Are SOTA systems worth the effort?

[andromedaaudio]

IMO you dont even need 100 K or be ultra rich to have a SOTA system .
If you have a great room already and its not to big your speakers dont need to be that large / expensive .
I think its for 90 % up to the audiophiles own cleverness/ dedication whether he succeeds or not .
Some make it happen for 100 % for some it just never happens .
To much money is just an excuse for not being able to put it together , there are great buys second hand .
Besides transistor power amp improvements speed / clarity i havent heard much improvement in the audio world .
I hope to be impressed next year in May / munich

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I hear ice fishing appeals to the same sort of inner OCD levels as audiophilia...it could come naturally to you Mike, Lol.

ok, we are really going off the rails here.....but what the heck.

in S.E.Alaska where i'm contemplating going, there is no ice fishing. it's a temperate rainforest; and i'd be there in late spring to early fall sometime. i do salmon fish now, although i would not call myself a "fisherman". my reason for going is not the fishing, it's getting lost in the best cruising area of the world after working 6 days a week for almost 50 years tethered to a cell phone.

after i do it once, i might find it's not for me. but i look forward to that process of discovery.

 

[spiritofmusic]

It's a nice idea, Mike. Currently there's a property for sale in Yorkshire, N. England, absolutely remote w no WiFi for tens of miles, or even phone line.
It's tempting. Imagine, no WBF updates posts for my system, ever.

 

[Argonaut]

Otherwise, just get a devore, vintage tannoy, or Martin Logan hybrids and you will beat 90% of the systems. With horns Universum or Anima and trios, 95%. The next 4 percent will have a bit of serendipity and be blessed with Aries Cerat Symphonia . And the final 1% will be extreme individuals who one day will achieve a State Of Grace by owning Aries Cerat Contendo.

Fixed that for you Kedar...;0)

 

[Gregadd]

the good news is that the building investment in my barn will be returned to me many-fold if i sell. so there is no sunk cost for me to lose. but i know the barn is a once in a lifetime thing, so will my life balance improve or diminish if i leave it? i think about this question a lot.

makes me appreciate it all the more.

We know generically speaking real estate appreciates. However maintaining a boat(yacht) is a significant expense. Balancing that turntable..

 

[Mike Lavigne]

It's a nice idea, Mike. Currently there's a property for sale in Yorkshire, N. England, absolutely remote w no WiFi for tens of miles, or even phone line.
It's tempting. Imagine, no WBF updates posts for my system, ever.

that would not be my deal; at home i want all the media stuff at my fingertips. but i understand the attraction of off the grid. i do have an 'explorer' itch that a boat can satisfy......and the proximity of a great place for it. some want to travel the world......which i understand. for now, that's not my dream. don't need to get on another airplane ever i don't have to.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

We know generically speaking real estate appreciates. However maintaining a boat(yacht) is a significant expense. Balancing that turntable..

boats are spendy to operate, done the numbers.

upon retirement asset appreciation is secondary to itch scratching. but if you are paying attention, right now boats are actually appreciating. alot.

a combination of COVID driving boating as safe, baby boomers reaching retirement age, and strong markets providing equities to buy boats with.

i'm counting on the boat market cooling off in time for my launch target of spring 2023. instead of ordering a new boat for delivery then, i'm likely to wait and hoping to get lucky on the right one popping up much cheaper. but right now it's crazy, crazy.

 

[KeithR]

It's a nice idea, Mike. Currently there's a property for sale in Yorkshire, N. England, absolutely remote w no WiFi for tens of miles, or even phone line.
It's tempting. Imagine, no WBF updates posts for my system, ever.

met an audiophile yesterday at the store from the Big Hawaii - he lives off the grid outside Kona so owns class D amps.

 

[Gregadd]

Mike maybe Betsy DeVos
has one for sell.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Someday, when time allows, I will try to listen to some of these all-out assault vintage horn and new horn systems. The ones that come to mind:

- Avantgarde - Trios
- Living Voice - Olympians
- Custom-built ones you keep talking about Bonzo75 (horns with FLH bass towers)
- Aries Cerat - Contendo Reference
- Oswald Mills - butterfly horn speakers made in upstate NY
- Viva - Masterhorn

- Bionor's - DDK's mighty bionors for example

I have only ever heard Audio Exotics Cessaro Betas with Cessaro Horn Subs, a pair of Cessaro Liszt in UK, a pair of Zanden driven pair of horns in Netherlands and a few others here and there. Nothing has ever inspired me to go back for more, and to be fair, my sense of horns is that system integration and set up are (as ever) exceedingly important to get it just right.

