio lab or the visits to Audio shows? People seem to watch those. Are the reviewer‘s and manufacturers who post such videos not trying to influence potential buyers? In the comment section, there are often questions about what the music is? I think it is wrong to conclude that these types of videos don’t attempt to or actually do influence others.

I think it’s pretty cool that you invited that woman to hear your system and even cooler that she approached you to see if she could hear it. I’m not surprised she was astounded. It’s easy to astound people with some of these systems. My non-Audio friends are almost always astounded when they come to my house for a dinner party and I play some music. I am astounded when I watch a movie in my friend MadFloyd‘s home theater.

The challenge is to get those people who are astounded by a $200,000 system to buy a system that even costs $20,000 which will likely not sound as good. The hope is that they buy an entry level system, considered expensive by most people, and then aspire to move up to a much more expensive system.

It seems to me that the industry needs to convince young people that the Technics direct drive turntable or the YGGY DAC are good products worth the money. Then they have to convince them that more expensive turntables and more expensive DACs sound better and are worth the money. Not easy. They can listen to these things with their headphones or even full systems, but do they want to move them around from apartment to apartment or want to listen to a system by themselves when they’re trying to raise their young children in their first house? The young people I know are just interested in other things.

A high-end audio system is not something they really seem to want to aspire to owning. Successful young people aspire to own cool watches and fancy cars.

Imagine if Mike L assembled a decent entry-level music system and spun records in the show rooms of his Honda dealerships. What if people began to realize that a home stereo system can sound better than their car audio system? Just don’t tell them that the entry level system costs half of what a good used Honda costs.

 

[Lee]

I get Al point. No one watches a video of a static system playing. Maybe 1 or 2 people. But millions watch the Kardashian. Every day. Too see the story.
Jay tells a story. Just like Audiophiliac.

I don't doubt for a second 99% of the US has 0 idea what a stereo is outside Boss or Sonos or McIntosh. And those that do say we are stupid or worse to spend the money on high end gear.

I would venture a guess, and I may be 100% wrong, this is a guess. Music Direct and Upscale make the bulk of their assets of $300 TT and $300 integrated amps and speakers. That is what the rest of the country that enjoys music listens on. And headphones. When I'm on plane, lots of people have headphones. Mostly a $150 with noise cancelling. Or so the ones I ask tell me.

I don't agree with Elliott that video of manufacturer will grow industry recognition and get young people interested.

The Kardashian girls playing a system and.dancing to it would sell equipment. A friend got a plug on Opera. In order to get that plug, he had to have 10,000 boxed and ready to ship product in Operas wearhouse. Operas team knows her audience will grab up that much just by her saying she uses something.

I largely agree with you but to be fair to Peter Breuninger, he built a channel that does just this with 34K subscribers and each video regularly gets thousands of views.

 

[howiebrou]

Think about all the rich content we have in the hobby...we have many celebrity audiophiles, we have musicians, we have stories about going to concerts, we have engineers who make the recordings, we have smart and interesting designers of gear, we have cool dealers. There is literally a boat load of material for good stories and otherwise interesting content!

IMHO, if we are relying on these things to attract youth to the industry we might as well give up now.

 

[rbbert]

I largely agree with you but to be fair to Peter Breuninger, he built a channel that does just this with 34K subscribers and each video regularly gets thousands of views.

If the intent is to bring new people into the hobby, then one has to ask the question: Are these viewers already audiophiles, or are at least some of them music lovers being persuaded to (hopefully) acquire better playback systems? And if the latter, is Peter's channel successful in this persuasion?

 

[Elliot G.]

I don't agree with Elliott that video of manufacturer will grow industry recognition and get young people interested.

Rex, I never said that! Please don't put words in my mouth.
My Youtube channel has zero to do with young people or them being interested. My channel is to show the people behind the products and perhaps the viewers to have a better understanding of the people behind the products. I have no expectations that this will induce new young clients since it isn't aimed at them

 

[Lagonda]

I personally don't care if the industry grows, or young people become audiophiles. I am just patiently waiting for all you old folks to kick the bucket, so i can buy your used " reference " equipment and vinyl collections from your spouses, at the price you told them you paid for it !

 

[Gregm]

But influencers? Are you in marketing? A movie star?

Hardly, I am a recruiter used to be in corporate sales & marketing

Who counts as an influencer to you?

Any well-known, and/or trendy person who talks about his audiophile hobby. It seems to me a good way to accelerate consumer awareness and education ('tell me about the hobby'. 'Well, it's all about great music and great sound at home... whenI get some me time...' etc, ad nauseam

 

[Gregm]

I personally don't care if the industry grows, or young people become audiophiles. I am just patiently waiting for all you old folks to kick the bucket, so i can buy your used " reference " equipment and vinyl collections from your spouses, at the price you told them you paid for it !

