Is it "whats best forum" , or what's more expensive

[MylesBAstor]

True but the point I am trying to make is that in every comparison, there will always be some who prefer A,B or C but who is right? Do we go back to measurements? In my example, how do you go about it to decide conclusively which format is better?

You get a master or second generation tape and make a PCM or DSD copy and listen for the fidelity to the original tape.

 

[MylesBAstor]

"How many angles are on the top of a needle?"

Think you mean angels.

 

[MylesBAstor]

Well of course; my point was simple - there is disagreement as usual among qualified listeners and users.

So then one has to weight and choose who you believe-like in any field. There's no fence sitting.

 

[paskinn]

So then one has to weight and choose who you believe-like in any field. There's no fence sitting.

That's like saying there can be no 'fence sitting' when discussing favourite clothes. This is a subjective hobby, we don't decide purely on the basis of measurements. Inherent in that position is the certainty that their can be no 'objective' conclusion.It is always logically possible to reply to any such claim of 'best' with the simple answer: 'no it isn't'. In philosophy this is often known as the ''is-ought'' fallacy...the belief that any set of values can lead to a fact (ie...it is true.).There are just lots and lots of opinions, and that is all.The fact that a like minded group assemble around certain claims does not increase the 'truth' of the claim. At one point, most people believed in witchcraft. This is why arrogant assertions about the quality of favoured products are just that....arrogant. There are no real 'gurus', no prophets, but there are a few very inflated egos...just look at the self-importance and vanity that stalked the early years, under HP, of 'The Absolute Sound'.it was great magazine slowly brought down by rampant egotism.

 

[edorr]

So then one has to weight and choose who you believe-like in any field. There's no fence sitting.

So what are you supposed to do when you get off the fence and firmly commit to DSD? Donate you CD collection to charity and listen to channel classic and 2L nordic sound DSD downloads.

 

[JackD201]

All I want is Hi-Rez file providers (both DSD and PCM) to give me the option of buying their files in USB sticks. Download speeds here are beyond pitiful and I'm not willing to pay the $600 a month the providers are asking. Thank God for LPs.

 

[edorr]

All I want is Hi-Rez file providers (both DSD and PCM) to give me the option of buying their files in USB sticks. Download speeds here are beyond pitiful and I'm not willing to pay the $600 a month the providers are asking. Thank God for LPs.

Have you considered upgrading your 2400 baud modem?

 

[JackD201]

Lol!

 

[Mike Lavigne]

So what are you supposed to do when you get off the fence and firmly commit to DSD? Donate you CD collection to charity and listen to channel classic and 2L nordic sound DSD downloads.

'firmly committing to dsd' has nothing to do with abandoning PCM or redbook specifically. in my case i have approx 5 terabytes including 3000 CD's on my server along with a couple thousand hirez PCM and many hundreds of dsd files. some nights i'll go to the redbook, put together a playlist and enjoy. with redbook i'm not feeling like i'm missing anything.

just because we all might have particular rankings of formats does not take away from the fact that it's all good. the points of differences are only whether dsd is worth pursueing. to my ears it's more like my analog so i do prefer it; but i'm not exclusive.

 

[Bruce B]

All this discussion about the inherent superiority of one format over the other is completely moot in the absence of DSD content, short of demo files for audio shows and in home sound quality show off sessions. Meanwhile, in the real world music publishers keep releasing 96/24 and 192/24 Flacs, (and will eventually jump on DXD is my prediction).

This hasn't stopped the tape guys from lack of content, which is even more scarce than DSD files. I will tell you that DXD ain't gonna happen. At least not commercially. The files are just too big (1GB/track) and DSD at a smaller file size is better sonically. DXD was just created to fix a problem. That was how to edit DSD files. There are ways to edit DSD natively.... has been for a while.

I see a bright future for DSD... I can see it in my crystal ball.

