Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

[Rhapsody]

I would be curious what Emile’s @Taiko Audio current view is on grounding boxes with the Extreme.

I have a few Setchi devices in my main room as well.

 

[Blackmorec]

I am not against it but when I tried it, it made things worse. I tried it on all my front end gear.

I doubt there’s a universal right and wrong with grounding boxes….it probably depends on the way the system is connected, how all the individual components are grounded and the quality (impedance) of the ground connection itself.
I had the Entreq importer bring an assortment of cables and boxes to my listening room for evaluation and the only place it made a small difference was with the network switch, which has a 5V DC LPS while all Ethernet cable screens are star earthed to a low impedance ground. I left everything connected to the Entreq boxes for a few days then disconnected one box at a time while listening for any changes, but again the only minor change was with the ethernet switch, which is otherwise ungrounded.
An earth cable from the switch’s chassis ground point had the same effect.

 

[Rhapsody]

I doubt there’s a universal right and wrong with grounding boxes….it probably depends on the way the system is connected, how all the individual components are grounded and the quality (impedance) of the ground connection itself.
I had the Entreq importer bring an assortment of cables and boxes to my listening room for evaluation and the only place it made a small difference was with the network switch, which has a 5V DC LPS while all Ethernet cable screens are star earthed to a low impedance ground. I left everything connected to the Entreq boxes for a few days then disconnected one box at a time while listening for any changes, but again the only minor change was with the ethernet switch, which is otherwise ungrounded.
An earth cable from the switch’s chassis ground point had the same effect.

Agree 100%. System dependent.

 

[howiebrou]

I doubt there’s a universal right and wrong with grounding boxes….it probably depends on the way the system is connected, how all the individual components are grounded and the quality (impedance) of the ground connection itself.
I had the Entreq importer bring an assortment of cables and boxes to my listening room for evaluation and the only place it made a small difference was with the network switch, which has a 5V DC LPS while all Ethernet cable screens are star earthed to a low impedance ground. I left everything connected to the Entreq boxes for a few days then disconnected one box at a time while listening for any changes, but again the only minor change was with the ethernet switch, which is otherwise ungrounded.
An earth cable from the switch’s chassis ground point had the same effect.

I also agree. Not only system dependent but dependent on how your electricity supply is set up at home. Anecdotal evidence from this side of the pond would suggest that apartments seem to have more benefit that houses.

 

[Rhapsody]

The only thing that I would add is that I believe that signal ground acts differently than electrical ground.

Electrical ground would have much more to do with how a house or apartment was wired versus signal ground.

 

[RUIN*ish]

Does the Extreme send to cache using streaming radio or Qobuz?

Marc

 

[simorag]

Another supremely enjoyable musical weekend as I keep knowing better and better the Extreme, by rediscovering my library once again.

One aspect that emerges as a constant while I move from album to album is the sheer amount of information that the Taiko is able to extract from each tune. Good thing is that it does not present information in the form of distracting, hyperdetailed dissection, rather in a naturalistic fashion: is like my ear/brain actually expected that kind of information to be present to begin with, and it just welcomes the Extreme presentation as 'right', hence hours of fatigue-free listening sessions go by so easily ...

The best recordings become otherworldly good, but I am taking much pleasure even by technically average ones.

These two albums for example, are some of my most trusted old friends since several decades, with their power of deeply moving me each time. The Extreme exposes the ultra-rich, complex harmonics character of the two keyboard instruments and the uber-human technique and sensitivity of these two masters of the past century in a way I have not experienced yet on my system.

​

A trait that stroke me since my first home audition of the Extreme, is the bass presentation. It combines control, articulation, structural resolution with voluptuous body and richness in a theoretically paradoxical way. Double bass, electric bass sections become endorphin galore.

​

I tried some A/B between Roon and TAS, and when in critical listening mode the improvement in transient delineation, instrument separation and dynamics from TAS was unequivocal.

This album requires explosive dynamics at times, and a masterful handling of spatial information to recreate the live feeling. With Roon things sound a tad too smooth, the transients are slightly smeared compared to TAS, which produces a more engaging, convincing experience also through putting musical images in a better 3D perspective.

​

 

[MarkusBarkus]

...what a fine post, @simorag

 

[Kris]

I am not against it but when I tried it, it made things worse. I tried it on all my front end gear.

Every opinion is very valuable . Thank you !
You must be very happy if you dont need them to make things sound better

 

[EuroDriver]

Does the Extreme send to cache using streaming radio or Qobuz?

Marc

We don't want to publish here how we do things but PM me if you wish to get more of an idea what we do by having a call

 

[onlychild]

Looking nice - - please share your sonic impressions from the change!

Few early impressions from the HRS VXR rack. Previously, I had tried a few footers under the Extreme (though still on the glass shelf). The footers improved the sound by getting rid of some nasties while also improving other aspects, but they also changed the overall tone of the sound. This might work well in many systems.

With the HRS VXR, the sound has improved in almost every aspect, but the tone remains the same. I now understand what others meant when they said, “The HRS rack has no sound”. This is exactly what I was looking for since I have the tone pretty close to where I want it. In comparison, and based only on long memory which is not very reliable, but I remember the footers sounding a bit smeared in the upper frequencies compared to the HRS. At that time, my system benefited from that little bit of smearing.

The sound is not only calmer now, but also more lively. Instruments have taken another step (or two) up towards realism. Bass improvement was the first thing I noticed.

