Lampizator announcement: launch of our all new TOTL HORIZON DAC
- Thread starter Lukasz "Lampizator" Fikus
- Start date
To those who are rolling output tubes, could you publish the input impedance of your preamp/controller and whether you're running SE or balanced from the Horizon? I recently installed a quad of KT170 TungSol output tubes. I've found that the output tubes sonic profile is sensitive to changes in my controller's input resistance. The Horizon output tube sonic profile varies when I make even small changes in the controller's input impedance setting. Of course I have the Horizon level control set to 63 so that the impedance that the output tubes see is only that of my controller's input impedance.
The range of the input impedance in my controller can be varied from 1k to 99k. Since I'm running in balanced mode, that's per phase. So far, I've narrowed the controller's impedance range of 77k to 93k ohm which seems, in my system, where the Horizon's is at its best. At the lower values the bass is more pronounced. However, there is a point where the bass is not as controlled. At the higher values, the midrange & treble are sweeter and better focused while the bass gradually becomes leaner.. Each 1k change in input impedance has a unique overall bass-mid-treble sound. Front to back depth is also impacted with the midpoint in the subject impedance range having the best depth as well as the richest sound.
Of course, these observations are in the context of my system. Nonetheless, the impact of tuning the impedance seen by the Horizon is significant and easily audible.
The range of the input impedance in my controller can be varied from 1k to 99k. Since I'm running in balanced mode, that's per phase. So far, I've narrowed the controller's impedance range of 77k to 93k ohm which seems, in my system, where the Horizon's is at its best. At the lower values the bass is more pronounced. However, there is a point where the bass is not as controlled. At the higher values, the midrange & treble are sweeter and better focused while the bass gradually becomes leaner.. Each 1k change in input impedance has a unique overall bass-mid-treble sound. Front to back depth is also impacted with the midpoint in the subject impedance range having the best depth as well as the richest sound.
Of course, these observations are in the context of my system. Nonetheless, the impact of tuning the impedance seen by the Horizon is significant and easily audible.
Fascinating. I guess most of us who use preamps have no options since the input impedance is generally fixed (my RCA inputs are 47K and the XLRs are 2K). I've never considered exploring whether there is a sonic difference between these. (I currently run single-ended). I guess I shouldn't be surprised since we know that changing the input impedance for a phono load matters a great deal. This may fall under the category of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" for me. Even tweakers have their limits!
Good idea.
Doubles the rolling fun (from my SE TRP) and halves the pain (of admission) on the pentodes
It looks a little weird but IMHO worth the strange sight
47k is a typical value in preamps. A preamp input impedance of 2k seems to be very low. Is that per phase or combined? I'll set a couple of input impedance options in my controller to those and give them a listen.
Having a passive controller I have to pay attention to the input impedance of downstream amps. I use two sets of L/R outputs. One set connects to a pair of Lampizator 211 Balanced Monoblocks. Those have an input impedance of 200k (100k per phase).
The other set of controller outputs connect to a tube buffer which also has an input impedance of 200k (100k per phase). The output impedance of that tube buffer is 50 ohms (low output values are what we want). I need the buffer because the solid state bass monoblock amps have an input impedance of only 25 kohms. If I run the controller output to the bass amps direct, the sound of the whole frequencey range (bass up through treble) is impacted (loss of dynamics, rolled off treble, etc.).
By the way, when I reference an input impedance setting on my controller, the available values range from 1k to 99k. That's per phase. So the net combined +/- impedance range is 2k to 198k.
Finally, since yesterday my Horizon is here and running quite nicely. Right now I will only say I like it
Congrats on your new HorizonFinally, since yesterday my Horizon is here and running quite nicely. Right now I will only say I like it
What is your tube complement?
Please tell us more when you have more hours on your Horizon.
Finally, since yesterday my Horizon is here and running quite nicely. Right now I will only say I like it
CharlieFinally, since yesterday my Horizon is here and running quite nicely. Right now I will only say I like it
Glad to see you finally received the H! Happy Listening!
Thank you!Congrats on your new Horizon
What is your tube complement?
Please tell us more when you have more hours on your Horizon.
I will tell more when I tried some tubes.
So here is my first take on the Lampizator Horizon DAC:
I am running it directly into Ypsilon Aelius II mono blocks (https://ypsilonelectronics.com/aelius-monoblock/ ) which drive a pair of German Physiks PQS 302 speakers (https://www.german-physiks.com/pqs-302-loudspeakers).
The DAC is fed via USB from Innuos Zenith Mk III Server via Innuos Phoenix USB (https://innuos.com/).
