Lampizator announcement: launch of our all new TOTL HORIZON DAC

[godofwealth]

Agree with you with one addition - I believe masters of this game are my neighbors from CH Precison having their ultimate digital rig with I believe 6 boxes - DAC L, R channel, Time Reference clock, DAC controller and external power supplies. So maybe total number is even above 6 separate boxes if you go one PS per box. Seen and heard this stack few years back in Seoul with 1.0 series while now its 1.2 series. No idea about the price but i guess maybe even above MSB S2 and Wadax...but OK much more boxes involved

This brings back memories of trying to hook up my dCS stack from almost 25+ years ago (Verdi, Purcell, Elgar Plus) using FireWire or double AES with BNC cables for synchronization of clocks. Very involved. These guys were real geeks. The remote control was literally full of Greek letters. You’d better know the difference between epsilon, delta, tau and beta (long before WHO started using Greek letters for Covid-19 variants). Haven’t owned a dCS product in 20 years. Hopefully they got easier to hook up. Chord still uses double BNC from their upscaler to the DAC.

Lampi is the most analog DAC company in the world. I have no idea what chips are in my Pacific, what if any upsampling is done, what bit depth is used etc. This is as it should be. Others snow you with digital verbiage. Lukasz seems to simply say: Listen.

 

[Steve williams]

FWIW this is what I have auditioned

RECTIFIERS
KR 5u4g
Philco 5u4g
Shuguang gz480
EML 274B Mesh plate
Takatsuki 274B

POWER
KR KT 88
Genalex Gold Lion KT88
Genalex Gold Lion KT 77
TS KT 170

SIGNAL

I found this part. the most fun
6900 using Woo adapter 5687 —> 6SN7
5687 Thomson CSA using Woo adapter 5687 —>6SN7
TS JAN VT231 6SN7 GT Round plate

if I were to rate the signal tubes from 1-5
6900 4.6
5687. 4.8
VT231 6SN7 GT round plate 5.0 !!!!

i can happily play these tubes into the horizon. Either of the 3 signal tubes are spectacular. If you’ve ever seen the commercial on TV with 3 NBA and WNBA stars who all are excellent but each slightly taller than the other but only the tallest could reach high enough to get a bottle of mustard which neither of the other 2 could reach without jumping.

as to which tube gave to my ears the biggest uptick it was hands down the Takatsuki 274B for my ears. It was an epiphany

 

[Steve williams]

Lampi is the most analog DAC company in the world. I have no idea what chips are in my Pacific, what if any upsampling is done, what bit depth is used etc. This is as it should be. Others snow you with digital verbiage. Lukasz seems to simply say: Listen.

I totally agree. I loved my Pacific because it brought digital a step closer to analog. The Horixon however is not a step closer but rather a quantum leap.

Lukasz will only ever be able to make 400 of these. When they’re gone they’re gone. I’m sure he’ll make something better but this Horizon is appropriately named

 

[godofwealth]

FWIW this is what I have auditioned

RECTIFIERS
KR 5u4g
Philco 5u4g
Shuguang gz480
EML 274B Mesh plate
Takatsuki 274B

POWER
KR KT 88
Genalex Gold Lion KT88
Genalex Gold Lion KT 77
TS KT 170

SIGNAL

I found this part. the most fun
6900 using Woo adapter 5687 —> 6SN7
5687 Thomson CSA using Woo adapter 5687 —>6SN7
TS JAN VT231 6SN7 GT Round plate

if I were to rate the signal tubes from 1-5
6900 4.6
5687. 4.8
VT231 6SN7 GT round plate 5.0 !!!!

i can happily play these tubes into the horizon. Either of the 3 signal tubes are spectacular. If you’ve ever seen the commercial on TV with 3 NBA and WNBA stars who all are excellent but each slightly taller than the other but only the tallest could reach high enough to get a bottle of mustard which neither of the other 2 could reach without jumping.

as to which tube gave to my ears the biggest uptick it was hands down the Takatsuki 274B for my ears it was an epiphany

That’s my concern with moving from the Pacific to the Horizon. I will lose the magic of the 300B tube (or the 242 or PX 25) and have to settle for the (far less linear and more sterile sounding) KT88, KT120, etc. I have owned many pentode amplifiers (ARC, CJ, Quicksilver). I have many thousands of hours of listening to EL34s, KT 88, KT 120, KT150 etc. over a 30 year period. None of them have ever sounded as good as my 300B JJ, even if they are 10x as powerful. Inextricably tied to the sound of the Pacific is its use of direct heated triodes. With the Horizon, you’re stuck in pentode land. Not sure yet if I want to regress from triode land to pentode land. It’s a shame really. I’d like a Horizon with DHTs, not pentodes.

