Sublime Sound

[morricab]

Al, Yes you are mistaken. The speakers I’m talking about are in David’s big room. I’m simply reporting that my impression of the scale from those speakers was bigger more open and more effortless than any speaker system I’ve heard around here. They were high-efficiency cone speakers driven by 18 watts from the ML3 SET amplifier.

That includes the largest system I heard at Goodwins which was the Q7. I can’t explain it and I don’t know why. The Q7 was completely choked perhaps from the MIT cables or some other reason. This was my impression when listening to a jazz recording with trumpet. We played it loud. I never heard anything like that at Goodwins. In fact the scale in your room is generally bigger than what I hear at Goodwins and you have tiny speakers with small drivers.

You can certainly take it with a grain of salt. We might even disagree if we listen to the same thing at the same time with the same music. I’m simply sharing an impression. It is fine if you do not agree.

What model Mitsubishi speaker? I am curious...

 

[jeff1225]

Al, Yes you are mistaken. The speakers I’m talking about are in David’s big room. I’m simply reporting that my impression of the scale from those speakers was bigger more open and more effortless than any speaker system I’ve heard around here. They were high-efficiency cone speakers driven by 18 watts from the ML3 SET amplifier.

That includes the largest system I heard at Goodwins which was the Q7. I can’t explain it and I don’t know why. The Q7 was completely choked perhaps from the MIT cables or some other reason. This was my impression when listening to a jazz recording with trumpet. We played it loud. I never heard anything like that at Goodwins. In fact the scale in your room is generally bigger than what I hear at Goodwins and you have tiny speakers with small drivers.

You can certainly take it with a grain of salt. We might even disagree if we listen to the same thing at the same time with the same music. I’m simply sharing an impression. It is fine if you do not agree.

The Mitsubishi Diatone speaker has a 12" ported bass and is 98 dB efficient. Most examples are 8 ohm but David has somehow managed to find a 16 ohm version. I personally believe that 12" ported bass will sound more dynamic than 12" sealed bass....every time.

 

[Al M.]

Al, Yes you are mistaken. The speakers I’m talking about are in David’s big room.

Ok, please accept my sincere apologies, Peter. That is a totally different ballgame. Yes, I can very well imagine that smaller speakers can sound big in a large room.

I’m simply reporting that my impression of the scale from those speakers was bigger more open and more effortless than any speaker system I’ve heard around here. They were high-efficiency cone speakers driven by 18 watts from the ML3 SET amplifier.

That includes the largest system I heard at Goodwins which was the Q7. I can’t explain it and I don’t know why. The Q7 was completely choked perhaps from the MIT cables or some other reason. This was my impression when listening to a jazz recording with trumpet. We played it loud. I never heard anything like that at Goodwins. In fact the scale in your room is generally bigger than what I hear at Goodwins and you have tiny speakers with small drivers.

Yes, the scale in my room is quite big, and I have heard disappointingly small scale in Goodwin's large room as well, for sure. But for example the Rockport Lyra threw a rather massive scale on large orchestra, against which the scale of my system pales in comparison. The scale was quite astonishing, with a violin section rather convincing in size, for example.

 

[microstrip]

(...) The speakers I’m talking about are in David’s big room. I’m simply reporting that my impression of the scale from those speakers was bigger more open and more effortless than any speaker system I’ve heard around here. They were high-efficiency cone speakers driven by 18 watts from the ML3 SET amplifier. (...)

Peter,

There is nothing that can beat the scale allowed by a very large room when the equipment matches it. I had the pleasure of listening a few times in rooms between 70 and 90 square meters at realistic levels, and although we can build great systems in smaller rooms, IMHO it is very different type of experience.

 

[Lagonda]

Al, Yes you are mistaken. The speakers I’m talking about are in David’s big room. I’m simply reporting that my impression of the scale from those speakers was bigger more open and more effortless than any speaker system I’ve heard around here. They were high-efficiency cone speakers driven by 18 watts from the ML3 SET amplifier.

That includes the largest system I heard at Goodwins which was the Q7. I can’t explain it and I don’t know why. The Q7 was completely choked perhaps from the MIT cables or some other reason. This was my impression when listening to a jazz recording with trumpet. We played it loud. I never heard anything like that at Goodwins. In fact the scale in your room is generally bigger than what I hear at Goodwins and you have tiny speakers with small drivers.

You can certainly take it with a grain of salt. We might even disagree if we listen to the same thing at the same time with the same music. I’m simply sharing an impression. It is fine if you do not agree.

Peter, don't underestimate the difference one of the best TT and front end money can buy makes. You never heard the other systems with this kind of source, they might produce likewise fead the right signal.

 

[ddk]

No, it was this statement:

"David has a pair of vintage Mitsubishi speakers with dynamic drivers that are about 36 inches tall. They provided more scale than any audio system I’ve heard in the Boston area including the biggest systems at Goodwins. Frankly I was astonished. These were not horns and they were not tall."

If I am not mistaken, these were in one of the smaller rooms. Hard to believe they were able to provide a scale greater than anything in Goodwin's large room. I have heard quite massive scale there on orchestral music.

The pair Peter mentioned are in the main listening room. I don’t know what anyone has heard at Goodwin’s and how these compare but scale is one of the qualities of such professional monitors with their relatively large drivers and very high sensitivity. This pair isn’t for sale, no one’s hyping them up nor are they unobtanium it’s just how 50’s & 60’s speakers were these Mitsus are only another representative of the era. Like them or not the sonic delta between the best vintage and modern designs is huge worth hearing sometime in a well sorted system before settling on any salt.

david

 

[Al M.]

