Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

[Taiko Audio]

As the hole pattern on the Extreme topcover was recently discussed I will share a short of the machining process. All CNC machining of the Extreme is done in house now as the supply chain situation has made relying on external suppliers unreliable. We have managed to produce 48 Extremes in June of which about 75% has shipped with the remaing 25% shipping this week.

 

[Kris]

The yellow from the secondary, must be connected to the incoming earth wire. In addition, all the shields at the transformer to the same earth point as well. Can't emphasise enough for the balancing to work and for safety requirements, the centre point on the secondary needs to be at earth potential. Connect the equipment earthing points to the same earth terminal.

If you use two transformers to split the load, perhaps to sources and a different transformer to power amps, connect the secondary earth point to each others, keep this wire short or the same length to avoid voltages differences between the two connections. Star earthing always works, in this case, works well.

When finished on the install, measure the red to earth and black to earth, should be very close within 1-2 V, the lower the better for noise cancellation.

For protection, a GFCI/ELCB/RCD 2 pole device needs to be wired from the secondary to the loads, since the primary ground fault interrupter from the house can't see the secondary.

Thank you.
Looks I followed exactly this steps.
Exept I did not check the secondary voltages difference.
Will do it for sure

Also I dont understand fully your last sentence .
Could you please be so kind to explain?

 

[Taiko Audio]

Thank you.
Looks I followed exactly this steps.
Exept I did not check the secondary voltages difference.
Will do it for sure

Also I dont understand fully your last sentence .
Could you please be so kind to explain?

With the secondary center tap ("ground") floating there's no reference for "-" 115 and "+" 115, so it could turn into for example "-" 30 and "+" 200 relative to ground. And it can be hazardous without a GFCI.

 

[cat6man]

Thanks a lot @romaz for giving us more insights on the battery investigations, very interesting read!!

@romaz and anyone else

This is very interesting stuff and shows a path to lower noise future.

Are there any decent (or least bad) battery management designs out there? How about 5v battery designs or products with low output impedance and noise?

 

[Kris]

With the secondary center tap ("ground") floating there's no reference for "-" 115 and "+" 115, so it could turn into for example "-" 30 and "+" 200 relative to ground. And it can be hazardous without a GFCI.

As far as I see the secondary ground should be connected to the primary ground based on previous recommendations. Then there is reference point.
I dont think anyone uses floating secondary ground In commercial balanced solution.

 

[Kris]

@romaz and anyone else

This is very interesting stuff and shows a path to lower noise future.

Are there any decent (or least bad) battery management designs out there? How about 5v battery designs or products with low output impedance and noise?

Bakoon is a very good and inexpensive solution.
it has self charging 2 battery packs with full charging isolation.
so it isolates second battery pack when charging it from used 1st pack.
Very small and estetic device.
I still have 5 of those supplys , but use only 2 of them If you want to try.

 

[romaz]

@romaz and anyone else

This is very interesting stuff and shows a path to lower noise future.

Are there any decent (or least bad) battery management designs out there? How about 5v battery designs or products with low output impedance and noise?

Bakoon is a very good and inexpensive solution.
it has self charging 2 battery packs with full charging isolation.
so it isolates second battery pack when charging it from used 1st pack.
Very small and estetic device.
I still have 5 of those supplys , but use only 2 of them If you want to try.

Beyond the Bakoon, there is the EAhibrid PureDC-B1 which outputs 5, 9, or 12V.

PureDC-B1 é»æ± ç·é» é»è²ï¼é»æ± ä¾é» ç·æ§é»æºï¼

PureDC-B1 Battery Linear Power Supply (Black)PureDC-B1 é»æ± ç·é» é»è²ï¼é»æ± ä¾é» ç·æ§é»æºï¼

www.eahibrid.com

The website states that 2170 Li-ion batteries are used with a burst discharge capability of 45-50A. At 5V, that suggests an output impedance of around 100 milliohms which is not great and output impedance will be even higher at 9 and 12V.

The Bakoon BPS-02 claims a "peak" output capability of 1.5A which is hard to believe but if true, means this PSU has horribly high output impedance of >3 ohms at 5V.