 

[Steve williams]

I feel your pain but let’s all remember that these are my favorites based on my system, my room and ultimately my ears. That for me is the beauty of the Horizon if you like tube rolling as they too will take you well into the horizon


I know what you mean re DHT as my entire system is tubes and my amp is DHT using GM-70

 

[Golum]

That’s my concern with moving from the Pacific to the Horizon. I will lose the magic of the 300B tube (or the 242 or PX 25) and have to settle for the (far less linear and more sterile sounding) KT88, KT120, etc. I have owned many pentode amplifiers (ARC, CJ, Quicksilver). I have many thousands of hours of listening to EL34s, KT 88, KT 120, KT150 etc. over a 30 year period. None of them have ever sounded as good as my 300B JJ, even if they are 10x as powerful. Inextricably tied to the sound of the Pacific is its use of direct heated triodes. With the Horizon, you’re stuck in pentode land. Not sure yet if I want to regress from triode land to pentode land. It’s a shame really. I’d like a Horizon with DHTs, not pentodes.

Sorry to jump in, but you got this wrong. Pentodes in Horizon are NOT output tubes but rather have some other tasks to do in the circuitry and the output/signal tubes are double triodes 6sn7 and alike. I was of the same thinking like you are especially using DHT pre and DHT power amp, but Horizon with the tube compliment he has it just is better then Pacific/GG2 with all their DHT virtues and magic they create.

"The 7 tubes work in a new way, never seen before in any DAC. The pentodes provide power supply regulation, active anode loading and cathode buffering - all at the same time - thanks to their 3 grids. The dual triodes provide voltage amplification and current conversion in the DAC process - so their influence is huge"

 

[dminches]

That’s my concern with moving from the Pacific to the Horizon. I will lose the magic of the 300B tube (or the 242 or PX 25) and have to settle for the (far less linear and more sterile sounding) KT88, KT120, etc. I have owned many pentode amplifiers (ARC, CJ, Quicksilver). I have many thousands of hours of listening to EL34s, KT 88, KT 120, KT150 etc. over a 30 year period. None of them have ever sounded as good as my 300B JJ, even if they are 10x as powerful. Inextricably tied to the sound of the Pacific is its use of direct heated triodes. With the Horizon, you’re stuck in pentode land. Not sure yet if I want to regress from triode land to pentode land. It’s a shame really. I’d like a Horizon with DHTs, not pentodes.

The power tubes are not driving the sound in the Horizon. The 2 triodes are. That in itself allows for significant improvement.

 

[Lukasz "Lampizator" Fikus]

That’s my concern with moving from the Pacific to the Horizon. I will lose the magic of the 300B tube (or the 242 or PX 25) and have to settle for the (far less linear and more sterile sounding) KT88, KT120, etc. I have owned many pentode amplifiers (ARC, CJ, Quicksilver). I have many thousands of hours of listening to EL34s, KT 88, KT 120, KT150 etc. over a 30 year period. None of them have ever sounded as good as my 300B JJ, even if they are 10x as powerful. Inextricably tied to the sound of the Pacific is its use of direct heated triodes. With the Horizon, you’re stuck in pentode land. Not sure yet if I want to regress from triode land to pentode land. It’s a shame really. I’d like a Horizon with DHTs, not pentodes.

I had exactly the same worries but the first 30s of listening cured all that. But of course we keep gg and Pacific in the portfolio for that reason - to satisfy the people who love dht. Me may even improve them in the coming months with the digital advances from the Horizon

 

[John T]

I PM Steve but my curiosity overcame me: I just pulled 4 TS KT 170's out of the BOX, they are supposed to be 4 matching. Numbers read IP46 GM6300/IP47 GM6300/IP45 GM6300/IP45 GM6200. Is their an acceptable margin of error, or should they be exact?????

 

[godofwealth]

Sorry to jump in, but you got this wrong. Pentodes in Horizon are NOT output tubes but rather have some other tasks to do in the circuitry and the output/signal tubes are double triodes 6sn7 and alike. I was of the same thinking like you are especially using DHT pre and DHT power amp, but Horizon with the tube compliment he has it just is better then Pacific/GG2 with all their DHT virtues and magic they create.