The pair Peter mentioned are in the main listening room. I don’t know what you heard at Goodwin’s and how these compare but scale is one of the qualities of such professional monitors with their relatively large drivers and very high sensitivity. This pair isn’t for sale, no one’s hyping them up nor are they unobtanium it’s just how 50’s & 60’s speakers were these Mitsus are only another representative of the era. Like them or not the sonic delta between the best vintage and modern designs is huge worth hearing sometime in a well sorted system before deciding how much salt to take.

david

Thanks, David, the misunderstanding has been cleared up. My bad to react without sufficient information.

 

[PeterA]

What model Mitsubishi speaker? I am curious...

I do not know.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Peter,

There is nothing that can beat the scale allowed by a very large room when the equipment matches it. I had the pleasure of listening a few times in rooms between 70 and 90 square meters at realistic levels, and although we can build great systems in smaller rooms, IMHO it is very different type of experience.

Well Micro, I'm now blessed with an 80 plus sq m room dedicated purely to audio, and it's an absolute Godsend.

 

[PeterA]

Ok, please accept my sincere apologies, Peter. That is a totally different ballgame. Yes, I can very well imagine that smaller speakers can sound big in a large room.



Yes, the scale in my room is quite big, and I have heard disappointingly small scale in Goodwin's large room as well, for sure. But for example the Rockport Lyra threw a rather massive scale on large orchestra, against which the scale of my system pales in comparison. The scale was quite astonishing, with a violin section rather convincing in size, for example.

Understood. We were talking about what I have heard and I never heard those Lyras. I am simply reporting my impressions of systems that I have personally heard not the systems you have heard.

Edit: I responded before seeing all of the other posts. I think the issue is now sorted out amd any misunderstanding Has been resolved.

 

[microstrip]

Well Micro, I'm now blessed with an 80 plus sq m room dedicated purely to audio, and it's an absolute Godsend.

Well, the first thing I would do is finding something else to do there - I perfer non dedicated rooms! My room turns as my office, my audio room and sometimes even as my workshop if the garage is too cold ...

 

[Tango]

I should add that his power cables and cables were like snake pits. No organization or reason, just placed all over the place. I've never seen such a mess behind all the racks.

He is not going to beat me on this regard.

 

[Ron Resnick]

I think we are arguing the fact that the chasm between science and BS is actually quite deep and wide... I could be wrong.

Respectfully, you are wrong -- because no one is arguing science, and because Peter is entitled to his subjective impression.

 

[Lagonda]

Well Micro, I'm now blessed with an 80 plus sq m room dedicated purely to audio, and it's an absolute Godsend.

Marc, you are one of those guys with a long thin one, it's not the same as a wide one

 

[ddk]

What model Mitsubishi speaker? I am curious...

They're one of the earliest R series professional studio monitors Mitsubishi made but I'm not sure of the exact model without the labels. Mitsubishi made them starting from the 50's to I believe late 80's in both two & three way monitors including active and domestic versions. They're pretty common and the pro cabinets outwardly changed very little over the years but each generation is built differently with different generation of drivers and slightly different specs. Early ones were 16 ohm and later ones, I think starting from late 60's or early 70's onwards 4 ohms with 8 ohm versions in between. Kind of like Tannoys Monitor series drivers, there's a difference in character and sound of each generation moving from Black to Silver to Red and finally to Gold.

david

 

[jeff1225]

They're one of the earliest R series professional studio monitors Mitsubishi made but I'm not sure of the exact model without the labels. Mitsubishi made them starting from the 50's to I believe late 80's in both two & three way monitors including active and domestic versions. They're pretty common and the pro cabinets outwardly changed very little over the years but each generation is built differently with different generation of drivers and slightly different specs. Early ones were 16 ohm and later ones, I think starting from late 60's or early 70's onwards 4 ohms with 8 ohm versions in between. Kind of like Tannoys Monitor series drivers, there's a difference in character and sound of each generation moving from Black to Silver to Red and finally to Gold.

david

I have heard a pair of the 8 ohm Diatone 2S-305 and they were very enjoyable. Sound jumped from the speakers, all the equipment was vintage McIntosh. The opposite of audiophile sound.

There are many videos of Diatone set ups on YouTube, they are all in Asia.

 

[Al M.]

Sound jumped from the speakers, all the equipment was vintage McIntosh. The opposite of audiophile sound.

Interesting. Shouldn't any "audiophile sound" be jumping from the speakers? Or are you referring to a rather typical "polite" audiophile sound?

 

[jeff1225]

Interesting. Shouldn't any "audiophile sound" be jumping from the speakers? Or are you referring to a rather typical "polite" audiophile sound?

I’m talking about the overly detailed, fatiguing, solid state sound I hear at shows. Think Spectral on Raidho.

 

[PeterA]

I have heard a pair of the 8 ohm Diatone 2S-305 and they were very enjoyable. Sound jumped from the speakers, all the equipment was vintage McIntosh. The opposite of audiophile sound.

There are many videos of Diatone set ups on YouTube, they are all in Asia.

Jeff, This is more or less how I would describe what I heard. It was also dynamic open big effortless and “natural“ sounding. Tone was beautiful. What surprised me most was the quality of the sound from such small speakers basically pushed up against the wall.

 

[ddk]

I have heard a pair of the 8 ohm Diatone 2S-305 and they were very enjoyable. Sound jumped from the speakers, all the equipment was vintage McIntosh. The opposite of audiophile sound.

There are many videos of Diatone set ups on YouTube, they are all in Asia.

They're not known in the US and I think because of JBL/Altec/Klipsch etc. not many foreign speakers were imported into the US during that era, certainly not the higher end Mitsubishi pro monitors. I've heard many of them in Japan and liked most of the different types. You're right the sound is very lively and free from cabinet influences.

david