Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

@Christiaan Punter Christiaan, thanks for the details and insight on the USB and Ethernet cables as well as your comparative findings. Very helpful.

Question: what were your findings on Ethernet + USB when evaluated as pairs for streaming? Do you have a combo preference / recommendation? Thanks.
 
@Christiaan Punter Christiaan, thanks for the details and insight on the USB and Ethernet cables as well as your comparative findings. Very helpful.

Question: what were your findings on Ethernet + USB when evaluated as pairs for streaming? Do you have a combo preference / recommendation? Thanks.
Hi Cyrus, for the complete story, please refer to the review on HFA but in short, both the Jorma USB cable and Ethernet cable share the same Jorma house sound which is smooth, liquid, fluid, natural, and unforced. The USB cable is well-balanced between relaxed and unforced on the one hand and incisive and spritely on the other hand, while the Ethernet cable leans more to the relaxed and inoffensive side. Used together, you maximize the aforementioned qualities at the expense of some expression which in my system makes the sound a little bit too polite. For my taste and system, the FTA cables (both USB and Ethernet) provide the most expressive and most impactful sound, albeit at the cost of some dryness, which I do not mind. YMMV. My personal opinion aside, I'm tempted to say that the most neutral and natural balance with the Extreme is obtained by using the FTA Metis Ethernet with the Jorma USB cable. That said, the Jorma Ethernet cable sells well and is apparently well-received so it's best to take my viewpoints only as a relative starting point.
 
@Christiaan Punter Thanks!!! Didn't realize the Jorma review was up. I'll read it later today.

My personal opinion aside, I'm tempted to say that the most neutral and natural balance with the Extreme is obtained by using the FTA Metis Ethernet with the Jorma USB cable.
 
Hi all, since having the Extreme in my system, I have done a handful of reviews with it and several other experiments and comparisons. Every now and then, I will post some of my experiences here on WBF, if I think they can be helpful for Extreme owners.

After having reviewed the Final Touch Audio Sinope USB cable and Metis Ethernet cable, I liked both so much that I decided to keep them as personal references.

Just recently, I reviewed the Jorma USB Reference cable and the Jorma Ethernet cable and I'd like to share a summary of that experience. As always, I personally don't believe in any single "ideal" cable since it is always a matter of system synergy and user preference. But with the below, I hope to provide a nice bit of perspective.

Jorma USB Reference

Where the Taiko Extreme server is concerned, one can choose between TAS (Taiko Audio System) and Roon for music playback and there are sonic differences between the two solutions. This is why I used both TAS and Roon during my assessments. Fortunately, irrespective of the playback method, I heard precisely the same differences between the cables. For my USB cable assessments, I used both local and streaming Qobuz content.

My first impression is that the Jorma provides less incisiveness in the bass, which makes fast bass drum ghost notes appear less distinct. It has a more relaxed sound, less chunky and impactful, and less direct. While that may come across as a detracting factor, longer listening reveals that no detail is glossed over and after having listened to the Jorma for a while and then switching back to the FTA Sinope, the latter sounds comparatively "square" and staccato and a little matter-of-fact.

In return, the Jorma is airier and considerably more fluid, and like the FTA Sinope, the Jorma is incredibly neutral, yet also very natural, arguably more so than the admittedly quite strict Sinope. In addition, and this is something that you really start appreciating after listening for longer, while the Jorma is not strictly presenting the maximum in terms of chiseled-rock-kind of incisiveness, there is a decidedly "human" and organic quality to its presentation. I'd be tempted to use the term "analog" if that wouldn't conjure associations with overt lushness or rich creaminess.

The Jorma USB cable sounds significantly faster and tighter, as well as more incisive and more impactful than the Final Touch Audio Callisto or the Pink Faun Digital Interlink USB. The former has long been an HFA Favorite for its uniquely organic, ultra-refined, and utterly free-flowing presentation, even if it was not the last word in terms of bass solidity and slam. The latter is remarkable for sounding smoother, lusher, and richer than the Callisto whilst having a similarly organic and free-flowing presentation. But just as with the Callisto, you pay the price in the bass department.

With the Jorma USB Reference, there is never the impression of trading one quality for another and that is really the best compliment that I can give a cable.

Jorma Ethernet

For the Ethernet cable tests, I made sure to start with a Qobuz streaming source so that we actually have music flowing through the cable... although, with the Extreme, do we really listen to the stream directly? Certainly, with TAS, the server first buffers the stream and then plays from memory. This is another reason why I made sure to not only use TAS but also Roon.

