darTZeel out of business?

Status
Not open for further replies.
x 1000!!! stupid as fuucck pricing creates an ever decreasing circle of sales until there is none.

Dartzeel are hardly unique with this business model.

Start business with lower pricing, keep increasing prices, after some years most people who are going to be your customers would have bought your product, so shortly before retiring, make prices much higher to get those final “price conscious” customers, after which you don't expect much.

Maybe that’s a signal to spot when a manufacturer is going to retire, they will come out with goods with much higher prices
 
Last edited:
  • Haha
Reactions: XV-1
If you do a deep dive on the Fakes, there is a large spread in quality. Some of the sellers will spec the parts you want in it. Your basically buying a custom SS amp that has somewhat the same circuit design as a Dartzeel 108. OF course the parts are not the same. But you can spend up to $5000 on a Fake and I have heard they sound very good.
You have to differentiate: The first model from Dartzeel is based on a Diamond Buffer, a circuit from the 70s, nothing special. There are 100% copies from China. Depending on the quality of the components, they can sound really good. The distortion profile is very similar to that of a tube amplifier. The subsequent models have completely different designs.

Best clone
 
Last edited:
  • Haha
Reactions: Audiohertz2
Start business with lower pricing, keep increasing prices, after some years most people who are going to be your customers would have bought your product, so shortly before retiring, make prices much higher to get those final “price conscious” customers, after which you don't expect much.

Maybe that’s a signal to spot when a manufacturer is going to retire, they will come out with goods with much higher prices

$6 Million for a dozen limited edition objects … Not a bad little retirement fund top up !
 
They would be 80 and maybe not with us anymore when the Darts gave out.
If they left the hobby and got more off the sofa they might live longer. One of the reasons women live longer than men, audiophiles bring down the male average by not exercising.
 
  • Haha
  • Like
Reactions: Ampexed and Lagonda
A value of playing records.
I have been getting a lot of exercise using your record cleaning regiment Tim, i am always running to the other end of the house to remove or start up a ultrasonic load of records. :)
 
You have to differentiate: The first model from Dartzeel is based on a Diamond Buffer, a circuit from the 70s, nothing special. There are 100% copies from China. Depending on the quality of the components, they can sound really good. The distortion profile is very similar to that of a tube amplifier. The subsequent models have completely different designs.

Best clone
I’d like that clone came in black.
 
Be VERY careful of those darTZeel nhb 108's listed on ebay. They are Chinese knock-offs and easily found on Ali-Express

If you want a genuine darTZeel, look for the serial number and the country of origin. The ebay ad that is referred to states cleary : Brand= unbranded and Country of manufacture "does not apply".

For. goodness sake, if you have $600 to throw away, I'd be happy to sell you the Brooklyn Bridge!
I posted that knowing full well what it was and for a laugh given the angst about dartZell prices . I'm not as dumb as you think
 
You have to differentiate: The first model from Dartzeel is based on a Diamond Buffer, a circuit from the 70s, nothing special. There are 100% copies from China. Depending on the quality of the components, they can sound really good. The distortion profile is very similar to that of a tube amplifier. The subsequent models have completely different designs.

Best clone
I'm not sure how you can tell anything from that ad. When you look at the detailed description, it says stuff like this: "the advantage is that it has a good transient response characteristics, known as one of the more bile than the bile machine bile flavor stone machine line". What the hell does this even mean? It's actually comical. For God's sake, use Google translate, man! The world is full of audiophiles who love bargains. But buying a darT knockoff that excels in making bile for $1500 is a bridge too far for anyone, even on this forum!
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Lagonda
I'm not sure how you can tell anything from that ad. When you look at the detailed description, it says stuff like this: "the advantage is that it has a good transient response characteristics, known as one of the more bile than the bile machine bile flavor stone machine line". What the hell does this even mean? It's actually comical. For God's sake, use Google translate, man! The world is full of audiophiles who love bargains. But buying a darT knockoff that excels in making bile for $1500 is a bridge too far for anyone, even on this forum!
Hi Marty - I think maybe it was a correct translation?

