Videos - oomph, tympani, menace, power

[Ron Resnick]

Sorry, Peter, I should've just posted the current list here.

 

[bonzo75]

This is simply the very common situation of "we don't know what we don't know." Please go visit any three of the analog-based rooms + systems in my top tier, and then let's talk.

That thread train wrecked pretty quickly, so you can take your top tier rooms back to that thread, please. This is a videos thread. If you have any videos from them, please post them here

 

[Ron Resnick]

Do you have any videos from your visits of those systems to compare to the video of this system from Munich?

No; you know I believe that trying to understand the sound of analog playback from an unfamiliar system in an unfamiliar room through the digital recording of that analog playback is nonsensical.

 

[bonzo75]

No; you know I believe that trying to understand the sound of analog playback from an unfamiliar system in an unfamiliar room through the digital recording of that analog playback is nonsensical.

Please take this off this thread. It has been discussed for 5 years don’t ruin this please. This thread is for video posting as specified

 

[wil]

Mahler 1 3rd Mvmnt (partial)
Karel Ančerl with the Česká Filharmonie on the Czechoslovakian Supraphon label, Ctalog Nbr. 50675 made in 1966

This is from a early part of the Third Movement after the second(?) Frère Jacques / Bruder Martin theme. Mahler has an amazing talent for going from the sublime and beautiful to roaring crescendos and back.

I found this to be a top-notch recording. It is clear and open with all sections and instruments accessible. The backing rhythm section of lower bass strings, timpani, trombones, horns can be heard and followed while they ride beneath the featured woodwinds and strings. The famous oboe 'cuckoo' has a different interesting tone. It's a treat. I found it on Discogs.

For interest, I recorded the "bombast" section of the above from about 1:25 to 5:20. This is from the San Francisco w/ Tilson-Thomas. Very different recordings and systems.

Other than large choral recordings, there nothing like Mahler when he lets loose with the massed strings, blaring horns, etc to test a audio system in a room.

Tima's recording seems to reflect a big sound with gut punching bass. The tympani resonate and give nice spatial dimension. Sounds good.

The Tilson-Thomas recording has a more light on it's feet character which I also appreciate. All of his Mahler symphony recordings are worth listening to.

 

[PeterA]

I asked the question if there is a contemporary speaker amplifier combination that presents music like this WE system. I’ve gone through the thread to look up videos with oomph and menace and power. There are some good ones. For comparison, here is a video of Stehno’s system which appears regularly in this thread as an example of a contemporary system playing the same music. Perhaps others with contemporary systems could share videos of this same symphony.

 

[tima]

This but also there is an ease, an effortlessness to the presentation. There is no strain, no spotlighting, no thinness. The balance seems right and my attention goes right to the music rather than to the system.

effortlessness and no strain are part of what I meant by confidence, but those are good words too. music superceding system is part of authority, so we are in agreement.

 

[tima]

Other than large choral recordings, there nothing like Mahler when he lets loose with the massed strings, blaring horns, etc to test a audio system in a room.

Tima's recording seems to reflect a big sound with gut punching bass. The tympani resonate and give nice spatial dimension. Sounds good.

The Tilson-Thomas recording has a more light on it's feet character which I also appreciate. All of his Mahler symphony recordings are worth listening to.

Yes. I have most of the. T-T Mahler set; it was a big deal when it came out. His lieder with Thomas Hampson are excellent. If I have the M 1 I will record it for a compare.

From Tchaikovsky onward, Mahler and other ~1880-1930 'romantic' era orchestral composers have plenty of melodic and beautiful passages and movements to go with the 'oomph timpani' parts. We should have a thread for system videos of those.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Hello Peter,

Are the stereo systems in each of these videos playing back the same exact recording?

 

[tima]

Excuses, excuses, excuses. That's what I hear from you and others here.

Fact is, you claimed there was no thinness, and there is on the brass in the WE video. I don't care what the reason is for that, but there is thinness, no doubt.

I don't think pointing out that one recording is from reproduction and one is from a live performance is an excuse. Reproduction is not reality nor intends to be. We can describe the differences between the two but it seems pointless or at least unfitting to fault a reproduction because it is not reality..

I should ask: what is your playback system for youtube videos?

 

[morricab]

Hello Peter,

Are the stereo systems in each of these videos playing back the same exact recording?

Same piece of music but different performance and recording I think.

 

[tima]

Other than large choral recordings, there nothing like Mahler when he lets loose with the massed strings, blaring horns, etc to test a audio system in a room.

Yes, Mahler is a genius. Shostakovich is another for large scale.