 

[Lee]

Any well-known, and/or trendy person who talks about his audiophile hobby. It seems to me a good way to accelerate consumer awareness and education ('tell me about the hobby'. 'Well, it's all about great music and great sound at home... whenI get some me time...' etc, ad nauseam

Bingo.

 

[Lee]

IMHO, if we are relying on these things to attract youth to the industry we might as well give up now.

I don't know what to tell you but this approach does not only work, it works well.

 

[gleeds]

Well I think this is part of the problem. If you eliminate vintage gear, I don’t see systems in the magazines for under $20,000 that are being discussed and attracting a new group of audio files. Everyone says these systems exist, but I don’t see people willing to describe them.

I would like to hear a very efficient contemporary speaker with Firstwatt amplification and a decent CD player. Very basic cables. Or they could hook up their iPhones to a DAC. The key is finding a new inexpensive efficient full range speaker and digital source that sounds decent.

 

[PeterA]

Videos can give an impression , but its hardly a good representative of the real thing.

Thats why dealers are important / real life experience , printed paper / digital reviews / You tube vids only go so far.
I personally go only on real life expirience.
The time that i bought of reviews and took 5 K on the chin after a fast resell are long gone

System videos can tell you a lot, but they are no substitute for hearing the actual system. I don't think anyone is arguing otherwise. Few people buy clothes, watches, cars just because they see an influencer mention them, use them, or they see them in a movie placement. But, it expands exposure and interest in the product, and that is where the potential lies with system videos, and show video reports. They go only so far, but they might get you interested in going further. Same with written reviews, or at least it used to be the case. I only know of one person who decided to buy an expensive speaker system based on videos and reputation alone. I suspect he will be very happy with his decision. Much more common is seeing the thing and then wanting to hear it for oneself.

If the power of music and good sound is as convincing as is being suggested here, then what the young and new folks need is exposure. I got that from videos, reading the forum, and then actually traveling and listening. Bonzo is all about expanding his exposure and sharing with others. He opens his eyes and ears, shares the stories and videos. Then some of us become interested by watching and listening and reading. People reached out to me to hear my system after reading about it and watching/hearing my system videos. They then came and heard the system. You can't deny the power of these videos to expand exposure.

 

[PeterA]

There was an AD article on how listening rooms are in vogue now.

Yes, we need more of that.

Lee, I'm not so sure that young music lovers are reading the glossy puff pages of Architectural Digest. Perhaps the readers might influence their partners to seek out and listen to some pretty speakers. Most likely, that article is for the decorators who put rooms like these together. Cables on the floor are going to give them heartburn.

 

[Bobvin]

First and foremost, they must be the type of individuals who actually take time to listen to music. I think if they are always active, always on the move, and always with their earbuds in they are not likely to become audiophiles. Luckily a lot of young people are enjoying vinyl, which is encouraging because there is some ritual and they are likely to listen through an LP, at least one side. That they do it with their friends after toking up, well, not a lot different than when I was young. There were a lot of years, while I had a hiatus from the hobby, that I listened to some pretty crude gear but would still put on a CD, turn down the lights, and enjoy music.

A lot of members of the local audio club do not have spanky systems. Raspberry pi, and DIY DACs, and God knows there are dozens of companies offering small floor standers or bookshelf speakers capable of making pretty decent sound.

if “influencers“ can describe their enjoyment of listening to music, actually taking time to do so, then even a basic entry level system has the potential to turn a listener into an audiophile.

I have young people who work at the coffee stand come by every now and then and listen, they are always amazed of course. A couple of the young men show a lot more interest than the coffee babes, they (the coffee babes) think it’s cool but I doubt cool enough to encourage any action on their own part. Let’s face it, it is damn expensive to live these days, discretionary income for audiogear is exceptionally rare for young people. And there are an awful lot of more “visible“ interests competing for the discretionary dollars.

 

[PeterA]

Exactly. How does watching/listening to a high-end system via MP3 sound through earbuds persuade someone that that high-end system sounds better than streaming MP3 music through earbuds??

It does not, but that is not the point. And one should listen to these videos over headphones or at least the computer speakers. It is about exposure and potential, the visuals, and something cool that they may not have seen before. Some, who actually appreciate what videos can portray, go further, and these folks can tell the better from the worse over video, and pursue the better.

 

[Lee]

Lee, I'm not so sure that young music lovers are reading the glossy puff pages of Architectural Digest. Perhaps the readers might influence their partners to seek out and listen to some pretty speakers.

Yeah I did not make any claim to this being a good idea specifically for young people. But it's still good for the industry that a trendy magazine reaching into new customer segments is mentioning listening rooms.