I’m currently waiting on a Stromtank to be delivered next month so I’m getting by with plugging directly into the dedicated outlet. Since getting the rack, this is the first time I have found my system engaging without any power conditioner/supply. I am definitely missing some big benefits to the sound that I heard when I had the S5000 HP in for demo so the combo of the two should be a nice uptick. Hard to believe, but the S5000HP was leaps and bounds ahead in dynamics compared to directly plugging into the dedicated outlet (headphone system only). Low level detail retrieval is not even a contest, but that's to be expected.

Edit: I always knew that vibration control had its benefits, but for some reason I always considered it more of a tweak than a foundational element. This rack has completely changed my mind on that.

 

[jbrrp1]

Few early impressions from the HRS VXR rack. Previously, I had tried a few footers under the Extreme (though still on the glass shelf). The footers improved the sound by getting rid of some nasties while also improving other aspects, but they also changed the overall tone of the sound. This might work well in many systems.

With the HRS VXR, the sound has improved in almost every aspect, but the tone remains the same. I now understand what others meant when they said, “The HRS rack has no sound”. This is exactly what I was looking for since I have the tone pretty close to where I want it. In comparison, and based only on long memory which is not very reliable, but I remember the footers sounding a bit smeared in the upper frequencies compared to the HRS. At that time, my system benefited from that little bit of smearing.

The sound is not only calmer now, but also more lively. Instruments have taken another step (or two) up towards realism. Bass improvement was the first thing I noticed.

I’m currently waiting on a Stromtank to be delivered next month so I’m getting by with plugging directly into the dedicated outlet. Since getting the rack, this is the first time I have found my system engaging without any power conditioner/supply. I am definitely missing some big benefits to the sound that I heard when I had the S5000 HP in for demo so the combo of the two should be a nice uptick. Hard to believe, but the S5000HP was leaps and bounds ahead in dynamics compared to directly plugging into the dedicated outlet (headphone system only). Low level detail retrieval is not even a contest, but that's to be expected.

Edit: I always knew that vibration control had its benefits, but for some reason I always considered it more of a tweak than a foundational element. This rack has completely changed my mind on that.

Thanks for sharing! So, do I understand correctly that you're listening through headphones only? When you mentioned the bass improvements particularly, I was thinking to myself how nice it is that a good rack can address feedback loop stuff - - but with headphones, that shouldn't be an issue, so the rack's influence goes beyond that. Very interesting!

 

[onlychild]

Yes, headphones only.

I'm starting to think my previous rack might have done more harm than good. Here is a pic where you can see the Extreme sitting on top of a glass shelf which is on top of a metal pole with nothing in between the pole and glass.

 

[Armsan]

Apparantly the video is about not hearing a difference between the interface used from Extreme to MSB Select, Ethernet (Renderer v2) or USB (USB Pro ISL). That could be possible since the last OS upgrade, any other MSB owners willing to try that out to verify?

Sorry Emile, I would love to but, I don’t have a Roon account anymore nor Roon installed so I can’t use my Renderer v2.

 

[dminches]

Have any of you added your own extra storage to your Extreme, and if you have, did you buy the Asus Hyper card Gen 4 or v2? Both are available and both hold 4 m.2 cards.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Have any of you added your own extra storage to your Extreme, and if you have, did you buy the Asus Hyper card Gen 4 or v2? Both are available and both hold 4 m.2 cards.

Both work fine.

 

[Raker24]

Finally achieved 400+ hours on both my Shunyata Omega USB and AES/EBU cables, both the same 1.5 meters in length, between my Taiko and the Nagra HD DAC X. In my system, and in my judgment, the AES cable clearly outperforms the USB cable, being more musical and organic, with both more substance and fluidity at the same time. The USB cable can be more "detailed", but, with the types of music I listen to (classical and jazz), that was not an advantage in most cases.

 

[Christiaan Punter]

Finally achieved 400+ hours on both my Shunyata Omega USB and AES/EBU cables, both the same 1.5 meters in length, between my Taiko and the Nagra HD DAC X. In my system, and in my judgment, the AES cable clearly outperforms the USB cable, being more musical and organic, with both more substance and fluidity at the same time. The USB cable can be more "detailed", but, with the types of music I listen to (classical and jazz), that was not an advantage in most cases.

This is a valid observation and I understand what you are describing in terms of relative differences as I have also experienced such differences in the past and present when comparing USB to AES/EBU (with non--Taiko gear). The thing is that USB is highly reliant on the implementation and quality of the interfaces on both ends. I can't speak for Nagra as I have no personal experience with the brand but I do know that the USB interface on the Extreme is built to relay the best sound quality possible, both technically as well as musically. The large majority of users seem to agree but don't let that discourage you! I always advocate for anyone to use the connection method that works best according to their own ears. If it sounds great, don't worry about it and enjoy the music!

 

[takacs75]

Finally achieved 400+ hours on both my Shunyata Omega USB and AES/EBU cables, both the same 1.5 meters in length, between my Taiko and the Nagra HD DAC X. In my system, and in my judgment, the AES cable clearly outperforms the USB cable, being more musical and organic, with both more substance and fluidity at the same time. The USB cable can be more "detailed", but, with the types of music I listen to (classical and jazz), that was not an advantage in most cases.

Have you tried different USB cables? I am using Sablon Audio Evo which outperformed my previous much more expensive usb cable. It sounds very life like, full with emotion. Maybe you just need to try one I guess I am not the only one using Sablon here.

 

[Raker24]

I've tried the Wireworld Platinum 8, Audience Front Row, and Signal Projects Avaton USB cables, in addition to the Shunyata Omega USB cable. No change in my judgment above. May try the top of the line Kubala Sosna USB cable soon.