Reality is Cruel : Cybershaft new Ultimate OCXO 10M Clocks Shootout OP20 vs OP17
- Thread starter CKKeung
- Start date
Yes i am using op13 75 ohm as output towards my eso g02.
Then from my g02 output to vivaldi one clock input
Then from my g02 output to vivaldi one clock input
Which model of Cybershaft OP13? One of the newer ones that has switches to choose 50-ohm or 75-ohm output?
Why do you have so many different devices? You mention AfterDark, Cybershaft, Esoteric G-02, DCS Vivaldi clock,.... I'm having difficulty
figuring out what you are trying to accomplish as you also mention DCS Vivaldi One, CH C1.1 and D1.1 Thanks...
Why do you have so many different devices? You mention AfterDark, Cybershaft, Esoteric G-02, DCS Vivaldi clock,.... I'm having difficulty
figuring out what you are trying to accomplish as you also mention DCS Vivaldi One, CH C1.1 and D1.1 Thanks...
Yes
I have cybershaft OP13 ultimate version sightly bigger in size. Yes there is a switch at the back for 50 or 75ohm output.
Yes i have both CH and DCS vivaldi one. Becos of my clock not arriving yet i am using eso g02 and OP13 for the time being.
CH cannot beat dcs or dcs cannot beat CH
I also have Lampizator golden Gate but this is by far the least attractive in my system
I have cybershaft OP13 ultimate version sightly bigger in size. Yes there is a switch at the back for 50 or 75ohm output.
Yes i have both CH and DCS vivaldi one. Becos of my clock not arriving yet i am using eso g02 and OP13 for the time being.
CH cannot beat dcs or dcs cannot beat CH
I also have Lampizator golden Gate but this is by far the least attractive in my system
Sounds like a very fun setup with many great combinations to enjoy both now and when you get your newest clock!
Yes i am exciting to get my new clock delivery
That's why i wish to ask for advices from this forum how do i plug from after dsrk or cybershaft to dcs and to ch respectively.
For now i was told Cybershaft must feed towards a clock and then clock to dcs that means i need a clock between cyber shaft and dcs
This is one of the reasons i choose after dark project clayx eva as it does not need another clock in between
In the general case, the Cybershaft does NOT need another clock after it in the chain if and only if the device(s) connected to it accept either
a 50-ohm or 75-ohm master clock input of 10 Mhz. For example, I have a multi-output Cybershaft connected directly to
an Esoteric P-02 transport and D-02 DAC on their master clock inputs as they can accept a direct 10 Mhz input clock
signal (at 50-ohm). I don't "need" another Esoteric or other clock in the middle.
For DCS however, their transports and DACs or their Vivaldi One only support 75-ohm "word clocking" at multiples of 44.1 or 48 so yes,
you would need a clock that could drive that and then also has a reference (master) clock input.
a 50-ohm or 75-ohm master clock input of 10 Mhz. For example, I have a multi-output Cybershaft connected directly to
an Esoteric P-02 transport and D-02 DAC on their master clock inputs as they can accept a direct 10 Mhz input clock
signal (at 50-ohm). I don't "need" another Esoteric or other clock in the middle.
For DCS however, their transports and DACs or their Vivaldi One only support 75-ohm "word clocking" at multiples of 44.1 or 48 so yes,
you would need a clock that could drive that and then also has a reference (master) clock input.
Yes that is what i am thinking now.
Esoteric gears do not need to have a separate clock and OP21a as master clock can feed directly both to the transport and the dac
Whereas DCS still need a clock in between and that is exactly my case
Op13 - - - -> eso clock - - - - > dcs vivaldi one
Thank you anyway for advices
Esoteric gears do not need to have a separate clock and OP21a as master clock can feed directly both to the transport and the dac
Whereas DCS still need a clock in between and that is exactly my case
Op13 - - - -> eso clock - - - - > dcs vivaldi one
Thank you anyway for advices
Hi Matty,It will continue to improve yet.
