Hi, Does any one have any listening experience with the new ARC reference phono 2. also looking for other high end phonostage recommendations.
thanks, Brian
thanks, Brian
ARC Reference Phono 2
- Thread starter brianherlihy
- Start date
The ARC Reference 2 phono was a revolution in my system. I owned several very good phono units in the past - ARC SP10 and SP15, Krell, Dartzeel, but once the ARC entered my system the gap between analog and digital widened. If you have a good turntable and cartridge you will see that there is easiness in sound that is much more than good bass, good middle and good treble. As usual, at this level words have little meaning - you have to experiment to know.
Music heard through the phono 2 seems less electronic and more natural - I can not imagine how, but the "vinyl" coloration, this hue that makes you feel there is a needle going through a groove seems to vanish. Dynamics, not in sense of loudness, but in the information existing in low levels is exceptional - the intonation of voices is more clearly heard, instruments seem in the right place.
But be careful - the Ref2 opened a dangerous door in my system that was only be shut by the Anniversary preamplifier!
Music heard through the phono 2 seems less electronic and more natural - I can not imagine how, but the "vinyl" coloration, this hue that makes you feel there is a needle going through a groove seems to vanish. Dynamics, not in sense of loudness, but in the information existing in low levels is exceptional - the intonation of voices is more clearly heard, instruments seem in the right place.
But be careful - the Ref2 opened a dangerous door in my system that was only be shut by the Anniversary preamplifier!
I heard it a few times at CES and was impressed (with the usual "it's a show caveats). I'd love to hear one under better conditions.
Another phono stage to consider in this price range is the Allnic Audio Labs H-3000. I have one here and I like it a lot...
Another phono stage to consider in this price range is the Allnic Audio Labs H-3000. I have one here and I like it a lot...
steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
some of my audio buddies who have great all analog rooms claim the Ref One was a better phono pre. Any comments from prior owners here would be good.
Thanks Microstrip - i have a lot of experience with the Zanden phono pre- (did an extended demo), which i think has a beautiful mid-bass but have been more interested in the ARC as it is half the price, which i hear has an equally beautiful mid-bass. As far as my system, i am running the DaVinci TT (latest upgrade) with Davinci tonearm and Air-Tight PC-1 Supreme - so think a good phono will complement the system nicely (run solid state - soulution 721 and 700 monoblocks).
i appreciate your input, i am happy to hear your feedback, i am waiting for a response from a local dealer on my request to do a home demo.
Steve, interesting you say that. i have heard some people suggest they are not too impressed with the equalization capabilities of the Phono 2; which would lead one to ask the question regarding the major difference b/w Phono1 and Phono2 beyond the equalization. Microstrip - do you have any experience with the Phono 1. i do have a couple of recordings that would benefit from this but not a lot.
thanks for all the input. Brian
i appreciate your input, i am happy to hear your feedback, i am waiting for a response from a local dealer on my request to do a home demo.
Steve, interesting you say that. i have heard some people suggest they are not too impressed with the equalization capabilities of the Phono 2; which would lead one to ask the question regarding the major difference b/w Phono1 and Phono2 beyond the equalization. Microstrip - do you have any experience with the Phono 1. i do have a couple of recordings that would benefit from this but not a lot.
thanks for all the input. Brian
As always, these opinions are subjective and system dependent. I have some experience with the Phono One. Sounds different if you have to use the incorporated MC transformer - needed for many cartridges. But even without it the bass dose not have the slam of the Reference two and sounds more like as a classical tube preamplifier, a little slower and less "continuous". Also excellent by any standards, but it did not operate the magic in my system the way the Reference 2 does.
Sometime ago I managed to borrow a SP10 - it was available for sale. As my last sessions with the SP10 are now almost 20 years old I was expecting something in line with the memories I kept. However, how good it was, under current evaluation the gear I owned was better. And the SP10 did not stay ...
Brian,
During my recent phono preamplifier auditions, I had the Ref 2 in my system. Prior to auditioning, I was hoping for the Ref 2 to be 'the one'; it was available from a local dealer, has multiple EQ curves, 2 inputs, variable loading, a remote, tubes, etc. To be honest, it was good. Actually very good. But at these prices, I was hoping for a religious experience.
The usual caveats regarding system matching apply and of course, everyone has different taste. Just my experience.
During my recent phono preamplifier auditions, I had the Ref 2 in my system. Prior to auditioning, I was hoping for the Ref 2 to be 'the one'; it was available from a local dealer, has multiple EQ curves, 2 inputs, variable loading, a remote, tubes, etc. To be honest, it was good. Actually very good. But at these prices, I was hoping for a religious experience.
