Zero Distortion: Tango Time

I have been quite not turned on by tape as well. Even at Mike's I preferred his LPs to his tape. Tapes sound too artificial to me. Do they have more dynamics, tone, leading edge, soundstage? Yes. But there is something artificial about the recording, and sounds like an amateur band playing in your living room rather than a great performance in a concert hall. The reason for this becomes clear once you hear the General's LPs. The people in the chain who are making tape copies or creating new first generation tapes of unknown performers are a few degrees below the combination of the great performers are the great recording engineers that made the best LPs. Also there is something much more real about LP playback than playing through a Studer.

The best tapes I heard were at electric recording company where they played me the original tapes on their ortofon lyrec. Sure, if we get the original tapes of the General's LPs and play them back they might sound better as tape is a better media, but a later generation tape, or a first generation of a local cafe band performance, is just not going to sound at the same level as a good LP playback.

my tape is better now since i have my meters and adjustments on the King Cello.

but my vinyl is better too.:cool:

and i think one has to spend time listening to tape a bit to wrap your head around what it's doing. if i commit to a tape binge, where it's at least a few hours, even on multiple consecutive days, then not only do i hear deeper, but the big Studers wake up a bit and sound much better.

mostly the Studers lay dormant; then get fired up and i play a tape or two.
 
  • Like
Reactions: microstrip
I have been quite not turned on by tape as well. Even at Mike's I preferred his LPs to his tape. Tapes sound too artificial to me. Do they have more dynamics, tone, leading edge, soundstage? Yes. But there is something artificial about the recording, and sounds like an amateur band playing in your living room rather than a great performance in a concert hall. The reason for this becomes clear once you hear the General's LPs. The people in the chain who are making tape copies or creating new first generation tapes of unknown performers are a few degrees below the combination of the great performers are the great recording engineers that made the best LPs. Also there is something much more real about LP playback than playing through a Studer.

The best tapes I heard were at electric recording company where they played me the original tapes on their ortofon lyrec. Sure, if we get the original tapes of the General's LPs and play them back they might sound better as tape is a better media, but a later generation tape, or a first generation of a local cafe band performance, is just not going to sound at the same level as a good LP playback.

This is my experience exactly.

Tape can often have more dynamic expression, leading edge as you explain. However, I have found a run of fine grain or sameness to the sound that I am especially sensitive to. This is with a deHavilland repro. Someone locally who has a substantial tape collection.. many hundreds of tapes and dozens of machines including big Studers says the coveted tube repro that many consider top of the line does not float his boat at all and he sold it for the deHavilland.... so go figure.

I get more finesse and detail ( not artificial brightness) out of my optimized phono chain. With some albums dynamic expression is greater than tape as well. The LP format is not limited if engineered optimally.

If you're into the format and the chase for the software that is closest to the performance then I totally get it. Otherwise, if you've optimized your phono, like most here have done to the SOTA, then I think tape can be easily challenged. On the software front, tape makes absolutely no sense for expense or selection- this is a real deterrent for me.

OTOH, if you get a fully done Studer say 807, 810 + a repro and a good linestage you probably have far less invested than most of us here on than a vinyl front end . Its the software that becomes to limiting at that point.


YMMV
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lagonda and bonzo75
Tao,

You and yours are welcome here,as long as you do not mind the playlist above loud?

Kindest regards,G.
Thanks G. I love loud music and beautiful music and just wish there were just less people in my lovely country struggling at the moment. I am so very proud of my country. The people here are coming together and just fighting against a near impossible struggle. It’s hard to watch your people suffer. Best wishes for a hopefully better new year. Tao
 
Graham, there's really nothing else in the news atm. You know we're all w you.
 
  • Like
Reactions: the sound of Tao
Dear Tao,

I cannot fight anything let alone fire,what I can do is open my door to people in need.

My warped sense of humour does not overpower my ID as such;you need it you got it.

Kindest regards,G.
 
Thanks G. I love loud music and beautiful music and just wish there were just less people in my lovely country struggling at the moment. I am so very proud of my country. The people here are coming together and just fighting against a near impossible struggle. It’s hard to watch your people suffer. Best wishes for a hopefully better new year. Tao
I continue to feel your pain Tao.

I saw a photo today of a mother with her kids in a boat on a lake trying to avoid the fire on land. The skies were totally dark and the comment was that it was noon time
 
You are a gem G. What the world needs is just more expressions of good values, that actually creates the human resilience. What you do is plenty.

I consider us lucky because music does what it has always done. It bonds us in feeling.

Best for the New Year
Cheers
G.
 
I continue to feel your pain Tao.

I saw a photo today of a mother with her kids in a boat on a lake trying to avoid the fire on land. The skies were totally dark and the comment was that it was noon time
Hi Steve,

I am so proud of Australia but today after a truly horrendous day of new fires with 7 people feared dead in NSW and Victoria from just this morning and with all major roads in south eastern Australia being closed and the prospect of no telecommunications in the south east of our country we as a country and a community have shown that we stand together and support each other completely.

Surf lifesaving clubs are taking people in who have been told to evacuate from the country to seek refuge at the beaches. People have lost their homes and many are trapped without any immediate prospect of getting home till the roads are deemed safe again. The skies here today are just full of ash and grey again and the sun is a scary orange yet in south eastern Australia the skies here were actually red today. Nobody has ever seen such a horrible fire season in all our recorded history and our firefighters have been fighting wildfires for 41 days straight now.

We are the driest continent on earth and we are completely the canary in the coal mine for what living in a future extremely vulnerable hot climate may mean to any of us.

The worst aspects of all the projections are here. I can’t keep quiet as my country is on fire and so many of our people suffer. This is not what we should be living with. Shove the politics, people are burning, animals are burning, my country is burning and in truth my heart is just about breaking. How almost silly just any other activity seems at this point. This is the very start of a new decade and such a horrible omen for our people. I can only truly hope this isn’t actually our future. No matter what your philosophy or belief is we are clearly at something of a turning point. The choices we make now will be with us for all of the future.

We have to learn to live in a way that the planet can actually bear and we are starting to now live the projections. Today I saw 45.5 deg c (114 deg Fahrenheit) on the dashboard as I drove along the coast. Tonight 100km/h winds are predicted. There are dry lightening storms that have set off 100’s of more fires down south.

More support is coming in the next weeks from the United States and Canada, we are lucky to have such good allies in this. Saturday is predicted to be another spike day, it’s just hard to brace yourself for any more.

If the people who call for climate moderation are wrong we just end up with a healthier planet, if those who deny climate change are wrong we will likely all end up done in. I have trained in this area of science for over a decade but in truth this is well beyond my imagining. Today, the firestorm that was the very last day of 2019 in Australia may well be a vision of the future for all of us here. I can only pray that it is not.
 
Last edited:
Graham, in the UK, flooding is becoming the big issue. New housing developments on flood plains, crappy construction, generations of insufficient dredging of rivers.

At the chapel here, we're less than 15' from water, in potentially one of the worst spots for flooding in the whole of the UK.

Communitarian action by people on the ground is the only thing to give you hope when it's looking beyond grim.

I guess the human race can be saved.
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu