The 1st SGM Server EVO Edition in Hong Kong

[bibo01]

Maybe superfluous, but to avoid any confusion, inserting 2 Tplink FMC's is not a straight upgrade for the SGM. I used to use Allied Telesys FMC's, a noticeable qualitative step up over Tplink, with a distributed PC system setup (also referred to as a dual-pc setup, or source-renderer, or source - network audio adapter) before we developed the SGM, but I stopped using them as the SGM was better off without. It was designed as a single box solution not benefitting from all of these setup complicating tweaks. The improvement in playback quality reported here involves a Fibre PCIe card installed directly into the SGM with specific types of SFP modules combined with a high quality switch.

Which FC card with what SFP module were in the end preferred/installed?

 

[Esotar]

Today, I'll do comparison test (SGM 2015 EVO vs Metronome T6 Signature)

Actually, this comparison is not fair, because EVO is more expensive than T6 Sig.

Price difference is $ 5,680.

To be fair,

SGM 2015 EVO : Korean Digital Power Cable (about $ 870)

LH 20G USB 0.8m (about $ 1,470)

Korean Group buy Cat. 7 Lan cable (about $ 175)

Total : about $ 2,515


T6 Signature : Entreq Atlantis Digital Power Cable S II (about $ 9,800)

Entreq Olympus Grounding Cable (about $ 1,950)

Entreq Olympus Minimus (about $ 2,600)

Siltech Golden Eagle AES /EBU Cable (about $ 4,770)

Total : about $ 19,120



I think it's fair. How about you??

In this test, about 20 Korean audiophiles are visited.

SGM 2015 EVO playback file format : FLAC (16 bit / 44.1 KHz)

T6 Signature : Red Book CD (16 bit / 44.1KHz)

DAC : Trinity DAC

Amps : Mark Levinson old flagship models (I don't know model name.)

Speakers : Korean brand MSD Planet (Accuton Dia / Ceramic mid / Ceramic bass)


After 6 hours, I'll update the result~!

 

[Sablon Audio]

Today, I'll do comparison test (SGM 2015 EVO vs Metronome T6 Signature)

Actually, this comparison is not fair, because EVO is more expensive than T6 Sig.

Price difference is $ 5,680.

To be fair,

SGM 2015 EVO : Korean Digital Power Cable (about $ 870)

LH 20G USB 0.8m (about $ 1,470)

Korean Group buy Cat. 7 Lan cable (about $ 175)

Total : about $ 2,515


T6 Signature : Entreq Atlantis Digital Power Cable S II (about $ 9,800)

Entreq Olympus Grounding Cable (about $ 1,950)

Entreq Olympus Minimus (about $ 2,600)

Siltech Golden Eagle AES /EBU Cable (about $ 4,770)

Total : about $ 19,120



I think it's fair. How about you??

In this test, about 20 Korean audiophiles are visited.

SGM 2015 EVO playback file format : FLAC (16 bit / 44.1 KHz)

T6 Signature : Red Book CD (16 bit / 44.1KHz)

DAC : Trinity DAC

Amps : Mark Levinson old flagship models (I don't know model name.)

Speakers : Korean brand MSD Planet (Accuton Dia / Ceramic mid / Ceramic bass)


After 6 hours, I'll update the result~!

@Esotar, if you define fair as being equivalent price then you should at least optimise the settings of the HQP software in the SGM for the dac eg choice of filters / upsampling rates etc. That costs nothing and makes a significant difference.

I would however suggest that the modest power and lan cabling you are using on the SGM in order to equalise prices will hold it back from delivering its full potential. Ultimately, I suspect that is what the listeners will want to hear and would be more representative of what typical owners would themselves use.

 

[Esotar]

@Esotar, if you define fair as being equivalent price then you should at least optimise the settings of the HQP software in the SGM for the dac eg choice of filters / upsampling rates etc. That costs nothing and makes a significant difference.

I would however suggest that the modest power and lan cabling you are using on the SGM in order to equalise prices will hold it back from delivering its full potential. Ultimately, I suspect that is what the listeners will want to hear and would be more representative of what typical owners would themselves use.

You're right~!

Yesterday I requested Emile to make EVO only 16 bit / 44.1KHz output.

CDT and EVO are same each other.

I also agree with your opinion.

But to make perfectly fair situation is impossible for me.

EVO's all filters are off, and cables are all entry products except LH 20G DE USB cable.

Actually I did another comparison tests.

vs Aurender W20

vs Klimax

I think music servers comparison is meaningless.

EVO is much better than others.

I want to borrow Kalista CDT but I can't do that.

Korean audiophiles are almost not rich.

I wish to compare CDT, at result T6 Signature is chosen.

 

[CKKeung]

You're right~!
Actually I did another comparison tests.
vs Aurender W20
vs Klimax
I think music servers comparison is meaningless.
EVO is much better than others.

I want to borrow Kalista CDT but I can't do that.
Korean audiophiles are almost not rich.
I wish to compare CDT, at result T6 Signature is chosen.

Hello Esotar,

I did a similar comparison in 2016 : SGMS2015 Server vs Metronome Calypso Reference CD transport.
Again, the Trinity DAC was used.

I reported it on a Hong Kong audiophile forum : http://www.hiendy.com/hififorum/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=99772&highlight=sgms
(It's in Chinese so you may have to use Google Translate).

The summary in English is here : #171 of https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/sound-galleries-sgm-2015.20899/page-9#post-422918

That the SGM EVO being so much improved over the older SGMS2015, my speculation is that your Metronome transport will be KOed easily.

BTW a group of audiophile friends of mine in Hong Kong will organize a gathering to compare the SGM EVO vs the new Metronome flagship DreamPlay CD Transport in Nov.
I shall write a report on WBF.

 

[Esotar]

Hello Esotar,

I did a similar comparison in 2016 : SGMS2015 Server vs Metronome Calypso Reference CD transport.
Again, the Trinity DAC was used.

I reported it on a Hong Kong audiophile forum : http://www.hiendy.com/hififorum/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=99772&highlight=sgms
(It's in Chinese so you may have to use Google Translate).

The summary in English is here : #171 of https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/sound-galleries-sgm-2015.20899/page-9#post-422918

That the SGM EVO being so much improved over the older SGMS2015, my speculation is that your Metronome transport will be KOed easily.

BTW a group of audiophile friends of mine in Hong Kong will organize a gathering to compare the SGM EVO vs the new Metronome flagship DreamPlay CD Transport in Nov.
I shall write a report on WBF.

Great~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'll expect your comparison test~!!!!!!!

Because Korea is very poor country, no audiophiles have New Kalista CDT.

Please test them and update the result.

I'll wait for your result~!!!

 

[CKKeung]

@Esotar, if you define fair as being equivalent price then you should at least optimise the settings of the HQP software in the SGM for the dac eg choice of filters / upsampling rates etc. That costs nothing and makes a significant difference.
I would however suggest that the modest power and lan cabling you are using on the SGM in order to equalise prices will hold it back from delivering its full potential. Ultimately, I suspect that is what the listeners will want to hear and would be more representative of what typical owners would themselves use.

I agree with Emile.
An important advantage of SGM servers is that its onboard playback software HQPlayer is highly "tunable".
Every DACs have its own preferred digital resolution input that it gives the best performance.
HQPlayer can be tuned to optimize the performance of the pairing DAC.

For Trinity DAC, the best resolution for it is definitely NOT 16/44.1.

Also, if the cables for the SGM EVO are too far away from the top level, they will become the bottlenecks!

 

[marslo]

Imho the reason to go files and expensive servers is to enter the world of high resolution, native dsd and Studio Master recordings.
If someone want to listen exlusively to pcm 16/44,1 then cd players are just fine.
So the idea to downgrade the playback capabilities of SGM or any other audiophile server to make a comparison with cd transport is for me meaningless.
Audio is not about money only, is more about synergy and music reproduction potential of any format or source.
For me a fair test would be to compare T6 with best cables and tweaks available with best settings of SGM Evo and the best files available to the DAC having the possibility of DSD 512 fs , for example T+A DAC 8.
And we know already the result

 

[CKKeung]

Imho the reason to go files and expensive servers is to enter the world of high resolution, native dsd and Studio Master recordings.
If someone want to listen exlusively to pcm 16/44,1 then cd players are just fine.
So the idea to downgrade the playback capabilities of SGM or any other audiophile server to make a comparison with cd transport is for me meaningless.
Audio is not about money only, is more about synergy and music reproduction potential of any format or source.
For me a fair test would be to compare T6 with best cables and tweaks available with best settings of SGM Evo and the best files available to the DAC having the possibility of DSD 512 fs , for example T+A DAC 8.
And we know already the result

Agree with Marslo,
I don't think we should chop off an arm from SGM EVO then send it to the shootout.

Both the Metronome transport and SGM EVO should compete with their best forms!

 

[Sablon Audio]

Imho the reason to go files and expensive servers is to enter the world of high resolution, native dsd and Studio Master recordings.
If someone want to listen exlusively to pcm 16/44,1 then cd players are just fine.
So the idea to downgrade the playback capabilities of SGM or any other audiophile server to make a comparison with cd transport is for me meaningless.
Audio is not about money only, is more about synergy and music reproduction potential of any format or source.
For me a fair test would be to compare T6 with best cables and tweaks available with best settings of SGM Evo and the best files available to the DAC having the possibility of DSD 512 fs , for example T+A DAC 8.
And we know already the result

Fwiw Marslo the T+A dac sounds even better on 128dsd using the XTR filter setting than any of the 512 options. This setting is however very demanding on processing power (and dissipating the resulting heat) and the original SGM can only manage 128 frequency though the new Evo with its more recent processor can achieve 256.

 

[marslo]

Fwiw Marslo the T+A dac sounds even better on 128dsd using the XTR filter setting than any of the 512 options. This setting is however very demanding on processing power (and dissipating the resulting heat) and the original SGM can only manage 128 frequency though the new Evo with its more recent processor can achieve 256.

Thank you, good to know. For time being I am in the camp af native playback without upsampling or format conversion and wait for new W20 with RJ 45 to feed my PAC.
But I remember my visit at Geoffrey’s Sound Gallery in Monaco when SGM with T+A DAC 8 playing 512 fs impressed me.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Which FC card with what SFP module were in the end preferred/installed?

There are currently 2 FC cards of interest, a Startech 1Gb SFP card in the USD ~200 vicinity, very good performer with a specific driver and ample burn-in, I'm using it with Startech Single mode 1550nm 80Km SFP modules. The other is a solarflare 10Gb SFP+ card (which can also operate at 1Gb speeds) in the USD 1000-1500 range, that one is much more advanced design with Stratum 3 compliant clocking, ultra low latency and a whole lot of intelligence on board. These features need to be configured to work and I'm still testing it. First impressions are final results are dominated by SFP module quality. Ben of Volent Audio Hong Kong has advanced even further on SFP module testing, he has a whole range in his shop where you can compare them. There's personal taste involved on these, bugger!

 

[Taiko Audio]

Amps : Mark Levinson old flagship models (I don't know model name.)

Those look like No. 20, 20.5 or 20.6. Highly collectible items and hard to find in good shape!

 

[Taiko Audio]

Agree with Marslo,
I don't think we should chop off an arm from SGM EVO then send it to the shootout.

Both the Metronome transport and SGM EVO should compete with their best forms!

Afaik they will be comparing both bit perfect and upsampling!

 

[microstrip]

There are currently 2 FC cards of interest, a Startech 1Gb SFP card in the USD ~200 vicinity, very good performer with a specific driver and ample burn-in, I'm using it with Startech Single mode 1550nm 80Km SFP modules. The other is a solarflare 10Gb SFP+ card (which can also operate at 1Gb speeds) in the USD 1000-1500 range, that one is much more advanced design with Stratum 3 compliant clocking, ultra low latency and a whole lot of intelligence on board. These features need to be configured to work and I'm still testing it. First impressions are final results are dominated by SFP module quality. Ben of Volent Audio Hong Kong has advanced even further on SFP module testing, he has a whole range in his shop where you can compare them. There's personal taste involved on these, bugger!

Is the sound quality of the SGM EVO when playing from its SSD sensitive to the quality of the net card? Or are you addressing playback from a NAS?

 

[microstrip]

Imho the reason to go files and expensive servers is to enter the world of high resolution, native dsd and Studio Master recordings.
If someone want to listen exlusively to pcm 16/44,1 then cd players are just fine.
So the idea to downgrade the playback capabilities of SGM or any other audiophile server to make a comparison with cd transport is for me meaningless.
Audio is not about money only, is more about synergy and music reproduction potential of any format or source.
For me a fair test would be to compare T6 with best cables and tweaks available with best settings of SGM Evo and the best files available to the DAC having the possibility of DSD 512 fs , for example T+A DAC 8.
And we know already the result

Sorry I do not think it is meaningless for most of us. 95% of the music I enjoy and listen exists in red book. So I am interested in information concerning sound reproduction and comparisons in this format.

The main question for me is that the synergy of matching transports and DACs when properly paired and inserted in a system seem to surpass the quality of servers in redbook. And reproduction of SACDs in systems connected with proprietary links that allow transmission of data can be a challenge to any server.

Can you comment on the part I quoted in bold?