The thing that impressed me is how it has the body and warmth of copper combined with the improved detail, transparency and detail of good silver. I was so impressed with mine that I got a SPDIF cable built up using it. Not as great a difference s the clock cable funnily enough.
I don’t have any more of that wire left unfortunately so you’d either need to see if Geoff can source more or order some on his behalf. I think you can agree that the results speak for themselves with these cables….. Or indeed any current Aurealis Audio cable.
I highly recommend his Duelund 50 RCA’s (the mixed silver copper is excellent too though I prefer the Duelund 50), his Litz mixed silver & copper speaker cables and also his not yet released Spiral 8 speaker cables. I was lucky enough to get the original Duelund 50 RCA cable and the second one made, also the second Spiral 8 speaker cable.
Just got in my second order of 2 x 1 metre of the same clock cables and they are wowing me just as much as the first set. In total I have 5 external clocking options...so still one remaining. Plan to order it soon. By the way in case you have an ether regen, my experience is that with these cables improvement was so much that it swamped the slightly negative effect of breaking the moat...
Re other cables I only have ethernet cables and 1 AES EBU in my system, no RCA or speaker cables (speakers are active). Will talk to Geoff to ask for his suggestions about them soon. All my AC cables are v expensive Synergistic research, so I am loath to replace them at the moment.
Best wishes and thanks
Aubrey
I agree with your assessment of Afterdark clocks. I bought an Emperor Crown SE to use with an EtherRegen and the benefits are considerable for the price point.
Nikko
Hi Matt, curious how you are able to be certain the Fared Super3 will be an improvement from the Afterdark LPS, has anyone done a head to head comparison?Hey Nick, I'm running a similar setup with a Mutec MC-3+USB, 75ohm Afterdark Emperor Double Crown OCXO clock and Abbas Esoteric Audio DAC2.2SE (Multibit). The Emperor Double Crown is similar in spec to the Cybershaft OP20 when powered with the Afterdark LPS, though I'll soon be changing that for a 12V Fared Super3 after reading through this thread. It should be a nice improvement.
I always thought the Mutec was an incredible bit of gear but came across a few threads were it was claimed that removing the switching power supply in favor of an external LPS improves performance though online reports showed mixed results. Anyway I have had the SMPS removed from mine and a 2.5mm DC socket installed and used a 6vdc Fared Super3 with it. I was utterly blown away by the improvement it made with it making a similar improvement to the Afterdark clock itself.
So yes, the SMPS does hurt performance of the Mutec though you're unaware of the shortcoming until it's replaced with a quality LPS.
I hope that's of some use to you assuming too much to hasn't passed since your post.
Cheers
Matt
Yea, Adrian of AfterDark I believe. He’s stated that the Farad Super3 is noticeably better than the Afterdark LPS performance. That the clock would perform better with it was an assumption based on what I’d read here with people trying the CyberShaft OP20 with a better LPS.
Hi,
As a newbie in this forum I hope, experienced users can give me some advice.
After working through the pages of the Shootout OP20 vs OP17 my interest was raised concerning Cybershaft OP20A-1 or OP21A-1. Unlike others I cannot link an external clock with my DAC. As I am using an Ether Regen, which is linked to my DAC, I intend to connect a Cybershaft clock with it. Having discussed this idea with 2 HiFi dealers both told me this would be taking a sledgehammer to crack a nut.
I would be pleased to read your opinions about this.
Kind regards,
Uwe
As a newbie in this forum I hope, experienced users can give me some advice.
After working through the pages of the Shootout OP20 vs OP17 my interest was raised concerning Cybershaft OP20A-1 or OP21A-1. Unlike others I cannot link an external clock with my DAC. As I am using an Ether Regen, which is linked to my DAC, I intend to connect a Cybershaft clock with it. Having discussed this idea with 2 HiFi dealers both told me this would be taking a sledgehammer to crack a nut.
I would be pleased to read your opinions about this.
