This so called award means nothing. It means they spend a lot of advertising dollars and they give the reviewers deep discounts in exchange for “good reviews” it’s not until you actually own this stuff that you realize how overpriced and overrated it is. Then you sell it and lose money.
Thoughts on hearing a Wilson XVX Chronosonic System at Evolution Hifi
- Thread starter Lee
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Excellent segue to this thread for continued discussion on that topic.
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FTC Cracks Down on Reviewers
I don't, because the established reviewing community of authors is basically honest. I say ''established reviewing community of authors' because there are so many Web sites popping up that publish what they claim are audio reviews. Tim, I read your post and immediately fired up “Me and My...
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im not a fan of Wilson but you are talking out your a55. what you state above is total BS and you cannot prove any of it, move on and stop being foolish
OMGGGGG. Listen to you. You believe the magazines. You can’t possibly believe they exist for any other reason than to sell advertising. If you think otherwise, you are an ignoramus. Why don’t they ever post a negative review? This whole review thing is a scam and so are these stupid awards.They are used to help dealer sell products to morons who are dumb enough to believe the garbage they write in these magazines
Hahaha ,
So anyone buying from a dealer is a moron or are you waiting around for a negative review so you can snap up product ..?
So anyone buying from a dealer is a moron or are you waiting around for a negative review so you can snap up product ..?
That’s not what I said. The dealers use the fake reviews in their sales pitchesHahaha ,
So anyone buying from a dealer is a moron or are you waiting around for a negative review so you can snap up product ..?
1) You are incorrect. They do publish negative reviews. Michael Fremer, in particular, is not bashful about publishing a negative review.
2) Reviewers tend strongly to want to review components which are of personal interest to them, and which they suspect they will like. Sometimes a reviewer who owns, or who has reviewed favorably in the past, a particular component will be assigned the review of the next version of, or the successor to, that component. There are organic gravitational pulls which lead reviewers to review components they naturally are likely to enjoy. This naturally and legitimately drives up significantly the number of positive reviews, and the ratio of positive reviews to negative reviews.
3) Once in a while a reviewer will audition a component which has been sent in for review, give the manufacturer a heads-up that a review is not likely to be favorable, and the manufacturer withdraws the component from consideration. This also increases the number of positive reviews, and the ratio of positive reviews to negative reviews.
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I talked to a reviewer at Axpona in 2022. He told me that they get a lot of stuff to review. If they don't like how a certain component performs they will politely decline to review it. Negative reviews often lead to problems for reviewers.
I personally have bought components that didn't meet my expectations. I return them when I can or sell them. If you look at my posts over time it would seem like everything I ever owned is great. That's only because I don't mention the stuff that sucks. Am I doing my fellow audiophiles a disservice? Perhaps. Am I a coward for avoiding controversy and not posting negative reviews? Perhaps, or maybe I don't feel like dealing with the hassle.
I personally have bought components that didn't meet my expectations. I return them when I can or sell them. If you look at my posts over time it would seem like everything I ever owned is great. That's only because I don't mention the stuff that sucks. Am I doing my fellow audiophiles a disservice? Perhaps. Am I a coward for avoiding controversy and not posting negative reviews? Perhaps, or maybe I don't feel like dealing with the hassle.
you have been on What's Best Forum for one week and all you do is tell us you know everything about everything. 4 days in you jump on a Wilson thread and start throwing haymakers. is that why you came here? or is that just your style? if so, it's not good.
we are not your enemies here, and please stop acting as if we are. try and lower your level of angst please.
Tascam, I had a friend for many years who was once head of the UN World Food Programme. He once told me "Mike, society tends to think of cynics as smart and sophisticated people. But let me tell you something...cynicism kills children." What he meant by that is that cynicism leads to paralysis and apathy; cynics tend to not take action because they lack hope, and hope is what causes people to strive for progress - in high-end audio, and certainly in feeding the hungry.
I've lived a long and complex life, and I've come to recognize that we need a balance between lack of naivete and lack of cynicism. We can't be the sucker who chases every wild goose that comes along, but we also shouldn't be the bigot who can never trust that someone has good intent and value.
I suspect that WhatsBestForum was started for the purpose of developing a "community" of people who love high-end audio, and that its business proposition is secondary. Similarly, I think that most high-end audio publications and reviewers started the same way. Are there those who lost their way? Sure, but most of us have wandered off course at some point in our journeys, and most of us work to realign ourselves with a guiding North Star. Believing that has served both my happiness and my success pretty well.
Sorry...I didn't start out intending to be preachy!
This reply and all the subsequent ones identify you as a person who dislikes the Wilson sound. There are many of them on WBF I have discovered. Consequently, anything thing you say about Wilson I personally would not pay too much attention to, but I totally respect your opinion. You have a very nice well thought out system and I particularly like your speakers. I read the Stereophile review. They are powerful and have great bass. Personally, I think they are gorgeous. I think your choice of McIntosh is wise. I own an XVX. I have not experienced the bass bump that you mention in my room. My bass is "perfect" to my ears. My room is 40 feet long and has no standing waves. I always run my XVX as a complete system. A correctly installed Wilson subwoofer system significantly enhances not only the bass but the midrange and treble as well. I run LP only crossed over at 30 Hz. It's clear that you have put great thought into your system. I have friends that own XVX's and we believe that it represents one of the best values in the ultra high end. I think that what you could mean is that in your opinion no speaker is really worth 370K, but consider the WAMM or M9 or many others. Actually, a complete XVX system costs about 650K if you include dual Subsonics. (My humble Thor/MC2.1KW costs about 130K retail). This will make the XVX competitive with the WAMM (which comes with dual subwoofers and ActivXO analog outboard crossover) or M9 (which has built in subwoofers). These speakers cost considerably more and if you can't swing this, you can settle for the XVX itself, which is a superb speaker to many ears as well as mine, just not to yours and I totally respect your opinion. I say this because you are obviously quite knowledgeable by your choice of gear and speakers. I really love my XVX/Thor system. Dave Wilson designed the Thor. He never designed the Thor for stereo. The older Watch controller had mono out only so if you wanted dual Thors you had to buy two Watch Controllers. It replaced the XS which was a massive 750 pound monster and the Thor has even more output. I have it positioned in the classic music position Dave Wilson recommends. My bass is very smooth and pleasing to my ears. If you are ever in Nashville you are absolutely invited over to hear my system. I think you will discover it devoid of a bass bump and it goes down to well below 16HZ, easy to hear. One of the most pleasing aspects of my system is its ability to pick up extremely faint subsonic notes between .02 and .2 watts. I will attach a pic in a minute.