I think you may have forgotten what might be the most important horns to hear: Bill Malcolm's horns!

 

[Solypsa]

I did not watch the video and don't intend to. The thread title, however, mentions "effort" not "money". Commenting on that I would say the efforts are well worth it. Building or creating anything great takes effort. Maybe audio system building doesn't matter to everyone but if it does matter to you then digging in and putting sweat and mental effort into it is what life is about.

 

[Al M.]

Overall, my sense is that great systems have great POTENTIAL...but generally can sound quite banal if just thrown together. And that is where a lot of people ultimately end up very disappointed. These are effectively DIY systems because the owners are assembling them component by component and even often physically setting them up themselves...imagine doing that with cars, houses, coffee makers, etc...

Excellent point, well said.

 

[Ron Resnick]

the good news is that the building investment in my barn will be returned to me many-fold if i sell. so there is no sunk cost for me to lose. but i know the barn is a once in a lifetime thing, so will my life balance improve or diminish if i leave it? i think about this question a lot.

makes me appreciate it all the more.

Mike,

I would be honored to be the first one to be very happy to discuss endlessly your future audio plans in the context of your pending retirement, the barn, the pros and and cons of various options and strategies, and so on. But at the end of the day I am sure that you will not give up the barn!

 

[microstrip]

(...) People could get a top 20 system simply by replicating a good horn design with average drivers. Optimizing them would get them into top 10. You don't need to know any DIY, just get someone who knows to do it for you who is not baking commercial, distribution, and marketing margins into his price

It would be great if you posted a few links to sites having the exact recipe to build these speakers. At less people would know what you are addressing. The DIY horn community is very enthusiast, but very individualist - each member have its preferences and techniques.

Yes 99% of them would get it all wrong but that would also be the case when they spend very expensive on high end gear. At least in this case they would lose less money in the attempt.

I can assure you that most of the people I know about with top high-end gear have really good sound - although a few would benefit from a few changes.

 

[LL21]

I think you may have forgotten what might be the most important horns to hear: Bill Malcolm's horns!

Thanks...which ones are those? I just looked up Bill Malcolm horns, but it did not come up with anything?

 

[andromedaaudio]

Thanks...which ones are those? I just looked up Bill Malcolm horns, but it did not come up with anything?

It is rumoured that high up in the Himalayan mountains a distortion free horn pair actually exists that doesnt exhibit + - 5 db swings and is tonally accurate
Its made by tibetan monks in a long proces which takes a skill that is kept a secret for hundreds of years .
These do sound good with a very large variety of music which makes them so special

 

[spiritofmusic]

Thanks...which ones are those? I just looked up Bill Malcolm horns, but it did not come up with anything?

Lloyd, Ron is referring to our eminent Audiophile Bill.

 

[morricab]

oh, not really. i just think Steve was clear he's heard it all and that level of system isn't a goal of his. what's wrong with that? but underlying his post is that audio is a luxury good now and i *strongly believe* that's the case.

jeff fritz point it out years ago and i'd think you would agree has "serious hifi" chops. i think what's important is finding what's luxury and what's real engineering.

The Luxury/High-End Conundrum: A Solution

ultraaudio.com

Well, he uses the Devialet as an example of something affordable that has SOTA sound...sorry to say it doesn't. A friend had 3 of these amps and now has none because, well I kept bringing over better sounding amps to his place and he finally realized they weren't all that. Maybe they are good compared to 5 figure SS amps these days...

 

[sbo6]

We know generically speaking real estate appreciates. However maintaining a boat(yacht) is a significant expense. Balancing that turntable..

This is a common misnomer. most real estate appreciates however a) taking into inflation not as much as many think b) From a TCO perspective, it's a loss. Between repairs, maintenance, taxes, loan compound interest.

Net - homes aren't an investment as much as a necessary evil. You need to live somewhere, might as well pay a portion of the loan to principal and build equity hopefully by capitalizing on housing price increases above inflation.

 

[sbo6]

Two minutes in and I already disagree with SG. 6 figure systems don't exists "only for the rich". And many of us don't also own expensive boats, super expensive cars, etc. Many of us are budget conscious and trade up equipment, buying used or demo gear so the total cost isn't close to MSRP. Also, it can take many years to trade up and procure 6 figure systems. I don't see too many on WBF with a $200,000+ system at 28, most of us are ~45+ I'd wager.

Can't wait to watch the rest ;-)