Kind regards,
Uwe
My DAC doesn’t have a clock input either….. On the other hand I find pairing a qualify clock with a nice DDC Anne feeding the DAC a better signal brings very real benefits. Using a Gustard U18 + AfterDark Emperor Double Crown OCXO clock to feed my Musician Aquarius via its I2S input. Previously I did the same with a Mutec MC3+USB over coax into my previous Abbas DAC 2.2SE.
@alsterfan I've been following this thread for a while. Thanks ti CKKeung and the other posters on this and other threads for some fascinating reviews, comment and advice!
I am unable to input 10MHz to my DAC but have been slowly upgrading the clocks within my DAC over several years with great success. I then started to experiment with off-boarding the clock duties from my etherregen to one of the 75? clocks from Aliexpress. I then bought a second etherregen to run in series with first and off-boarded the clock duties for that one too. Last week I took delivery of an afterdark clock (queen level specifically designed for ER) and use this in the ER nearest my DAC. Each of the above steps has made small but appreciable improvements to the soundstage, clarity, etc as has been reported elsewhere. To be fair, the internal clocks (11/12, 22/24 or 45/49MHz) make more of a difference but I feel that it all helps. Happy to contribute further to a new thread.
A reference clock can most certainly lift the performance of an EtherRegen. If you go to the Uptone forum on Audiophile Style, there is a long thread on master clocks.
I use a REF10 that will soon be upgraded to REF10 SE120. I cannot tell you at this point how much more the ER will scale with a better clock. My DAC also has a clock input so this upgrade should be a good move regardless.
I will say that I found the improvement to the ER from the REF10 surprising. It even improves the sound quality when I am playing music stored on my streamer’s hard drive, so the best I can figure is that the EtherRegen‘s moat is made even more effective by the reference clock.
Thank you so much for your answers, which encourage me to go the Cybershaft way in the near future.
Before that I have to solve one problem. In Europe all electrical devices must have a CE label (Conformité Européenne). This is controlled by German customs, when a device is importet. Mr. Hasegawa months ago told me he does not intend to acquire this label and therefore won´t export to Germany.
Has anybody any idea how to buy an OP 21A-1 (230V) nevertheless? Does anybody know a Cybershaft-dealer in Europe?
Kind regards,
Uwe
Before that I have to solve one problem. In Europe all electrical devices must have a CE label (Conformité Européenne). This is controlled by German customs, when a device is importet. Mr. Hasegawa months ago told me he does not intend to acquire this label and therefore won´t export to Germany.
Has anybody any idea how to buy an OP 21A-1 (230V) nevertheless? Does anybody know a Cybershaft-dealer in Europe?
Kind regards,
Uwe
I don't believe there are many Cybershaft dealers per se as Cybershaft keeps prices to a reasonable minimum cost-plus number by selling direct to ensure they remain in business without the uplifts that dealers and distributors would cause to be tacked onto the retail pricing.
Even if there were a dealer in Europe, when it crossed the border into Germany I would think that it might be examined by Customs and potentially flagged without that label. Is it possible to find a cooperative person in an adjoining country to procure it and then take a trip to meet you
? Note that this is not official advice,...anyone who is more familiar with the border realities will give better advice.Hi, thanks for this interesting comparison. Do you still remember whether the two Cybershaft units had their 10 MHz output level set to "high" or "low"? Because I found that this setting changes the sound quite a bit, the "high" setting sounding even more "airy" and "detailed", three-dimensional, while the "low" setting sounding a little more "grounded". Just in case you had the OP21 and OP20 accidentally set to different settings without noticing or paying attention, this could potentially explain the sonic differences you described. Any idea?
Remark: My observation is based on a test I did with the Cybershaft OP21E clocking an Antelope Audio OCX-HD word clock. While the Antelope device seems to be able to handle the Cybershaft's "high" output level setting, I read that most other word clocks with a 10 MHz input would only be able to sync to the standard "low" 10 MHz level. My personal sonic preference, however, is that unique "high" level setting. Compared to the standard "low" setting (which most other 10 MHz atomic clocks produce without the option to change it), I would describe the "high" gain 10 MHz sound as more airy, precise, detailed, focused, three-dimensional, almost like being "detached" from the speakers.
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