MSB Renderer v2 in the house!

[microstrip]

(...) why we have a mirroring 30tb NAS in the house so he knows the back up is solid......already saved him once when the Russkie hackers corrupted my last NAS.

You should have another safety mirror in a sunny european country near the sea ...

 

[Mike Lavigne]

You should have another safety mirror in a sunny european country near the sea ...

when you come and visit me we can discuss in person exactly where that should be located.

 

[Kingsrule]

As indicated I have isolated the electrical noise in my home network from my room by using fiber optics to convey the network signal with light not electricity. (It is my understanding based an many comparisons on CA this is superior to inline ethernet filters.) My comparo will be to see if the media converter which converts light back to electricity for the last ethernet leg to the dac creates noise that can be cleaned up by the isolated ethernet ports of a server, but, more importantly, my comparo will be to see if a roon core optimized for low noise, processing headroom and grounding will be superior to the nas as a roon core.

I've tried the network both ways and have so far settled with: From main switch SFP+ to TPLink optical isolater to Netgear GS108 switch and then all copper from GS108 to the audio pieces. iFi ps on isolator and GS108. My NAS is connected to main switch via SFP+ 10GB

BTW the v2 renderer sounds wonderful

 

[asiufy]

I don't trust the people at CA, but Vince and I have ordered the fiber optic converters, and we'll give that a try. For now, the inline filters are cheap and easy to install. In time, we'll be able to assess if one solution is better than the other, or even if everything going at once is best. And then address the effects of the server x NAS.

Which fiber optic converter did you get?


thanks,
Alex

 

[asiufy]

I've tried the network both ways and have so far settled with: From main switch SFP+ to TPLink optical isolater to Netgear GS108 switch and then all copper from GS108 to the audio pieces. iFi ps on isolator and GS108. My NAS is connected to main switch via SFP+ 10GB

BTW the v2 renderer sounds wonderful

Ah, good call on the iFi PS isolators. I have a bunch of those on the network gear (NAS, router, switch, etc.) No linear PS for now, though. My hunch is that with good Ethernet filters, the need for the linear PS is mitigated, specially since my network/NAS setup is far away, on different circuits, from the main rig.


cheers,
alex

 

[Pb Blimp]

I've tried the network both ways and have so far settled with: From main switch SFP+ to TPLink optical isolater to Netgear GS108 switch and then all copper from GS108 to the audio pieces. iFi ps on isolator and GS108. My NAS is connected to main switch via SFP+ 10GB

BTW the v2 renderer sounds wonderful

Hmmm....just so I understand, why do you have the GS108 between the TPlink and the system? Doesn't that switch add noise? I take it your system has more than one ethernet device.

 

[Pb Blimp]

I don't trust the people at CA, but Vince and I have ordered the fiber optic converters, and we'll give that a try. For now, the inline filters are cheap and easy to install. In time, we'll be able to assess if one solution is better than the other, or even if everything going at once is best. And then address the effects of the server x NAS.

Which fiber optic converter did you get?


thanks,
Alex

Wait what????? They are on the internet we gotta trust em.

Ya I know Vince is not persuaded you need to do much, if anything, to the clean up the ethernet input and he may be right but at the same time I don't think he has tried a lot yet. It will be fun to check.

 

[asiufy]

Wait what????? They are on the internet we gotta trust em.

Ya I know Vince is not persuaded you need to do much, if anything, to the clean up the ethernet input and he may be right but at the same time I don't think he has tried a lot yet. It will be fun to check.

No, he hasn't. I didn't either, as in our old store, it was a pain to run cable, even the fiber optic would've been messy. In the new place it's much easier, so I'll definitely investigate that option, along with Vince.

For now, those little filters did add a nice "pop" to the already great Renderer. I keep one on the Renderer end, and one on the router/switch end. And that's with my plain ol' QNAP, with iFi PS.

Part of my plan is to set up another server (Innuos and/or Nucleus) and NAS, with a subset of my music, in order to better replicate more common usage scenarios. Most people won't have 20k+ albums like I do, so I need to better understand what would serve them instead of what would serve ME


cheers,
alex

 

[Kingsrule]

Hmmm....just so I understand, why do you have the GS108 between the TPlink and the system? Doesn't that switch add noise? I take it your system has more than one ethernet device.

Yes correct. UpTone Audio guys said the GS108 was very quiet and to my ear it is. It sounds quieter to me than 2 TPLink converters hooked up to the audio devices. 2 ethernet devices, Nucleus+ and v2 renderer on the audio side. BTW the UpTone guys are working on a audio centric switch so it appears they are looking at all aspects of switch design.

 

[Pb Blimp]

No, he hasn't. I didn't either, as in our old store, it was a pain to run cable, even the fiber optic would've been messy. In the new place it's much easier, so I'll definitely investigate that option, along with Vince.

For now, those little filters did add a nice "pop" to the already great Renderer. I keep one on the Renderer end, and one on the router/switch end. And that's with my plain ol' QNAP, with iFi PS.

Part of my plan is to set up another server (Innuos and/or Nucleus) and NAS, with a subset of my music, in order to better replicate more common usage scenarios. Most people won't have 20k+ albums like I do, so I need to better understand what would serve them instead of what would serve ME


cheers,
alex

Gotcha. I obviously am very curious in your innuos findings via the direct ethernet port. The Nucleus like the SGM does not have this feature.