At least on paper, it would be difficult for me to recommend either of these battery solutions but if isolation is what you are after, I suppose you would achieve that with these units.

For 5-24V, you would be better off with something like a Sean Jacobs ARC6 DC4, Plixir Eilte BDC, or a Farad even though they are connected to mains, imho.

As for balanced power, the Plixir Elite BDC uses a balanced transformer as do my Paul Hynes power supplies. Having owned an Equitech Son of Q (also a balanced power supply) along with power supplies from Plixir and Paul Hynes, they do a good job but it is my understanding that balanced power does not provide complete isolation as they mitigate common mode noise but not transverse (or differential) mode noise. My Plixir and Paul Hynes supplies and their balanced transformers both benefit significantly by being plugged into my TT-7 which specializes in transverse mode noise to 3GHz.

This makes the BPS that Emile has developed all the more compelling and why he calls it a "problem solving" power supply because it offers true isolation, a nanovolt level noise floor, and ultra low impedance. And yes, the process of DC to AC inversion or AC to DC rectification generate their own noise and will impact noise floor and so to completely stay within the DC realm from beginning to end is ideal. At least on paper, Emile's BPS is as pure and perfect a power supply as I can imagine.

 

[CKKeung]

Beyond the Bakoon, there is the EAhibrid PureDC-B1 which outputs 5, 9, or 12V.

View attachment 95315

PureDC-B1 é»æ± ç·é» é»è²ï¼é»æ± ä¾é» ç·æ§é»æºï¼

PureDC-B1 Battery Linear Power Supply (Black)PureDC-B1 é»æ± ç·é» é»è²ï¼é»æ± ä¾é» ç·æ§é»æºï¼

www.eahibrid.com

The website states that 2170 Li-ion batteries are used with a burst discharge capability of 45-50A. At 5V, that suggests an output impedance of around 100 milliohms which is not great and output impedance will be even higher at 9 and 12V.

The Bakoon BPS-02 claims a "peak" output capability of 1.5A which is hard to believe but if true, means this PSU has horribly high output impedance of >3 ohms at 5V.

At least on paper, it would be difficult for me to recommend either of these battery solutions but if isolation is what you are after, I suppose you would achieve that with these units.

For 5-24V, you would be better off with something like a Sean Jacobs ARC6 DC4, Plixir Eilte BDC, or a Farad even though they are connected to mains, imho.

As for balanced power, the Plixir Elite BDC uses a balanced transformer as do my Paul Hynes power supplies. Having owned an Equitech Son of Q (also a balanced power supply) along with power supplies from Plixir and Paul Hynes, they do a good job but it is my understanding that balanced power does not provide complete isolation as they mitigate common mode noise but not transverse (or differential) mode noise. My Plixir and Paul Hynes supplies and their balanced transformers both benefit significantly by being plugged into my TT-7 which specializes in transverse mode noise to 3GHz.

This makes the BPS that Emile has developed all the more compelling and why he calls it a "problem solving" power supply because it offers true isolation, a nanovolt level noise floor, and ultra low impedance. And yes, the process of DC to AC inversion or AC to DC rectification generate their own noise and will impact noise floor and so to completely stay within the DC realm from beginning to end is ideal. At least on paper, Emile's BPS is as pure and perfect a power supply as I can imagine.

Hi Romaz,
I have similar experience on battery psu and have yet to encounter one that doesn't have the "soft sound/transients'.

I also like the Plixir products with internal balance isolation transformer a lot because of their high performance/cost ratios.

BTW have you tested the following two configs : Equitech>TT-7 vs TT-7>Equitech?
Do you notice any diff?

Thanks!

 

[Kris]

Beyond the Bakoon, there is the EAhibrid PureDC-B1 which outputs 5, 9, or 12V.

View attachment 95315

PureDC-B1 é»æ± ç·é» é»è²ï¼é»æ± ä¾é» ç·æ§é»æºï¼

PureDC-B1 Battery Linear Power Supply (Black)PureDC-B1 é»æ± ç·é» é»è²ï¼é»æ± ä¾é» ç·æ§é»æºï¼

www.eahibrid.com

The website states that 2170 Li-ion batteries are used with a burst discharge capability of 45-50A. At 5V, that suggests an output impedance of around 100 milliohms which is not great and output impedance will be even higher at 9 and 12V.