 

[Taiko Audio]

Is the sound quality of the SGM EVO when playing from its SSD sensitive to the quality of the net card? Or are you addressing playback from a NAS?

It affects everything.

 

[marslo]

Sorry I do not think it is meaningless for most of us. 95% of the music I enjoy and listen exists in red book. So I am interested in information concerning sound reproduction and comparisons in this format.

The main question for me is that the synergy of matching transports and DACs when properly paired and inserted in a system seem to surpass the quality of servers in redbook. And reproduction of SACDs in systems connected with proprietary links that allow transmission of data can be a challenge to any server.

Can you comment on the part I quoted in bold?

I can say only for myself.
I play on regular base:
A/cds and sacds from La Fontaine,
B/hires pcm ( very often Studio Master) and dsd both from sacd ( ripped with Pioneer BDP 160) and native dsd from W20 to Pacific ( before to B7 )
C/ vinyls on weekends.
Since a few month I may compare it to streaming of MQA files from Tidal .
Altough is only for fun I will rank as follows in 10 points scale
1. Bad cds and regular Tidal streaming, bad vinyl : 3-5
2. Good cds , average MQA and RB PCM : 4-7
3. Regular hires pcm , sacd from La Fontaine, ripps of sacd, regular vinyl: 5-8
4. Good vinyls, Studio Master pcm, best sacd, dsd from mother tapes: 6-9
5. Best vinyls, native dsd , best hires pcm 8-10
Native dsd from Fonè , HRx from RR and exceptional vinyls: 10+

I play also cds to Pacific from La Fontaine as a transport ( Esoteric VRDS Neo) using BNC connection, better than La Fontaine alone but SM PCM from W20 is better imho.


In my system , for my ears, for approx 2000 albums: 200 sacd, 50 native dsd , 100 PCM SM, 250 hires pcm , 300 vinyls, the rest - RB both as cds and ripps to flac and wav( better) with dbPoweramp in slowest mode.
Mainly classical, jazz , Polish and French music.
I purchase SM PCM from Qobuz, eclassical and Hyperion.
Native dsd files from nativedsd.com.

 

[microstrip]

I can say only for myself.
I play on regular base:
A/cds and sacds from La Fontaine,
B/hires pcm ( very often Studio Master) and dsd both from sacd ( ripped with Pioneer BDP 160) and native dsd from W20 to Pacific ( before to B7 )
C/ vinyls on weekends.
Since a few month I may compare it to streaming of MQA files from Tidal .
Altough is only for fun I will rank as follows in 10 points scale
1. Bad cds and regular Tidal streaming, bad vinyl : 3-5
2. Good cds , average MQA and RB PCM : 4-7
3. Regular hires pcm , sacd from La Fontaine, ripps of sacd, regular vinyl: 5-8
4. Best vinyls, Studio Master pcm, best sacd, dsd from mother tapes: 6-9
5. Best vinyls, native dsd , best hires pcm 8-10
Native dsd from Fonè and exceptional vinyls: 10+

I play also cds to Pacific from La Fontaine as a transport using BNC connection, better than La Fontaine alone but SM PCM from W20 is better imho.


In my system , for my ears, for approx 2000 albums: 200 sacd, 50 native dsd , 150 PCM SM, 300 hires pcm , 300 vinyls, the rest RB both as cds and ripps to flac and wav( better) with dbPoweramp in slowest mode.
Mainly classical, jazz , Polish and French music.
I purchase SM PCM from Qobuz, eclassical and Hyperion.
Native dsd files from nativedsd.com.

Thanks. Do you have technical details how the Fone 10+ are recorded? Can you tell us which belong to this list? I would love to know more about this label.

 

[marslo]

Thanks. Do you have technical details how the Fone 10+ are recorded? Can you tell us which belong to this list? I would love to know more about this label.

Francisco,
Fonè is recording with old tube Neumann mics from Abbey Road studios using ADC from DCS and Pyramix soft ( Merging).
The nativedsd.com and Sound Liaison are the only two who give the details of the equipment and native sampling rate.Eclassical give the native sampling rate only.
Here you have an example:
https://fonerecords.nativedsd.com/albums/who-cares


Digital ConvertersCSMastering Engineer:recorded live in Stereo DSDMicrophones:Neumann U47, U48, M49Producer:Giulio Cesare RicciRecording Engineer:Giulio Cesare RicciRecording location:Hotel Il Castello - Palazzo di Scoto di Semifonte, Crtaldi Alto (Fi)Recording Type & Bit RateSD64