My living room has about 60 m² (about 650 square feet) without special acoustic treatment but – to my ears – good acoustics. Judging from my listening with the Lampizator Pacific my equipment in this setting produced a wide and deep sound stage (speakers are radiating in a 360 degree pattern in a little asymmetrical way due to room constrictions behind the right speaker) with less than pinpoint imaging. Tonal balance is (was!) a little bass shy and marginally hard highs on some (early digital) recordings.
Setup was a breeze:
Put in 1 KR Audio RK 5U4G, 4 KR KT88, 2 Psvane 6SN7-BE as provided.
Connect USB and symmetrical NFs (Kreder Audio Silver-Gold-Fusion), restart the server, voila.
Did I have to change Roon settings? Probably, I don´t remember.
First listen after two hours of warmup was – due to too high expectations from reading too much praise here – a bit disappointing: better than the Pacific in all hifi aspects sure, better imaging, more room depth, better deeper bass, finer highs, more dynamic ...
But to my ears it was at that point just better hifi not better music and as that not worth the extra spending. So I had to wait.
The DAC seems louder than the Pacific, I run it about the “30” mark, never over “40” even for quiet parts with remote control in hand. The display is much better to read from my seat. Without checking the data the DAC seems more heavy but a little bit shorter in size than the old one.
I had promised myself to stick with the provided tubes for a month or so.
It took about another 10 hours for the DAC and me to warm up to each other and after midnight that first day some of that Lampizator magic was beginning to happen.
Around noon the next day I changed out in separate steps all the tubes for the ones I bought after some recommendations from all of you here:
Used Psvane Acme 274 B (originally bought for the Pacific), French CFS 5687S (“used tested strong”), Tung-Sol KT170.
A pair of Sylvania 6SN7W is waiting for another time.
This brought a remarkable step up in sound quality!
The following days up to now have been a steadily improving sound quality with some intermediate dips when the DAC sounded dull, boring and lifeless (exaggeration) only to come back stronger. This process is far from over. Pavel (Mr. Lampizator Germany) estimates 150 hours of burn in. This being a digital component I expect even longer.
So what can I say about the sound now (around the 80 hour mark)?
All hifi aspects mentioned above have improved.
The bass is deeper, faster, more precise.
The highs are fine, detailed, more extended and at the same time softer and therefore more real. (A contradiction, I know.)
Soundstage has improved in depth, to a lesser degree in width, in an astonishing degree in highs. The placement and body of instruments and singers is on a totally different level.
More detail. More detail without overexaggerating.
All this adds up to something new and for me most important: This box delivers music in a way which I would call non-technical, effortless, strong, delicate, musical, meaningful, ...
“Deeply human” is what I came up with while listening.
I would still regard the Pacific as a great DAC. I loved it up to the last day before delivery of the new one. I can wholeheartedly recommend to pick up one of the used ones now on the market (available through Lampizator´s buy back policy f. i.). But if you plan to do that never listen to the Horizon!
I am running it directly into Ypsilon Aelius II mono blocks (https://ypsilonelectronics.com/aelius-monoblock/ ) which drive a pair of German Physiks PQS 302 speakers (https://www.german-physiks.com/pqs-302-loudspeakers).
The DAC is fed via USB from Innuos Zenith Mk III Server via Innuos Phoenix USB (https://innuos.com/).
My living room has about 60 m² (about 650 square feet) without special acoustic treatment but – to my ears – good acoustics. Judging from my listening with the Lampizator Pacific my equipment in this setting produced a wide and deep sound stage (speakers are radiating in a 360 degree pattern in a little asymmetrical way due to room constrictions behind the right speaker) with less than pinpoint imaging. Tonal balance is (was!) a little bass shy and marginally hard highs on some (early digital) recordings.
Setup was a breeze:
Put in 1 KR Audio RK 5U4G, 4 KR KT88, 2 Psvane 6SN7-BE as provided.
Connect USB and symmetrical NFs (Kreder Audio Silver-Gold-Fusion), restart the server, voila.
Did I have to change Roon settings? Probably, I don´t remember.
First listen after two hours of warmup was – due to too high expectations from reading too much praise here – a bit disappointing: better than the Pacific in all hifi aspects sure, better imaging, more room depth, better deeper bass, finer highs, more dynamic ...
But to my ears it was at that point just better hifi not better music and as that not worth the extra spending. So I had to wait.
The DAC seems louder than the Pacific, I run it about the “30” mark, never over “40” even for quiet parts with remote control in hand. The display is much better to read from my seat. Without checking the data the DAC seems more heavy but a little bit shorter in size than the old one.
