EMI and RF Filters

[Kingrex]

For a while people have talked about EMI and RF filters. In particular, filters that are free standing in a room. Filters that inject something in to the air to supposedly counter EMI and RF type noise in the listening environment.

The 2 that jump to my mind are Synergistic Researches ULF Generators

ULF

www.synergisticresearch.com

There is also Schnerzinger. These seem similar to Synergistic Research

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www.schnerzinger.com

There is also Heartsound Audio. This may fall in the category, but this is more piazodic minerals that need to be placed on a device you want to influence. It's not a electrical device that generates a field that is broadcast into the air.

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I'm curios what others products are out there and what sort of performance do they bring.
I am not interested in plug in filters or power strips. I am interested in shall I call it a field generator. Devices that do not interrupt a power, signal, ethernet or other cable. I want to know about devices that broadcast something into the air that is supposed to mitigate noise. What's out there and how well do they work. What is the perceived performance gain. Is it a verifiable reduction in noise such as shutting down hum from a physical device or out of the speakers. Or is it a subjective enhancement of clarity or soundstage or some audiophile verbage.

 

[agisthos]

I don’t know if they are still available but Audio Magic used to have a small field generator you placed inside the chassis of a digital component such as cd player or dac. It was for diy only as you needed to wire it to the mains iec terminal for power.

It was a black box with a resonator circuit, and the inside walls were coated with crystals, which would resonate/amplify whatever the resonator circuit was putting out and treat digital nasties.

It worked a treat on the highly modded Oppo transports I was using at the time.

 

[ssfas]

I've possibly wasted 5 minutes of my life googling Holosphere and 30 seconds on this post. Where do I get a refund?

 

[Kingrex]

I've possibly wasted 5 minutes of my life googling Holosphere and 30 seconds on this post. Where do I get a refund?

Send me a bill.

Hey, Steve is convinced the Schnerzinger stuff works. I'm wondering if other similar devices are out there doing the same thing. And can be had for a more affordable price.

I remember when ground boxes came out and were considered vodo. People I trust use them now. Why couldn't someone find a way to interfere with RF in the room by generating a opposing field of some sort. Of course it makes me ponder how your cell phone, wifi, bluetooth or other would still work.

 

[Alrainbow]

How are benefits to be measured aside of one’s observations in sound ?
rfi is a type of radiation so if one made there room a type of faraday cage all that is left is what the stuff in the room creates.
EMI I think is totally created in our home and audio devices I think create both EMI and RFI.
If there is a massive rabbit hole to descend into this topic rules.
a question I think Steve has solar panels
The kind that produce AC like many inverters in parallel. So in his home I can see why a line filter would work better

 

[ssfas]

Send me a bill.

Hey, Steve is convinced the Schnerzinger stuff works. I'm wondering if other similar devices are out there doing the same thing. And can be had for a more affordable price.

I remember when ground boxes came out and were considered vodo. People I trust use them now. Why couldn't someone find a way to interfere with RF in the room by generating a opposing field of some sort. Of course it makes me ponder how your cell phone, wifi, bluetooth or other would still work.

I've invested $30 in an RF meter off Amazon. I'm looking forward to playing Amateur FR Detective later this week. Maybe I should order a deerstalker and a pipe as well.

I have about 80 active IP addresses in my house. The hifi is tucked away in a corner. Let's see what I find.

Grounding boxes? Time to find different people to trust. You can hear grounding issues. Just detach the ground wire of your tonearm. I use a Puritan PM156 that has a common earth ground.

I spent 5 minutes searching Scnerdinger. Thankfully not available in the UK. $11,000 for two boxes, for EMI and RF. Thankfully 5 minutes not wasted as was on the phone to one of my sons who was explaining Syrian/Iranian/Russian politics to me. He always calls me whilst walking down the noisiest street in Tel Aviv. He was telling me the Russians are sending in weapons for a ground assault, which has a scary parallel to the Snerdinger boxes.

 

[Kingrex]

I'm not ruling out observational changes in perceived sound. I am ok with that. I am hoping there is more solid measurable evidence.

I have a Tenmars RF meter. They are tough to really understand what it is reading. They don't tell you if its RF or EMI. They don't tell you the frequency or direction its coming from. They only give a basic reading. But, its something.

 

[Kingrex]

How are benefits to be measured aside of one’s observations in sound ?
rfi is a type of radiation so if one made there room a type of faraday cage all that is left is what the stuff in the room creates.
EMI I think is totally created in our home and audio devices I think create both EMI and RFI.
If there is a massive rabbit hole to descend into this topic rules.
a question I think Steve has solar panels
The kind that produce AC like many inverters in parallel. So in his home I can see why a line filter would work better

Our gear makes RF. So do our cell phones and routers/wifi. But they are nothing compared to the intensity of AM/FM radio, Cell Towers, TV towers.

All these impacts on the gear in out room and the power/signal feeding them is the exact reason I am curious about a broadcasting device designed to mitigate their impacts. It would be a monumental task to try and cage the noise out. I know one well known memeber that purchased a pile of Mu metal and is trying to point source eliminate RF noise to his equipment. We shall see.

 

[ssfas]

Our gear makes RF. So do our cell phones and routers/wifi. But they are nothing compared to the intensity of AM/FM radio, Cell Towers, TV towers.

All these impacts on the gear in out room and the power/signal feeding them is the exact reason I am curious about a broadcasting device designed to mitigate their impacts. It would be a monumental task to try and cage the noise out. I know one well known memeber that purchased a pile of Mu metal and is trying to point source eliminate RF noise to his equipment. We shall see.

