VYGER ATLANTIS MK IV
- Thread starter andrewbrownstone
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Nope. Chris only did the videos of the new set up for me to see that he got the Atlantis up and running. As you can see by the room it is not video ready. When we move the system to the new location only the Indian Signature will be in the M9 room.
Again, this was the second album played with this new out of the box cartridge.
Chris and I talked about it and the M9 videos that I posted don't even come close to the in-room experience. We decided if anyone would like to hear the M9s they can schedule an audition either in Hayward or Dallas.
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I think the main dependent variable here is psychoacoustics.
Having studied this topic.. tediously for many years against this context what is said is impossible, we can sit 2 people of similar vectors within a room and their listening experience will be different.
That being said, we can use some analysis to see what is happening in the signal path.
first we need to understand the quality of our source, in a Goldilocks scenario our source will be perfect so we must then look at how we are to evaluate the next step in that path.
Notwithstanding attenuation let’s assume that we are able to attenuate the signal and affect volume without colouring the signal, let’s look at amplification. I am happy to get very technical here but let’s keep it light, music is not sinusoidal it is for the sake of argument square wave, also bearing in mind a wave is not what something is it is what something does, the signal will pass through many components (transinductance, voltage and unity gain stages to keep it simple) of which the signal will be elementally exposed to different affects.
what we want to do is create a system that is, for the best part not coloured by these mechanical forces and produce a sound that is a close, in context to our ability to relate the psychoacoustic experience to our memory of how that might sound if we were to hear it live, which also carries the burden of its own organic distortion.
long story short there are ways to ensure that the signal at source is within a parameter of acceptance to the output including the speaker, this however is wholly subjective based on our own unique preference in sound signature, you just may not like a perfect source.. but this is a circular argument easily used as the straw man.
I would never speak on behalf of my good friend Bob however his statement is as valid as any other, the human ear and brain is very complex and capable of discerning a broad spectrum and quality, this is empirically accurate to a standard that we all accept there are certain devices that are special in their ability to reproduce sound accurately, and this does not need a long lab session in order to be true..
I would equally not discount the subjective nature of opinion, as this is an independent variable we have to factor in when you are dealing with guys with so much listening experience having heard multiple systems in multiple configurations in multiple spaces all of which are equally independent variables.
You may argue Carlos which you would have every right to do so, that is it these independent variables that go to your point, however there are some inalienable facts about HiFi we cannot or must not ignore and this goes to what Bob said. His conviction does come from MANY years of listening experience and should hold value, it is a logical fallacy to believe otherwise as any lab testing we did would always be subject to Schröddinger and his pesky cat.
Björn
Hello Gents, I am seriously interested to buy the Atlantis. I am in contact with Vyger and it looks like they are a very nice Team. But reading about the turntable in the different Forums (and Mr. Fremer) I am concerned about the reliability of the Table. Any advice? Jan
I cannot speak to the past reliability issues that seem to attach the Vyger turntables, but I am aware the history seems to be of a fussy and finicky nature not unlike a Ferrari or Jaguar e-type (XK-E) auto. Getting one of those autos perfectly in-tune was a labor of love worth the effort in ultimate performance. Having owned a Vyger Atlantis v4 with Titan controller now for a couple of years I have no way to relate to the fussy nature attributed to prior versions. (Even though I am aware of many who never had any troubles at all.)
The Vyger design seems quite complex, yet actuality really isn’t. Though I must say I continue to be somewhat astonished there is both vacuum hold-down at the same time there is levitation of the platter! The performance is attributed, I believe, to the execution of extreme tolerances and the underlying knowledge of both Giuseppe and Bjorn understanding all the forces and vectors and balancing same.
My own journey was marred by some shipping damages (can happen to any piece of equipment regardless of cross-town or across the globe) that took a little time to sort out, but once I had the table assembled and dialed in it has performed perfectly and without hiccup.
Did I mention the sound? The Vyger has offered the single biggest sonic upgrade in my audiophile journey of nearly 50 years. Many have commented on the bass and dynamics, but there is also flow and the sense of a grounded foundation the music is built on. (I’m not a reviewer - my prose might make sense only to myself.)