Since you mention large choral - which I love - I'm gonna take a gamble here. This may not be well received and probably is not music many care for. We'll see what happens. I was reluctant to publish as I doubt most people have the playback system to do it justice. The music is fantastic. Last part of the Kyrie and first part of the Dies Irae, ranges from ppp to ffff. The outset of the latter is massive, huge -- the strongest, most dynamic choral+orchestra music that I know. Gigantic timpani and bass drum attack with brass and choir, around 06:30 but listen from the start to appreciate the effect.

Verdi Requiem - Fritz Reiner, Vienna Philharmonic, RCA Victor – LDS-6091, 1960, Soria Series.

The two LP set comes in a clothbound slipcase box having a rounded right-side edge that looks like a leather book spine. With a 20-page book containing 4 hand-tipped color illustrations. It is a delightful presentation.

There are some clicks early on but not too bad for a 74 yr old record.
Turn it up!

 

[Rexp]

For interest, I recorded the "bombast" section of the above from about 1:25 to 5:20. This is from the San Francisco w/ Tilson-Thomas. Very different recordings and systems.

Other than large choral recordings, there nothing like Mahler when he lets loose with the massed strings, blaring horns, etc to test a audio system in a room.

Tima's recording seems to reflect a big sound with gut punching bass. The tympani resonate and give nice spatial dimension. Sounds good.

The Tilson-Thomas recording has a more light on it's feet character which I also appreciate. All of his Mahler symphony recordings are worth listening to.

I find it a tad bright/fatiguing, the 24/96 version on Tidal doesn't sound bright. I believe it was originally recorded in DSD. Which version are you playing?

 

[Ron Resnick]

Same piece of music but different performance and recording I think.

If that's true, it should be obvious to any non-novice that one cannot understand even in the rooms the differences between two different high-end audio playback systems by using two different recordings. A fortiori one cannot understand from digital video recordings of audio playback the differences between two different high-end audio playback systems by using two different recordings. The latter, especially, should be obviously non-sensical.

 

[Al M.]

I don't think pointing out that one recording is from reproduction and one is from a live performance is an excuse. Reproduction is not reality nor intends to be. We can describe the differences between the two but it seems pointless or at least unfitting to fault a reproduction because it is not reality..

The statement was made that there is "no thinness". This was not put into relative context, and thus I treated it as a statement made without reservations. I could hear something was wrong with the brass in the WE video already before I was looking up the video of the live performance for comparison. In particular the bleached-out, whitish color of the brass on the WE video grabbed my attention negatively.

Also, while I do not expect reproduction ever to capture the color and weight of brass in the most extreme instances of live sound with extraordinary color and weight *) (the live performance video does not capture that either, not even close), I would hope that a system, on a suitable recording, should come at least relatively close to correctly portraying color and weight of brass in an average live situation in a good hall from an average good seat.

I should ask: what is your playback system for youtube videos?

Laptop and headphones. Good enough to hear where system videos go wrong.

_______________________

*) I will never forget the truly enormous body in the sound of brass in Shostakovich's 4th symphony as heard from the first balcony close to the orchestra in Boston Symphony Hall played by the Boston Symphony Orchestra under Andris Nelsons some 6 or 7 years ago. But that was absolutely extreme (and also extremely loud); I have never heard such body in the sound before or since.

 

[Kingrex]

Is there a woofer design someone could make in a shop that would pair well with a wood multicell horn?

 

[Rexp]

If that's true, it should be obvious to any non-novice that one cannot understand even in the rooms the differences between two different high-end audio playback systems by using two different recordings. A fortiori one cannot understand from digital video recordings of audio playback the differences between two different high-end audio playback systems by using two different recordings. The latter, especially, should be obviously non-sensical.

Oh, so you now think comparing two analog systems, using the same recording via YouTube is not non-sensical?

 

[tima]

If that's true, it should be obvious to any non-novice that one cannot understand even in the rooms the differences between two different high-end audio playback systems by using two different recordings. A fortiori one cannot understand from digital video recordings of audio playback the differences between two different high-end audio playback systems by using two different recordings. The latter, especially, should be obviously non-sensical.

This is a thread for posting videos related to the thread topic, not for arguing about the usefulness of videos -- we know your position on that as you post it everywhere.

 

[tima]

Is there a woofer design someone could make in a shop that would pair well with a wood multicell horn?

way off topic

 

[wil]

I find it a tad bright/fatiguing, the 24/96 version on Tidal doesn't sound bright. I believe it was originally recorded in DSD. Which version are you playing?

This is the Qobuz version 24/96. First 3 minutes of the movement #4. I agree at some points it's has some unfortunate bite where the piccolos and violins go crazy together . In room, that's less an issue but still there. I've listened to other Qobuz recordings of the movement which have more bass but at a cost in some transparency elsewhere. Tim's recording has spectacular bass and I may prefer overall but there are several short sections also where the peaking violins and demonic piccolos sound harsh. It's a demanding stretch of very aggressive music.

Would be curious for you to post the Tidal version here.