I think they are letting you know that if you are dumb enough to buy it that you really are buying a bile product? LOL

Maybe for once there is truth in advertising. ;)
 
  • Love
Reactions: marty
I asked for evidence, you posted a big ollll image of Whatsbestforum as proof. Why go to John then.:D:eek:.
Going to the US distributor, Mr Stone is exactly what I was asking if anyone had done. Mike may have called Herve. That is another good option.
I hope they are still solvent. It is a good product. I liked my 108 quite a bit. For 17 years old, it was still very solid. Herve did some minor work like resoldering some joints and other minor stuff. About $700. It should last another 20 years.

If someone bought Mikes amps and other Dartzeel components, they would be very happy. They are built to last 40 years. They would be getting very good equipment at a good price that will outlast most owners. Mikes Dartzeel has a good 30 years in them. If the average audiophile buying them is 50. They would be 80 and maybe not with us anymore when the Darts gave out.

Having said that, I would rather have equipment from a current company. Or at least something that anyone can repair. My Blade amps and my First Sound preamp are pretty simple point to point wiring. If something failed, a decent tech could sus it out and replace the parts. My digital equipment is not so expensive I could toss it in the trash and not be financially damaged. Honestly, I worry more about my digital equipment. Most digital equipment seems a bit temperamental. And computer boards and chips are not know for long life.
If something is built to last, and you have a good local repair shop, the only thing you really lose if the manufacturer goes out of business is any warranty. So if something does go wrong, the practical difference is that you have to pay for it rather than the manufacturer. In the UK and EU we have statutory two year manufacturer warranty, which is considered a significant consumer protection, I don’t think you have anything similar in the USA.

I don’t have any audio equipment that would financially hurt me if it dissolved, evaporated or was stolen by aliens. I might think twice about what I would replace it with.

I’ve used Leica cameras for years and there is a certain peace of mind to know that you can send in a 50 or 70-year-old lens or camera and they can fix it just as easily as a camera made last year. They also have a habit of increasing value, shame that doesn’t happen with hi-fi.
 
Appreciate the response Mike. The "I don't know that much" is quite funny, c'mon man. Obviously there is a reason you obviously decided to sell. Had to be reason when you announced where you were heading/selling. You are their unabashed brand ambassador on this forum for years.u chalking this up to coincidence??
I'm a big fan of Mojo Audio and talk about it a lot. I have talked with Ben of Mojo extensivly about professional and personal topics. I'm also a big fan and distributor for Torus. I am also a big fan and talk a lot about First Sound. Emmanuel of First Sound has been to my house and shared food and coffee. I still have 0 knowledge about whether these companies will be here next week. I think it a farce to pander an idea the Herve called Mike and told Mike to sell his gear because he was throwing in the towel. Thats slander in my opinion.
Mike is a Dartzeel client who is generous enough to take his time and post over the years the evolution of his system so we can all see what it takes to implement a world class audio setup. That does not make him privy to and acting upon insider information. It makes him a benefit to the club.

Additionally, show me a audiophile that has relatively the same equipment list for 20 years. This hobby it built on flipping and flopping. Its almost odd Mike has held onto Dartzeel so long. My perception is Mcintosh and Conrad Johnson are held for the laung haul. Most others cycles through.

A good topic would be what brand has someone held onto for 20 plus years.
 
You mean these? https://www.amazon.com/Fosi-Audio-Two-V3-Mono/dp/B0D91QDRPX Already shipping LOL. No idea how they actually sound but some bozo on Audiogon is always touting them.
They sound fair. I use them to drive in ceiling speakers around the house. I put them into my real rig and they, well, they were not good.

Fosi is for young kids and a set of bookshelf speakers that double as computer monitors for gaming. They are not Audiophile.
 
Roy Gregory is not a good enough source for this.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Zeotrope and asiufy
Status
Not open for further replies.

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu