Are there any "giant-killer" speakers?
- Thread starter Diapason
- Start date
I lived with Living Voice OBX's for a while and thought they were really impressive relative to their price. Not particularly great at any one thing, but a nicely balanced design nonetheless.
My top three "giant-killers" - in that I would rather own them at their relative price-points to nearly all other contenders - would be:
1) Any original Spendor/Rogers/Chartwell LS3/5A (circa. 1000 € depending on condition)
2) A pair of Quad ESL 57's (1500 € depending on condition)
3) Altec Lansing 846 A/B (circa. 2000 € again, depending on condition).
Yes, yes... They all have serious problems, but the things they do well they do very well, and almost nothing else comes close to what they do very well considering their modest outlay.
I invite you to read other people's comments about what they heard when listening to my system. If you are ever in the Boston area, please come listen to it.
I don't like them at all, and spirit (Marc) knows that. I wouldn't advise them on anyone.
The Logans for me are the best giant killers if one has space bring them out.
I will never go for a horn compromise - horns have to be full range, so giant killers are not easy, depending on price of course - full range horns are giant killers for Wilson Alexandria/Focal Gigantic/Rockport type speakers IMO
But if you can't afford an expensive horn, IMO a panel is a giant killer, because it kills boxes till boxes get really expensive, at which price you can start buying a full range horn.
Below Logan prices Quads are great though you give up some dynamics.
I will never go for a horn compromise - horns have to be full range, so giant killers are not easy, depending on price of course - full range horns are giant killers for Wilson Alexandria/Focal Gigantic/Rockport type speakers IMO
But if you can't afford an expensive horn, IMO a panel is a giant killer, because it kills boxes till boxes get really expensive, at which price you can start buying a full range horn.
Below Logan prices Quads are great though you give up some dynamics.
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
It has always been Maggies for me. After every divorce 
, the first speaker I went back to is Magneplaner.
, the first speaker I went back to is Magneplaner.That's ok Bonzo, for every naysayer such as y'self, there's another 5 listeners who really like, or who are impressed by, my Zus, incl guys running ML Prodigies/VTLs, AG Duos/Audio Aero, Estelons/VTLs, Wilsons/Krells, B&Ws/Musical Fidelitys and Analysis Audios/Nats.
I'll take that as some independent verification that they're up to snuff.
You still have time for a little self discovery, and come around to the Zu fold before you make an awful mistake and settle l/t on spkrs that aren't Zu, LOL!
That invite for possible reassessment w/the Duelunds and Lundahls bedding in nicely remains open.
They are super charged compared to when last you heard them, esp w/all the other changes you so heartily pat me on the back for making ie full system Entreq grounding, full Sablon Reserva cable loom.
Btw the Zus that measure poorly mentioned by others in this thread are the discontinued Essences - the use of a ribbon tweeter corrupted the true nature of Zu by requiring a crossover to handle the ribbon. Since then Zus have gone back to their roots, the crossover has been eliminated, and the full range drivers are, well, more full range.
I remain convinced the Zu Definitions 4s punch well above their weight, and deserve serious consideration even if shopping for spkrs well above their price point.
I'll take that as some independent verification that they're up to snuff.
You still have time for a little self discovery, and come around to the Zu fold before you make an awful mistake and settle l/t on spkrs that aren't Zu, LOL!
That invite for possible reassessment w/the Duelunds and Lundahls bedding in nicely remains open.
They are super charged compared to when last you heard them, esp w/all the other changes you so heartily pat me on the back for making ie full system Entreq grounding, full Sablon Reserva cable loom.
Btw the Zus that measure poorly mentioned by others in this thread are the discontinued Essences - the use of a ribbon tweeter corrupted the true nature of Zu by requiring a crossover to handle the ribbon. Since then Zus have gone back to their roots, the crossover has been eliminated, and the full range drivers are, well, more full range.
I remain convinced the Zu Definitions 4s punch well above their weight, and deserve serious consideration even if shopping for spkrs well above their price point.