The usual caveats regarding system matching apply and of course, everyone has different taste. Just my experience.
I actually borrowed the Ref Phono 2 several months ago from my local dealer; kept it for three days. I have to say I felt that it was pretty AWESOME in every way. I do not have a great deal of experience trying various phonos at home, but I have listened to quite a few different models at audio shows like RMAF and Axpona.... (Agreed, listening at 'show' conditions is not always the finest venue)... I have used a Hovland HP-100 with phono for the last six years and I think that it sounds pretty darn good, but it's no match for a Ref Phono 2 in my opinion. The Ref 2 was much quieter in my rig, more extended on both ends, threw a deeper and wider soundstage than my Hovland, and most impressively just had so much more GRUNT! Drum whacks and bass lines were just so much more powerful; you could feel the impact in your chest! It just sounded more 'alive' and 'real'. It exudes PRAT!!!
If you follow Tone Audio, look for an upcoming on-line review of the Ref Phono 2 later this month. It will be interesting to see if they are as complementary as Mr. Valin was in his AS review.
If you follow Tone Audio, look for an upcoming on-line review of the Ref Phono 2 later this month. It will be interesting to see if they are as complementary as Mr. Valin was in his AS review.
I actually borrowed the Ref Phono 2 from my local dealer this weekend (this is the second time I have auditioned it in home) and spent almost two full days listening. I also brought home the Ref 5 PreAmp to see how the two AR pieces sounded in my rig at home.
I still like the Ref Phono 2 more overall than the internal phono in my Hovland HP-100. However, I did notice one item this time that I missed on the first go round. If I had one complaint on the sound of the Phono 2, I would say that it is a little 'loose' in the lower region. I didn't really notice it too much until I pulled-out my copy of Nirvana's 'Never Mind'. To me, in my rig and room, the drum whacks and lower guitar bass tended to be just a little less than fully taunt. I think that the Hovland's Phono is a little tighter down there although it is not a 'big' sounding as the Ref nor does it project as much total energy (or what I call 'grunt')... I have a good feeling that this effect is very dependent upon the speaker(s) used and the room setup. (I used Magnepan 3.6's with SS amplification and 1988 KHorns with VTL tube monoblocks). Perhaps a minor quibble overall, but again we are talking about AR's Ref product and it is not exactly inexpensive at $12k. Would it keep me from making a purchase; not 100% sure on that yet but I will take a closer look now at some of the other leading 'reference' phonos...
As to the Ref 5 Preamp, I was less impressed with it's performance overall in my rig. I actually preferred the Ref 2 Phono/Hovland combo more than the complete AR set used together. In my rig, using both AR pieces gave me a little too much of the AR 'house' sound I believe. I'm not knocking the Ref 5 it's a very fine piece, it just doesn't provide the right overall balance for me in my rig.
Ah, the trial and tribulations of finding the RIGHT phono; it's not that easy to do...
Stickman451 (System | Threads | Answers | This Thread)
I still like the Ref Phono 2 more overall than the internal phono in my Hovland HP-100. However, I did notice one item this time that I missed on the first go round. If I had one complaint on the sound of the Phono 2, I would say that it is a little 'loose' in the lower region. I didn't really notice it too much until I pulled-out my copy of Nirvana's 'Never Mind'. To me, in my rig and room, the drum whacks and lower guitar bass tended to be just a little less than fully taunt. I think that the Hovland's Phono is a little tighter down there although it is not a 'big' sounding as the Ref nor does it project as much total energy (or what I call 'grunt')... I have a good feeling that this effect is very dependent upon the speaker(s) used and the room setup. (I used Magnepan 3.6's with SS amplification and 1988 KHorns with VTL tube monoblocks). Perhaps a minor quibble overall, but again we are talking about AR's Ref product and it is not exactly inexpensive at $12k. Would it keep me from making a purchase; not 100% sure on that yet but I will take a closer look now at some of the other leading 'reference' phonos...
As to the Ref 5 Preamp, I was less impressed with it's performance overall in my rig. I actually preferred the Ref 2 Phono/Hovland combo more than the complete AR set used together. In my rig, using both AR pieces gave me a little too much of the AR 'house' sound I believe. I'm not knocking the Ref 5 it's a very fine piece, it just doesn't provide the right overall balance for me in my rig.
Ah, the trial and tribulations of finding the RIGHT phono; it's not that easy to do...
Stickman451 (System | Threads | Answers | This Thread)
Yes, I am looking at one that has been used for 790 hours. And I am very happy with it!
