Koetsu
- Thread starter jadis
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That’s right and it’s because of the horrible, roll-off, cardboard sounding vdh cable inside top SME arms. It’s better to get rid of that cable at all. Or matching it with lyra or vdh cartridges is another option.
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I found the same with Graham Elite, Schroeder, Ikeda, and a few others when matched with Koetsu. The ones that worked well with Koetsu were FR, Glanz, and Vertere. Koetsu also do well with SUTs, get some much needed life.
IMHO/IME:
- None of the top cartridges priced according to the labor or parts. They’re priced based on the reputation and final sound. Companies charge as much as the sound and reputation allows. The same rule applies for retipping too. They charge based on retail price of the cartridge not the labor. A 500$ cartridge’s retipping does not require less labor than a 16.000$ one. Sometimes it’s even harder due to more coil windings and a relatively fragile aluminum/magnesium cantilever.
-A retipped cartridge doesn’t always sound and measure as good as a new one and I’m talking only about retipping by the manufacturer.
- Koetsu cartridges sound and measure rolled-off and vdh, ortofon, lyra sound bright, tipped up or sometimes edgy. Of course there are exceptions. That doesn’t mean those cartridges are bad, it’s all about personal preference and finding a matching tonearm and turntable.
- A better tonearm is the one that can get rid of distortion, artificial harmonics. It can be very pure, precise and dynamic at the same time. It’s more obvious on heavy passages of classical music. In that regard I haven’t come across a good uni-pivot, linear tracker or tangential.
- SME V is not the best tonearm as advertised but is a very good arm. Does many things right once the vdh inner cable and tonearm cable is changed. IMHO even if the the cables are changed it’s still not a good match for Koetsu cartridges. Fidelity Research tonearms might be a better choice due to livelier steel tube.
- None of the top cartridges priced according to the labor or parts. They’re priced based on the reputation and final sound. Companies charge as much as the sound and reputation allows. The same rule applies for retipping too. They charge based on retail price of the cartridge not the labor. A 500$ cartridge’s retipping does not require less labor than a 16.000$ one. Sometimes it’s even harder due to more coil windings and a relatively fragile aluminum/magnesium cantilever.
-A retipped cartridge doesn’t always sound and measure as good as a new one and I’m talking only about retipping by the manufacturer.
- Koetsu cartridges sound and measure rolled-off and vdh, ortofon, lyra sound bright, tipped up or sometimes edgy. Of course there are exceptions. That doesn’t mean those cartridges are bad, it’s all about personal preference and finding a matching tonearm and turntable.
- A better tonearm is the one that can get rid of distortion, artificial harmonics. It can be very pure, precise and dynamic at the same time. It’s more obvious on heavy passages of classical music. In that regard I haven’t come across a good uni-pivot, linear tracker or tangential.
- SME V is not the best tonearm as advertised but is a very good arm. Does many things right once the vdh inner cable and tonearm cable is changed. IMHO even if the the cables are changed it’s still not a good match for Koetsu cartridges. Fidelity Research tonearms might be a better choice due to livelier steel tube.
Appreciate your comments, mtemur. I have no disagreement on most of what you pointed out.
Regarding the inner and tonearm cables of tonearms, do we now experiment on what cable matches the cartridge? If so, what brands or what kind? I'm sure it's not an easy job to pull out the thin inner cables on both ends of the tonearms but it is easy to find another brand for the phono cable with DIN plugs. We might as well find the best match of the phono stage to the preamp after this. It may be a maddening exercise, but I do believe in synergies in cables, if one has the time and patience and ability to try them all . For the inner cable, some technical expertise is needed.
Availability of a full array of affordable repair and rebuild services, at prices that reflect real costs, was a major aspect of why I chose to work with the cartridge lines I have. That said brands like Koetsu and Lyra have cultivated a very good reputation and this is not a given in audiophile industries, so some credit due
If you ask my opinion my answer is Kondo, especially for SME V. Changing inner cable is not an easy job but worths the effort. IMHO inner cable should be chosen IOT match the tonearm not the cartridge. My preference for DIN to RCA tonearm cable is also Kondo but cable is a subjective matter and I respect everybody's personal preference.
Ditto! My stock VPI 3D Primes arm handles any music I’ve thrown at it and it’s not even their top of the line arm.
I have used the ET 2 tonearm on the Black and Rosewood Signature for a total of 20 years. I've also tested the Jade, Urushi Gold and the Blue Lace with this arm ,briefly, as a distributor.
Just finished installing a newly rebuilt Tiger Eye. Tonearm is a 12" Acoustic Signature TA2000.
They charge on reputation, I doubt on the sound. Of all components in the chain, cartridge is the most often bought unheard or without proper exposure. And on this forum, even out of curiosity. Very few non-dealers have the resources to do what Tang, Gian, Mike, or Audioquattr do, that is line up many combinations to try and make a choice. And even they cannot properly exhaust the options. Most will just come to the forum and buy a talked about cartridge. They will do their research by reading threads talking good about the cartridge. Prices of carts also vary on jurisdictions, and the margin between distributor's landing price and the final retail price varies a lot from cart to cart.
Also, what if one cart is just an inefficient design that leads to higher retip costs? Is that justified? If you ask me to build a speaker, it will take years and I will charge a lot to pay for the wastage that occurs during my learning. I really don't think Sugano's son is any more talented than van den hul himself when it comes to retipping cartridges. Fremer's report states that reason for Top Wing's low retip cost is that all of the wiring is inside the cartridge body and disconnected from the cantilever, so the stylus can be easily replaced, at far less cost than with a typical MC. I am sure each of the carts which have a lower retip cost are doing something that makes it easier to do so.
In any case, none of these carts are soooo much better than all others that a massively high retipping cost is justified except to make the buyer feel loyal and good about himself and what he owns.
A friend who owned a couple of Koetsus that sounded awful, started sounding nice after he added the Soulution preamp between Allnic phono and poweramp. Never thought a preamp change would affect cartridge sound so much.
Durand and the Primary control field coil that Mike Lavigne owns are great unipivots, with the FC giving more stability to the pivot. The impression of the Primary control FC was very nuanced and liquid like. Vyger linear tracker is my favorite table though yes, I have found an issue with other LTs like Bergmann, but then the Holbo mk1 is a great value in the used market until someone gets money to upgrade. Schroeder LT could be very good too though I have not done any compares but hope to. It is also very tough to maintain.
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I can not say anything about Primary Control but I had some experience with Durand uni-pivot. IMHO it's not a good arm, it's not consistent, not even provide a constant VTF. I suspect the azimuth bar on the side which also holds anti-skating weight cause more friction on the string than a regular race bearing.
Well at Mike's Joel Durand himself is local so he will not have these issues. Mike and Jazdoc are the ones most familiar on the forum with the Durand arm.
Do you mean he had no preamp at that time between the Allnic phono and poweramp and then inserted a Soulution preamp?
Hi Ked
please explain your logical or illogical rational behind Lyra's overpriced rebuild?
Lyra throw away everything in the cartridge except the body and rebuild it - so you are getting a new cartridge at 50% off the retail price.
I assume Koetsu do a similar thing.
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