The Bakoon BPS-02 claims a "peak" output capability of 1.5A which is hard to believe but if true, means this PSU has horribly high output impedance of >3 ohms at 5V.

At least on paper, it would be difficult for me to recommend either of these battery solutions but if isolation is what you are after, I suppose you would achieve that with these units.

For 5-24V, you would be better off with something like a Sean Jacobs ARC6 DC4, Plixir Eilte BDC, or a Farad even though they are connected to mains, imho.

As for balanced power, the Plixir Elite BDC uses a balanced transformer as do my Paul Hynes power supplies. Having owned an Equitech Son of Q (also a balanced power supply) along with power supplies from Plixir and Paul Hynes, they do a good job but it is my understanding that balanced power does not provide complete isolation as they mitigate common mode noise but not transverse (or differential) mode noise. My Plixir and Paul Hynes supplies and their balanced transformers both benefit significantly by being plugged into my TT-7 which specializes in transverse mode noise to 3GHz.

This makes the BPS that Emile has developed all the more compelling and why he calls it a "problem solving" power supply because it offers true isolation, a nanovolt level noise floor, and ultra low impedance. And yes, the process of DC to AC inversion or AC to DC rectification generate their own noise and will impact noise floor and so to completely stay within the DC realm from beginning to end is ideal. At least on paper, Emile's BPS is as pure and perfect a power supply as I can imagine.

Romaz
I agree 100%
I still have one PH SR7 supply and three SJ ARC6 ( rach 3 rails) and yes those are excellent sounding, but this is much more expensive solution.
PH and SJ are not battery power supply.

I cant wait for EMILE introduction to his new BPS made for Extreme.
Hope he will make the BPS available for the other equipment such as his switch , router , usb card and network card.

We all need a lot of clean power !

 

[CKKeung]

I remember Emile told us that the new external PSU (with or without battery) gives two or three DC outputs in additional to supplying the server unit, and these are for the coming Taiko switch, router ...etc.

 

[romaz]

Hi Romaz,
I have similar experience on battery psu and have yet to encounter one that doesn't have the "soft sound/transients'.

I also like the Plixir products with internal balance isolation transformer a lot because of their high performance/cost ratios.

BTW have you tested the following two configs : Equitech>TT-7 vs TT-7>Equitech?
Do you notice any diff?

Thanks!

Peter, I bought and sold my Equitech long before I ever heard a TT-7. While the Equitech made a positive difference in my system, it wasn't a significant improvement and was bested by several Shunyata products which prompted me to sell the Equitech. From there, I tried other power line conditioners / distributors / AC generators before settling on the TT-7 plugged directly into mains. Like many, I am leery of many of these devices as they are notorious for adding impedance to the circuit and stunting dynamics but neither the latest Shunyata products nor the TT-7 seem to do that. While both companies make excellent products that are easy to recommend, ultimately, the TT-7 drew me in because comparatively, while the Shunyata excelled in dynamics, transients were slower/softer/sleepier compared to the TT-7. I haven't been able to compare Shunyata's latest Everest which I'm told is a big step better than the Triton V3 / Typhon QR I had here but the best I have heard to date by far (and just recently) is Jim Weil's latest version of the TT-7 with tin foil capacitors and a full array of QSA-treated outlets, magnetic breaker, and IEC. That model is owned by someone else but when I had it here for testing, it was mind boggling good although fully adorned with QSA treatment, that TT-7 retails for >$30k.

The problem with all of this is that the quality of my power grid is likely different from Kris' grid in Poland and your grid in Hong Kong and so what works best here may not be what works best in other places and so making recommendations potentially becomes an expensive crapshoot but therein lies the beauty of Emile's BPS. No matter where on Earth you live, how flawed your grid is, or what time of the day it is, a BPS-powered Extreme will sound the same.

 

[romaz]

Hope he will make the BPS available for the other equipment such as his switch , router , usb card and network card.

We all need a lot of clean power !

Here are Emile's own words:

"The network card is powered internally. The router includes a new type of “problem solving” powersupply which we would ideally have for the switch too, however I’m unsure if this will be available in sufficient numbers when the switch launches, in which case we may have to temporarily resort to using an “old fashioned” external DC supply."