Oops. Yes, I wrote that one but, by mistake, thought that you were talking about the Zu review which I did not write.
IMHO, you would be wrong to think that all reviewers think the same or like the same things. You need to know your reviewers and whether their taste suits you.Several people in WBF report very negative opinions on it, supplying measurements to confirm their findings. Whom should we believe?
Agreed.
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When it comes to electronics, you occasionally find an amp or DAC or whatever that punches well above its weight (or at the very least, reviews that claim it does), but I feel like this is less true of loudspeakers. Of course there isn't a straight map between price and performance in any area of hifi, I'm not suggesting that, but it seems to me there is quite a small number of very well-regarded speaker manufacturers whose products come up again and again in high-end discussions, but not many outlier products. Is this a reflection of reality, a reflection of marketing, or am I mistaken in the first place? It certainly makes sense that speakers are more difficult to design and build, but surely there are smart designers in unknown pockets of the globe doing great work that doesn't make it in to the popular hifi press? A look at the show reports would suggest that there are LOTS of other options, but the names never seem to get a mention outside of those reports. Admittedly, quite a few of these seem to have price-tags to match the big boys, so they hardly tick the giant-killer box, but they still leave me curious.
Of course, I could put this thread another way and simply ask how can I get SOTA performance for peanuts??
Who are the giants? And how do you kill them?
Actually, I know 6 people who agree with me, including some of those with the speakers you mention, but that's fine.
Maggie 1.7 is a tremendous value in good sound in the right sized room. Great bang for the buck. If you have not heard them you need to.
You really didn't nail down what price range you wanted to be in.
Do you want to kill giants for 2k, 5k, 10k...
You really didn't nail down what price range you wanted to be in.
Do you want to kill giants for 2k, 5k, 10k...
Keeps coming back to Panels. I have heard Maggies used price under 1000 GBP, Quads, just a bit more, the Analysis Audio Omega are going used for 3.5 - 4.5k, and if you can tweak their crossovers, to me it is a SOTA speaker falling next only to my dream horns. I think the Acoustats would be awesome for the price they go at too, though I have never heard them
Magneplanar
MG 1.7
MG 3.7
MG 20.7
All of these would have you scratching your head ... They aren't perfect but they will have you wondering why you need to spend 10 times more to match them. Coupled with subS (emphasis on the plural ) they (all 3 mind you, at various and of course increasing degree) match a lot of what you hear from statement speakers costing well over 100K.
MG 1.7
MG 3.7
MG 20.7
All of these would have you scratching your head ... They aren't perfect but they will have you wondering why you need to spend 10 times more to match them. Coupled with subS (emphasis on the plural
) they (all 3 mind you, at various and of course increasing degree) match a lot of what you hear from statement speakers costing well over 100K.Magneplanar
MG 1.7
MG 3.7
MG 20.7
All of these would have you scratching your head ... They aren't perfect but they will have you wondering why you need to spend 10 times more to match them. Coupled with subS (emphasis on the plural
They will have many people scratching their heads for many reasons. How can such horribly measuring speakers sound so good? Yes, I have measured my Soundlab's ....
Panels, when properly matched and positioned (and they have very specific requiremnts) can sound great.
My apologies. But why are you listed as being the author of the B&W802D subjective review? http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/1205bw/#q5wzkQLuvBJI4Hbv.97
Microstrip, measuring and listening/performing - completely different things. if it was all in the measurements, we'd all be owning Halcro and ATC. And many of us would be finding any excuse not to listen to music anymore.
Zus measure poorly, but totally engage.
Zus measure poorly, but totally engage.
Magneplanar
MG 1.7
MG 3.7
MG 20.7
All of these would have you scratching your head ... They aren't perfect but they will have you wondering why you need to spend 10 times more to match them. Coupled with subS (emphasis on the plural
Agreed with Frantz and others here about Maggies, they make the music from so many other more expensive speakers sound DOA by comparison
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