"The 7 tubes work in a new way, never seen before in any DAC. The pentodes provide power supply regulation, active anode loading and cathode buffering - all at the same time - thanks to their 3 grids. The dual triodes provide voltage amplification and current conversion in the DAC process - so their influence is huge"

Ah, wonderful to get an education on the design magic behind Horizon. Ok, I’m somewhat relieved that the pentodes are not driving the audio quality. I need to understand Lukasz’s design better, but why am I not surprised. He’s always doing something clever with his DACs.

Just got another idea for Lukasz. He should release a solid state version of Horizon and call it Heresy. It’s like when Paul Klipsch produced his first compact moving coil loudspeaker as a center channel for auditoriums to support the corner Klipschorns. One of his employees thought it was heresy for Paul to design a moving coil loudspeaker after the KHorn. Paul liked the name so much he kept it, and 60+ years later, Klipsch still makes the Heresy.

So, how about it, Lukasz? Design a solid state Horizon and call it Heresy, because hey, Lampi is all about using tubes in DACs whereas everyone else uses transistors. Show them you can beat them at their game!

 

[Willgolf]

Is the rectifier in the Horizon a 4 pin tube?

 

[Alrainbow]

 

[Golum]

Goran admit you copied and pasted. No idea what means lol. I’ll try to find what yoda says at the start. All
i can say is it’s not anything like digital produced by any dac I have heard
it’s truly a one of kind sound has all the detail and variations from track to track like vinyl
ir tape. But it also is a vinyl or tape sound.

Alfonso if you would use your reading glasses once in a while you would see that I’ve put quote signs on the part which I copy/pasted from the Yoda post regarding what specific tubes are doing in the H.

 

[wisnon]

That’s my concern with moving from the Pacific to the Horizon. I will lose the magic of the 300B tube (or the 242 or PX 25) and have to settle for the (far less linear and more sterile sounding) KT88, KT120, etc. I have owned many pentode amplifiers (ARC, CJ, Quicksilver). I have many thousands of hours of listening to EL34s, KT 88, KT 120, KT150 etc. over a 30 year period. None of them have ever sounded as good as my 300B JJ, even if they are 10x as powerful. Inextricably tied to the sound of the Pacific is its use of direct heated triodes. With the Horizon, you’re stuck in pentode land. Not sure yet if I want to regress from triode land to pentode land. It’s a shame really. I’d like a Horizon with DHTs, not pentodes.

2 legs of the pentodes are merged with 2 pins of the output tubes to create a virtual new tube This is why synergy matters and previous experience and opinions become moot.

 

[wisnon]

Goran admit you copied and pasted. No idea what means lol. I’ll try to find what yoda says at the start. All
i can say is it’s not anything like digital produced by any dac I have heard
it’s truly a one of kind sound has all the detail and variations from track to track like vinyl
ir tape. But it also is a vinyl or tape sound.

Goran didn't have to copy/paste. On his last ski trip here when we met up with him Lukasz explained more of the design concept in person. 2 years before that, he described the development to us in detail when we met for a chat.

 

[Alrainbow]

Ok got no glasses. but I still have one comment I made and no replies
lampi two box design anyone

 

[christoph]

The power tubes are not driving the sound in the Horizon. The 2 triodes are. That in itself allows for significant improvement.

But even then, Steve prefered the KR KT88 over the Genalex KT77 and Genalex KT88 and later the TS KT170 over the KR KT88

And also the recties make quite a difference.

Obviously everything matters more or less

 

[dminches]

But even then, Steve prefered the KR KT88 over the Genalex KT77 and Genalex KT88 and later the TS KT170 over the KR KT88

And also the recties make quite a difference.

Obviously everything matters more or less

The power tubes matter but my experience has shown that the triodes matter much more.

 

[christoph]

That’s my concern with moving from the Pacific to the Horizon. I will lose the magic of the 300B tube (or the 242 or PX 25) and have to settle for the (far less linear and more sterile sounding) KT88, KT120, etc. I have owned many pentode amplifiers (ARC, CJ, Quicksilver). I have many thousands of hours of listening to EL34s, KT 88, KT 120, KT150 etc. over a 30 year period. None of them have ever sounded as good as my 300B JJ, even if they are 10x as powerful. Inextricably tied to the sound of the Pacific is its use of direct heated triodes. With the Horizon, you’re stuck in pentode land. Not sure yet if I want to regress from triode land to pentode land. It’s a shame really. I’d like a Horizon with DHTs, not pentodes.

You can always keep the Pacific for a second system

 

[christoph]

The power tubes matter but my experience has shown that the triodes matter much more.

That is exactly what Lukasz says