I had promised myself to stick with the provided tubes for a month or so.
It took about another 10 hours for the DAC and me to warm up to each other and after midnight that first day some of that Lampizator magic was beginning to happen.
Around noon the next day I changed out in separate steps all the tubes for the ones I bought after some recommendations from all of you here:
Used Psvane Acme 274 B (originally bought for the Pacific), French CFS 5687S (“used tested strong”), Tung-Sol KT170.
A pair of Sylvania 6SN7W is waiting for another time.
This brought a remarkable step up in sound quality!
The following days up to now have been a steadily improving sound quality with some intermediate dips when the DAC sounded dull, boring and lifeless (exaggeration) only to come back stronger. This process is far from over. Pavel (Mr. Lampizator Germany) estimates 150 hours of burn in. This being a digital component I expect even longer.
So what can I say about the sound now (around the 80 hour mark)?
All hifi aspects mentioned above have improved.
The bass is deeper, faster, more precise.
The highs are fine, detailed, more extended and at the same time softer and therefore more real. (A contradiction, I know.)
Soundstage has improved in depth, to a lesser degree in width, in an astonishing degree in highs. The placement and body of instruments and singers is on a totally different level.
More detail. More detail without overexaggerating.
All this adds up to something new and for me most important: This box delivers music in a way which I would call non-technical, effortless, strong, delicate, musical, meaningful, ...
“Deeply human” is what I came up with while listening.
I would still regard the Pacific as a great DAC. I loved it up to the last day before delivery of the new one. I can wholeheartedly recommend to pick up one of the used ones now on the market (available through Lampizator´s buy back policy f. i.). But if you plan to do that never listen to the Horizon!
Charlie,
Thanks for your nonhyperbolic post. Your experience almost exactly mirrors mine. I too had sonic dips only to be followed by great sound the next day. Crazy. The Horizon isn’t a vast improvement over my Pacific (which, frankly, would have shocked me) but it’s definitely better. Your next to last paragraph is particularly spot on.
I'm waiting for my delivery, it was supposed to be delivered today. Hopefully tomorrow, I was eventually told (only because I called) that there was a duty of 76.00, it would have been nice if someone at DHL told me that yesterday.
Break In: This is a protocol a Dear Friend shared with me and it has been used on a number of components SS as well as Tube gear. On for 8-10 hours 3 days in a row. Off 24 hours. On 24/7 for a week. That is approx. 200 hours. Easy and very effective...
Break In: This is a protocol a Dear Friend shared with me and it has been used on a number of components SS as well as Tube gear. On for 8-10 hours 3 days in a row. Off 24 hours. On 24/7 for a week. That is approx. 200 hours. Easy and very effective...
steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
The Pacific is indeed a magnificent DAC. I couldn't imagine how Lukasz could make a better unit in the Horizon. It wasn't until I found the best tubes for my ears and my room .At that point it became a no contest. The Horizon to my ears with my tube set delivers for me the best digital sound I have ever heard in my system. Once you find the tubes that grab you, make sure you buy back up sets as they are not only all getting scarcer but so also are they getting much more expensive. The comfort of knowing you have backup sets goes far
This is of course great advice. But I would add, when you receive your back-up tube sets, don't just put them on a shelf and let them sit there. Even if you buy what are supposedly NIB, or NOS, or any used tube, play them at some point fairly soon to confirm they are good and don't have microphonics, gurgles, or sputtering. Once you know they are fine,, then you can comfortably put them on a shelf for future use. Nothing would be more upsetting than turning to your back-up tubes 3 years from now, discovering they are flawed, and then trying to buy unobtanium tubes at that time with unobtainium pricing.
Check 'em, then forget 'em!
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charlie
We have been conversing separately. I have not reported my findings since I received mine last month but I would echo everything you said to a tee. I have around 100 hours on mine and I have not switched a tube yet. I am going to wait another month. All of my unique tubes are in my inventory. None of the tubes I own have been discussed in WBF but they are all NOS tubes from the 50's. I know they will be much better than what is currently in the H.
Thx for the detailed review. You have saved me from posting a lengthy review but you were spot on. LOL.
I have to echo that I could have been happy with the Pacific for the rest of my life. I am not sure the H is worth the extra $19k in sound quality but the deal was very good to not take advantage of.
steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I sure hope so! 100 hours doesn't seem like a lot to me. Hopefully tomorrow mine will arrive. As noted I intend on playing the snot out of it...
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