I think this thread might generate a neurosis for the few without one, or those who wish to add to their collection.

 

[Kingrex]

I think this thread might generate a neurosis for the few without one, or those who wish to add to their collection.

I personally want to add one.. I don't have $6,000 for 1 and 12,000 for the full sonic affect. I would like to find a $1600 or so product with decent impact.

Synergistic seems to imply the same impacts. A very different name. But claims it helps with RF and the earths fundimental harmonic.

 

[ssfas]

I personally want to add one.. I don't have $6,000 for 1 and 12,000 for the full sonic affect. I would like to find a $1600 or so product with decent impact.

I live in a non-FOMO largely tweakless bubble.

All my products are "out of the box" except for replacement power cables (Puritan and Supra), a SoTM 9v battery power supply for a fibre/copper media converter and Isoacoustics pro black pads to replace my speaker's spikes (I have wooden floors and I prefer them).

No funny fuses, tuning cups, cable elevators, magic pens, grounding boxes, magic crystals, oscillators, ....

I do sometimes enjoy reading about these things and ticking off my tweakology mental checklist:

- Years of research and no sleep whatsoever
- Very clever scientists dedicated to your listening pleasure
- Realignment of atoms
- Electrons on roller-skates
- The rarest of rare metals used, and buckets of graphene
- More graphene
- Multiple prototypes
- Hand-made to order by Umpalumpas
- Amazing reviews we didn't pay for
- 30 day money-back guarantee (but we've fried your brain, so we don't expect to hear from you again)

Most tweaks will get around 7/10 or 8/10. It's a pattern.

p.s. Can you not build a Faraday cage large enough for $1,600?

 

[fbhifi]

I personally want to add one.. I don't have $6,000 for 1 and 12,000 for the full sonic affect. I would like to find a $1600 or so product with decent impact.

Synergistic seems to imply the same impacts. A very different name. But claims it helps with RF and the earths fundimental harmonic.

There’s certainly a big buzz currently over the Schnerzinger units in another thread here. I went on their website and read the product description. Can’t really make heads or tails out of how the two pieces work. They both have antennas, in fact two of different lengths, which suggest that they take the EMF and EMI nasties out of the immediate environment and into the little black box that the antenna is attached to. What happens next, who knows. The literature was clear as technobabble mud.

Speaking of technobabble, I went thru the same exercise at Mr. Denney’s companies’ website for the UEF unit. Same dog, different fleas as with the Schnerzinger regarding how the thing works.

I wouldn’t have spent the few hours dicking with this on Steve’s Schnerzinger thread and the two manufacturer websites if the remedial promises of these products didn’t perk my interest. We’ll see if the Schnerzinger thread has any legs and whether any tangible information comes forth. Perhaps Gideon at Audioarts could arrange for in home demos for those interested in learning/hearing more about these units.

 

[ssfas]

which suggest that they take the EMF and EMI nasties out of the immediate environment and into the little black box that the antenna is attached to

When you get to having to assume that the antennae suck in EMF and RFI, you should realise the game's up. If they did that, don't bother trying to use your mobile. And what does it do with all that stuff, expunge it every once in a while in a great big electrofart?

 

[Kingrex]

I usually think of a small antenna like that as a transmitter, not receiver. Not unless the receiving was to harminize a frequency, then sent out its own to try and cancel the incoming.

 

[fbhifi]

When you get to having to assume that the antennae suck in EMF and RFI, you should realise the game's up. If they did that, don't bother trying to use your mobile. And what does it do with all that stuff, expunge it every once in a while in a great big electrofart?

We are all guessing on how the Schnerzinger devices work. I thought about it and came up with a guess. Antennas do, in fact, intercept over the air signals and process them into tv and radio programming.

This may, in fact, not be the case regarding the Schnerzinger units, that’s fine, so be it.

I put forth an idea, now please help those of us who are too ignorant as to what IS going on inside these black boxes.

 

[Kingrex]

I'm not that interested in Schnerzinger, unless the information helps me to understand other devices that are similar. That are budget friendly. Is.there anything else out there.

 

[wil]

It seems likely to me that …..If there is something based of actual scientific phenomena related to rfi/emi elimination associated with Scherzinger and Synergistic Research, then some qualified technician or scientist with access to the right measuring devices could pretty easily conclude what these commercial products are doing.

 

[Kingrex]

It seems likely to me that …..If there is something based of actual scientific phenomena related to rfi/emi elimination associated with Scherzinger and Synergistic Research, then some qualified technician or scientist with access to the right measuring devices could pretty easily conclude what these commercial products are doing.

There seemed to be a lot of professional individuals on this forum with scientific degrees?

What's funny is when Ted came out with it, they called him a crackpot.

 

[RikkiPoo]

Two things I have learned to disregard in this hobby are opinions on what is an acceptable price to performance, and the importance of being able to or the need to measure the sonic basis, of components.

Price to performance is subjective and individual but I won't let someone's opinion of value influence mine. I also put way more stock in general consensus of how components sound vs how they measure.

The price's mentioned are high for me but some day I might be tempted to try EMF RFI suppression. I try not to buy gear that is going thru a fad stage, I'll let the dust settle and see if they are still the hot item in a few years.

A few years ago I tried a CAD grounding box and while it was expensive I bought a second because its effect was so soothing and relaxed. I also have 3 Akiko Corelli AC boxes and they have a similar but not quite so profound effect.

 

[Kingrex]

My chat with chat GPT. It gives some interesting possible insights. Would explain why Schnerzinger would have 2 lengths if antenna. And a plug to the wall to dissipate to ground