One very interesting thing has been the ability to dial in the sense of dynamics and transient attack. When I first set up the table, I adjusted the air pressure for the arm to be .9 bar (as recommended). When I started playing records, the dynamics seemed almost unreal to me, too much as compared to my AMG turntable. I mentioned this to Bob in NYC and he recommended I dial the air pressure down to .82 bar. I also mentioned to Giuseppe and he said “you simply have not ever experienced the kinds of dynamics embedded in your vinyl.” I did dial the pressure down as suggested and over many months have slowly increased the pressure and I am now at .92 bar the dynamics and transient attacks are explosive. I am amazed how varying the air pressure cushion the vision tonearm rides on has such an effect on dynamics. I haven’t gone further — the Titan controller allows for a range between.8 and 1.2 bar — I have settled at .92. Perhaps I’ll get curious and tinker further. I don’t know of any other table or tonearm with this kind of adjustability.
Disclaimer: I represent Vyger through my affiliation with Rhapsody.Audio (NYC)
As Bob says we represent Rhapsody, so take it all in proper context - My Atlantis with the new controller and pump/vac box has been working perfectly for the last 1.5 years. Whenever I turn it on, it just works. The sound is as good as I would ever ask my vinyl to sound. I'm a happy camper.
I've had lengthy conversations with Björn, the TITAN designer. He is a very impressive, real-deal engineer!
It doesn't surprise me that whatever he designed and built is working perfectly.
It doesn't surprise me that whatever he designed and built is working perfectly.
This is why I am interested in this fantastic looking turntable. I had on my list also the Bergmann Galder Signature and the Techdas Airforce III but somehow I am more fascinated by Vyger
I do the same with my air linear tracker, dialing in the air pressure makes a big difference, you can increase the tightness of the bearing, but only by manual adjustment. Additionally i can change the character of the bass response with changing padle dept and viscosity of the silicone fluid in the front trough. But i still want a VYGER, they are so cool looking and somewhat affordable used.
Galder (not signature) is not in this class. Dunno about the signature but doubt it having heard Galder and Sindre in compares. Vyger is indeed fascinating, possibly more than any other. You need to be a proper vinylphile with good records and a system that can show LT nuance. Otherwise it will just be a cool shiny big table.
AF3 is a fun table allowing 4 arms and easy multi-cart use. If you want to compare both, fly to Schipol. On a general basis both I and the owner prefer Vyger, with Red Sparrow sounding the best on Vyger, but the Dava field coil cart requires a pivoted arm and sounds great on any pivoted table including the AF3p (which is what the owner is using). And when with Dava reference we prefer the Af3p (due to the field coil cartridge). You could, theoretically, get a Vyger atlantis with a second armboard for a pivoted arm
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Don't worry about Keds silly elitist statement about records, even if you don't listen to classical music or chamberpot music on $ 1000 records you can still enjoy a good turntable. Plenty of well recorded music in the marketplace. Just make sure the system is capable of playing well all round , not just a few selected records, most good turntables will do that.
Plenty of well recorded music in the marketplace. Just make sure the system is capable of playing well all round , not just a few selected records, most good turntables will do that.Well I am getting a AirTight ATE3011 Phono and do have a lot of Records. Including beautiful classical recordings from ERC. So I would probably give a good turntable some justice. Regards JanDon't worry about Keds silly elitist statement about records, even if you don't listen to classical music or chamberpot music on $ 1000 records you can still enjoy a good turntable.
The airtight phono is good. ERC not so much the originals are better. The Magda Tagliaferro on ERC is very good. Here it is playing below
Just compare the Dupre Elgar cello to the ERC and the original is lower
Sorry where did I mention classical music or records pricing? You think this TT will make a difference to another one with poorly recorded music?Don't worry about Keds silly elitist statement about records, even if you don't listen to classical music or chamberpot music on $ 1000 records you can still enjoy a good turntable.
Yes even on poorly recorded music and more average music a good turntable will give you increased dynamics and better bass compared to a mediocre TT, making the bad recordings more palatable. When i go from a really good recording to a bad one i hear and notice the difference, but after a few minutes the music is enjoyable anyway. With lesser turntables i stopped playing bad recordings, there is too much good music that is not well recorded, some of my favorite artists have made a lot of badly recorded music that i still want to enjoy.
Yes even on poorly recorded music and more average music a good turntable will give you increased dynamics and better bass compared to a mediocre TT, making the bad recordings more palatable. When i go from a really good recording to a bad one i hear and notice the difference, but after a few minutes the music is enjoyable anyway. With lesser turntables i stopped playing bad recordings, there is too much good music that is not well recorded, some of my favorite artists have made a lot of badly recorded music that i still want to enjoy.
Yes you like TT colour as opposed to recording insight.
A good TT will give you a overall increase in sound, on bad recordings too, i like neutral, not neutered ! On really bad recordings i have a warmish Benz cartridge into a SUT that will warm the sound up a little and round up the lowest bass, but i rarely need it.
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