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Wilson is a cabinet shop. They don’t build their own drivers or crossovers. They do customize the crossovers, however. I am sure this big Wilson is a fabulous speaker, nonetheless. But, it lists for $369K. This is insane for a pair of speakers, no matter how good they are. Why is Wilson using Scanspeak drivers instead of something they make themselves? I never got to hear these speakers you have. I used to live in Nashville and bought my Wilson Sophias from a dealer in Cool Springs. The excess bass problem I heard with Wilson was probably related to the rooms I heard them in. My Sophias sounded boomy to me. The other rooms maybe weren’t large enough, but I heard the new Watt Puppy recently in a 15x20 room and they sounded way too boomy and bass heavy even with other speakers moved out of the way. I heard this on Sasha and Alexx models in the same room. Thanks for your compliments about my system.
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I really don’t think any of these so called reviewers publish negative reviews for any major advertisers. I simply don’t trust any of them. I remember wasting 10s of thousands of dollars on a Jadis system as recommended by Jonathan Scull of Stereophile. It was impossible to audition this equipment. It sounded amazing but it was an unstable, unreliable pile of garbage. Some of the Krell gear I bought, class A rated turned out to be lousy also. I use these magazines as toilet paper now.
The Absolute Sound started off as dedicated to the hobby and the equipment. When Robert took it over, he turned it into the same commercial dishrag as Stereophile. Meaning, it’s now a commercial magazine of ads and reviews just to sell products and sell ads. I trust them just as much as I trust the UN, which is not at all..
Tascam
If you want to have credibility with the readers here, you should get your facts right. Wilson has not used Scanspeak drivers for many years now. Their drivers are sourced from SB Acoustics located in East Java, Indonesia.
Marty
If you want to have credibility with the readers here, you should get your facts right. Wilson has not used Scanspeak drivers for many years now. Their drivers are sourced from SB Acoustics located in East Java, Indonesia.
Marty
You have strong opinions but you give reasons for them. That dealer would be Cumberland Audio and the owner was named Rick. I bought a lot of gear from him. He did carry Wilsons and I heard the X-1 there and the WHOW sub there. I thought it was a large coffee table. I can't remember how the X-1 sounded except it missed a very low bass note and cost 70K. I would up buying a Thiel CS5 from Nicholeson's Stereo. Here's the thing T concerning what you need to understand. I have been in the high end since my childhood. I have lost count of the number of speakers that I have owned, truly. Someone at my age and position begins to desire an endpoint. I wanted an "affordable" ultra high end speaker. I wasn't in the market for an EVO, or Alexx, Alexia, Orion, Lyra, M6, Aida... there are many others in this exalted range but simply not what I was looking for. I absolutely understand where you are coming from. However, the XVX in my room just happens to sound superb, but this is in my room. I got very lucky. I took a chance and now I am reaping the benefits. It's very cost effective for me because my XVX has totally ended my quest/thirst for another speaker, and in this sense alone it is highly cost effective for me.
I agree with you that Wilson used to be a cabinet company. They used the Focal woofers and Ti midrange "forever". However, with the advent of Daryl Wilson this deficiency has markedly improved. You are a Focal aficionado. They make superb speakers and all their own drivers. A Grande Utopia wouldn't come close to fitting in my room. So I totally understand that you believe that a company like Wilson ought to make its own drivers. But consider this. Wilson now makes all its own capacitors. They bought a very well respected large US manufacturing company and now sell their capacitors to other manufacturers. They 3-D print the rear chamber in house for their new tweeter. It took many years to complete the design of the new Quadra Mag midrange that uses 4 alnico magnets known for their midrange properties. And I can tell you that the new woofers are absolutely superb. Focal is the largest most well respected speaker company in the world, hands down no argument. Wilson is the largest American speaker manufacturer. I think on the WBF there are well heeled European and other foreign high end aficionados that are perturbed and rightfully so of Wilson's success at the expense of Focal and other foreign manufacturers, as well as owners of Rockports, (Magico owners much less so), that are sick and tired of Wilson worship. In their eyes Wilson makes a good speaker. All I can tell you about Wilson is that I know a lot of folks there personally. As far as their organization is concerned, they are some of the most humble desiring to please folks I have ever encountered. Their success has not gone to their heads. They are proud of their success but not prideful. They really shouldn't be blamed for their success in the magazines and reviews. Focal almost never receives a negative review either and many reviewers use their speakers. Ditto for Rockport and Magico.
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@Tascam- Please tone down the rhetoric a notch or three. We understand you have a strong opinion but if you want to gain credibility and respect? You are not going about it the correct way.
Said with respect.
Time will tell...
Tom
Said with respect.
Time will tell...
Tom
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