 

[edorr]

'firmly committing to dsd' has nothing to do with abandoning PCM or redbook specifically. in my case i have approx 5 terabytes including 3000 CD's on my server along with a couple thousand hirez PCM and many hundreds of dsd files. some nights i'll go to the redbook, put together a playlist and enjoy. with redbook i'm not feeling like i'm missing anything.

just because we all might have particular rankings of formats does not take away from the fact that it's all good. the points of differences are only whether dsd is worth pursueing. to my ears it's more like my analog so i do prefer it; but i'm not exclusive.

I probably miscronstrued the "there is no fence sitting" metaphor as suggesting one has to choose between formats. Myles probably simply meant you have to make up your mind about what sounds best to you.

 

[JackD201]

Please,please tell your clients to sell on SSM Bruce.

 

[edorr]

This hasn't stopped the tape guys from lack of content. I will tell you that DXD ain't gonna happen. At least not commercially. The files are just too big (1GB/track) and DSD at a smaller file size is better sonically. DXD was just created to fix a problem. That was how to edit DSD files. There are ways to edit DSD natively.... has been for a while.

I see a bright future for DSD... I can see it in my crystal ball.

If DSD goes the way of vinyl I would consider your crystal ball correct - A vibrant audiophile niche with a future and reasonable amount of content. If DSD goes the way of tape your crystal ball is way off. We will see.

Do you have Prince's "Crystal Ball" 4 CD set? The album "The Truth" which is part of the package in particular is a brilliant "Prince unplugged" type recording. (Opps wrong thread....)

 

[MylesBAstor]

I probably miscronstrued the "there is no fence sitting" metaphor as suggesting one has to choose between formats. Myles probably simply meant you have to make up your mind about what sounds best to you.

Yes

One thing HP taught me as a writer is that you have to take a stance. In other words, you do in the end have to pick what you think sounds the closest to real music.

 

[Bruce B]

If DSD goes the way of vinyl I would consider your crystal ball correct - A vibrant audiophile niche with a future and reasonable amount of content. If DSD goes the way of tape your crystal ball is way off.

People are jumping on tapes and vinyl 50 years later. DSD has a bright future!

 

[Andre Marc]

DSD has a bright future?

UNLIKE vinyl and tape..not for the mass market...c'mon lets get real.

 

[Bruce B]

DSD has a bright future?

UNLIKE vinyl and tape..not for the mass market...c'mon lets get real.

Guess all of these DAC manufacturers are just wasting their time. I'm wasting my time in the studio as well.
Fine with me if you don't have any DSD files. Just don't ask us to join you!

 

[Andre Marc]

Guess all of these DAC manufacturers are just wasting their time. I'm wasting my time in the studio as well.
Fine with me if you don't have any DSD files. Just don't ask us to join you!

Bruce..that is not what I meant..! I DON"T think DSD is a waste of time. I think it is fabulous.

I meant let's get real about its appeal to ANYTHING but a tiny group of aficionados. DSD ready
DACs are cool, but most people don't even know what a PCM DAC is outside of this hobby.

The fact is 95% of the worlds music will bypass DSD.

You know well from working with HDTracks that Warner Bros archive a huge chunk of their tapes in 192/24 PCM.

All I am saying is let's not put some false spin DSD in the greater scheme of things.

In a perfect word..ALL the great mastertapes of the 20th century would be archived to DSD!

 

[Orb]

Just how many studios are native DSD or providing DSD downloads beyond "niche" categories?
Using quotes because it is pretty painful to think of certain musical genres as niche, even though it is always these that are offered in studio master type quality download.

Cheers
Orb

 

[MarinJim]

'firmly committing to dsd' has nothing to do with abandoning PCM or redbook specifically. in my case i have approx 5 terabytes including 3000 CD's on my server along with a couple thousand hirez PCM and many hundreds of dsd files. some nights i'll go to the redbook, put together a playlist and enjoy. with redbook i'm not feeling like i'm missing anything.

just because we all might have particular rankings of formats does not take away from the fact that it's all good. the points of differences are only whether dsd is worth pursueing. to my ears it's more like my analog so i do prefer it; but i'm not exclusive.

Well said, Mike.