I think the power supplies on these FMC devices may be the key. I understand the iFi is great. I had YFS make me a custom power supply for my Media converter with ultra low ripple noise.

 

[koalakoala]

New renderer 2 up and running at koalakoala's place!

5 units were shipped to Hong Kong last week... many thanks to the local agent Pacific Audio for the speedy installation...

Need time for burning in... First impression - no doubt a significant upgrade over the old renderer.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

mine arrived today.....

 

[Kingsrule]

When u guys first light up the v2 renderer Roon might have DSP turned on as default....turn it off!

 

[asiufy]

Yep, I've asked the Roon folks to have that disabled by default, but they're so excited about all that DSP crap that they don't understand people who just want that out of the way...
I'll keep trying... For now, I always instruct friends/clients to disable that, first thing.


cheers,
alex

 

[V-Squared]

mine arrived today.....

View attachment 40664

Mike, I think they sent you mine... yours has my initials! Ha... oh, so does mine. I’m really enjoying mine - I’m comparing it to both AES/USB from the Aurender W20 which I have synced with my MSB Galaxy Fempto Clock. I love that the Renderer supports ROON (without AirPlay) - a much nicer interface than the native Aurender Conductor app.

I’m noticing that the music is more engaging, has more clarity, and more dimensionality - nowhere near the holographic signature of your system, but one step closer, I suppose.

Thanks also for the reference to the HDTT Showstakovich download... nice indeed.

Regards,

V2

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Mike, I think they sent you mine... yours has my initials! Ha... oh, so does mine. I’m really enjoying mine - I’m comparing it to both AES/USB from the Aurender W20 which I have synced with my MSB Galaxy Fempto Clock. I love that the Renderer supports ROON (without AirPlay) - a much nicer interface than the native Aurender Conductor app.

I’m noticing that the music is more engaging, has more clarity, and more dimensionality - nowhere near the holographic signature of your system, but one step closer, I suppose.

Thanks also for the reference to the HDTT Showstakovich download... nice indeed.

Regards,

V2

hey V2,

glad you liked the Shost download.

my Renderer (with your name on it) might get set up Thursday night. the goodies my son ordered for the fiber optic cable set-up arrives Thursday. we are starting out with Roon core on a laptop + on the SGM, then experiment with various ways to have it work, including SGM -> usb and see where that goes.

then when the 'Evo spec' upgrade happens for the SGM (i'm told it's epic) we will do another round of investigations.

cheers,

Mike

 

[jturbo]

Hi, New around here, but lurking for a few months.

IM really curious to see if a properly executed renderer ( low noise, simple conversion to the I2S buss) makes the server quality much less important and equal or best USB in SQ.

As I understand, the Roon RAAT protocol buffers several seconds of music in the Renderer. It seems to me that if the Renderer itself is quiet and the ethernet interface into
the renderer is quiet ( Fiber or well Isolated), then the performance should be outstanding as the Raat protocol lets the DACs clock regulate the delivery from the buffer in the renderer.


Interested in the output of these tests... Thanks

 

[Pb Blimp]

Hi, New around here, but lurking for a few months.

IM really curious to see if a properly executed renderer ( low noise, simple conversion to the I2S buss) makes the server quality much less important and equal or best USB in SQ.

As I understand, the Roon RAAT protocol buffers several seconds of music in the Renderer. It seems to me that if the Renderer itself is quiet and the ethernet interface into
the renderer is quiet ( Fiber or well Isolated), then the performance should be outstanding as the Raat protocol lets the DACs clock regulate the delivery from the buffer in the renderer.


Interested in the output of these tests... Thanks

jt,

Welcome and bingo......I couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[Kingsrule]

Any USB that I have heard pales in comparison to a renderer.... as always YMMV

 

[Priaptor]

Finally got the system set up properly yesterday. Compared the Renderer to the USB and have to say my initial impressions were, while the renderer was clearly more open and spacious was just a little shrill compared to my USB solution. Elliot was over and kind enough to bring the Gobel Ethernet cable and I changed out my AQ Vodka for the Gobels and all I can say is OMG.

Two things. One is, I'm always amazed that every time I think this DAC can't get any better, MSB introduces something that takes it to another level. Second, count me in as a very very skeptical believer in network cabling making a difference BUT I became a believer yesterday and towards the wee hours of the morning. Absolutely stunning.

My next tweek is that I still have a Core Technologies LPS, with dual rail at 5 and 12v which I will use to power my dedicated switch. Core Technologies is out of business and I almost sold it awhile ago until I realized the price I was being offered was less than the Stillpoint footers on the unit. Its an excellent LPS and look forward to using it.

Funny when I told Vince about my experience, he being interested in how we are all finding our experience with the USB v Renderer, he sent me the following review, which I had not seen before regarding the Gobel USB and Ethernet

http://hifipig.com/gobel-lacorde-statement-usb-and-ethernet-cables/

While the price is a huge difference there is no comparison between the AQ Vodka and the Gobel. A different universe. Yes I believe.