Emile will correct me if I'm wrong but I believe this "problem solving" power supply is the BPS scaled appropriately for his router and switch.

"It has 3 outputs and can be expanded to more "

"We can scale it to power everything we want."

 

[CKKeung]

Peter, I bought and sold my Equitech long before I ever heard a TT-7. While the Equitech made a positive difference in my system, it wasn't a significant improvement and was bested by several Shunyata products which prompted me to sell the Equitech. From there, I tried other power line conditioners / distributors / AC generators before settling on the TT-7 plugged directly into mains. Like many, I am leery of many of these devices as they are notorious for adding impedance to the circuit and stunting dynamics but neither the latest Shunyata products nor the TT-7 seem to do that. While both companies make excellent products that are easy to recommend, ultimately, the TT-7 drew me in because comparatively, while the Shunyata excelled in dynamics, transients were slower/softer/sleepier compared to the TT-7. I haven't been able to compare Shunyata's latest Everest which I'm told is a big step better than the Triton V3 / Typhon QR I had here but the best I have heard to date by far (and just recently) is Jim Weil's latest version of the TT-7 with tin foil capacitors and a full array of QSA-treated outlets, magnetic breaker, and IEC. That model is owned by someone else but when I had it here for testing, it was mind boggling good although fully adorned with QSA treatment, that TT-7 retails for >$30k.

The problem with all of this is that the quality of my power grid is likely different from Kris' grid in Poland and your grid in Hong Kong and so what works best here may not be what works best in other places and so making recommendations potentially becomes an expensive crapshoot but therein lies the beauty of Emile's BPS. No matter where on Earth you live, how flawed your grid is, or what time of the day it is, a BPS-powered Extreme will sound the same.

Thanks Roy for your sharing?

BTW I heard that the new two-chassis Taiko flagship server will have a new name : Apex.

 

[Taiko Audio]

I'm not sure "expensive" is the reason something sounds better.



Yes, that's my point. If you think your Bakoon sounds as good or better than your PH or SJ, then we value different things in a power supply. To date, I have yet to hear a battery sound as good as either of these products.



Here are Emile's own words:

"The network card is powered internally. The router includes a new type of “problem solving” powersupply which we would ideally have for the switch too, however I’m unsure if this will be available in sufficient numbers when the switch launches, in which case we may have to temporarily resort to using an “old fashioned” external DC supply."

Emile will correct me if I'm wrong but I believe this "problem solving" power supply is the BPS scaled appropriately for his router and switch.

"It has 3 outputs and can be expanded to more "

"We can scale it to power everything we want."

Yes but the router may need it’s own supply as most people don’t place that near their system.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Thanks Roy for your sharing?

BTW I heard that the new two-chassis Taiko flagship server will have a new name : Apex.

Is that a suggestion?

 

[Taiko Audio]

For those who missed it on the WBF home / video page:

 

[matthias]

BTW I heard that the new two-chassis Taiko flagship server will have a new name : Apex.

"Twin Peak"

Matt

 

[MarkusBarkus]

...Apex Twins.

 

[rando]

Is that a suggestion?

Acme might have fit the English speaking world if it didn't fall so close to acne.

Or running blindly into a wall.

For those who missed it on the WBF home / video page:

To how large of an extent did you personally cast and consult on the wardrobes for this video?

Edit: I was impressed it managed to be a decade out of reference and modern at the same time. In other words nearly perfect for audiophile purposes.

 

[Kris]

Here are Emile's own words:

"The network card is powered internally. The router includes a new type of “problem solving” powersupply which we would ideally have for the switch too, however I’m unsure if this will be available in sufficient numbers when the switch launches, in which case we may have to temporarily resort to using an “old fashioned” external DC supply."

Emile will correct me if I'm wrong but I believe this "problem solving" power supply is the BPS scaled appropriately for his router and switch.

"It has 3 outputs and can be expanded to more "

"We can scale it to power everything we want."

Like many of us ….
this is just being impatient In waiting for that to happen
I was thinking to fly over and help Taiko Team but unfortunate this wont help getting it faster in my system.