Retaining the Jorma USB Reference cable and adding the Jorma Ethernet cable to the Taiko server in place of the OEM CAT6 cable makes for an absolutely dramatic increase in soundstage width and depth as well as a further increase in fluidity and flow. In addition, the singers and instruments gain deeper tonal saturation, leading to a meatier sound and more body within the soundstage, which further helps develop deeper 3D imaging.

Like the Jorma USB cable, but slightly more so, the Ethernet cable provides a presentation that is focused on the natural musical flow, rather than going out of its way to provide the utmost in terms of solidity and chiseled-rock-like bass. This is in line with what one expects from a Jorma cable: natural musicality with high resolution and a high level of refinement. While the Jorma USB cable by itself is perfectly centered between relaxed and free-flowing on the one hand and fast and incisive on the other, the Jorma Ethernet cable does lean more toward the relaxed side.

So far, I have been playing only from Qobuz. I know I'm going to be called out for this, but indeed, I hear the same differences between the cables when playing music that is stored locally on the server. Moreover, I hear this with TAS as well as with Roon. This supports the growing suspicion that it's not so much the data stream itself but rather superimposed factors that are messing with what we hear as the end result.

Swapping from the Jorma Ethernet cable to the FTA Metis Ethernet cable, the sound becomes more solid and impactful, as well as less organic, stricter, and more direct, in fact quite similar to the FTA Sinope USB cable. It's interesting how these two brands offer very different perspectives that are upheld through the different connections.

I contemplated also including a test with the Jorma Ethernet cable connected directly between the server and the DAC but I know from earlier experience that the Extreme sounds better via USB, so that would not have yielded helpful insights.

Swapping to the Pink Faun Digital Link LAN introduces yet another perspective, even richer, more liquid, and more free-flowing than the Jorma. In another setup than mine, one that verges on clinical or over-controlled, this can likely be an absolute blessing but in the context of my system, this cable pulls the sound too much toward mellow and relaxed. Like the Pink Faun USB cable, the LAN cable is lush at the expense of propulsion, momentum, and rhythmic expression.

If also taking the OEM Cat6 cable into account then that cable would be positioned all the way over on the other end of the spectrum with lots of control but a bleak tonality and a flat and kind of forward soundstage. So here's the million-dollar question. Is the OEM Cat6 cable leaving out harmonics and fullness or allowing lots of malicious noise to come through, or is it simply relaying the truth, warts and all? In other words, are the high-end Ethernet cables beautifying the signal or do they provide a more truthful rendition? Honestly, I have no way of knowing and I'm afraid it comes down primarily to personal taste and system synergy. What cannot be denied, however, is that Ethernet cables really do matter, a lot, actually.

So, where does this leave the Jorma Ethernet cable on the sonic landscape? Well, if the Pink Faun is relaxed and mellow and the Final Touch Audio is strict and upfront, the Jorma falls in between but is positioned more toward the Pink Faun than the Final Touch Audio. In terms of tonality, I'd consider all three to be neutral, in spite of their large other differences. So far, it seems that an Ethernet cable is not capable of truly changing the tonality of a system. It can, however, strongly affect the balance between control and flow, and with it, the emotional involvement.
Great reviews!
Out of curiosity, have you reviewed the Shunyata Omega USB? It’s what I use and what was recommended by Taiko; but I did not compare it to anything else…
 
Thanks Christiaan for the Jorma cable reviews.

A good Extreme owner friend of mine in Hong Kong employs the Jorma Statement powercord for his Extreme.
He is a tube lover and put higher priority on musicality.
I auditioned his system, it's very good.
:D
 
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My Taiko is playing music! Most files play with no issue, but several of the Pure DSD albums I bought recently either don’t play (quiet noise barely audible) or I can barely hear music. These are 256 and 128 DSDs. Some 256 and 128 DSD files play fine. What should I do to fix this? Red book and other PCM files all seem to play fine.
 
How you did it ? .
I had to cover ground and vbus in my USB cable to get simmilar efferct a week ago.
Removal of a jumper of the USB card.

Cheers
 
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Hi all, since having the Extreme in my system, I have done a handful of reviews with it and several other experiments and comparisons. Every now and then, I will post some of my experiences here on WBF, if I think they can be helpful for Extreme owners.

After having reviewed the Final Touch Audio Sinope USB cable and Metis Ethernet cable, I liked both so much that I decided to keep them as personal references.

Just recently, I reviewed the Jorma USB Reference cable and the Jorma Ethernet cable and I'd like to share a summary of that experience. As always, I personally don't believe in any single "ideal" cable since it is always a matter of system synergy and user preference. But with the below, I hope to provide a nice bit of perspective.

Jorma USB Reference

Where the Taiko Extreme server is concerned, one can choose between TAS (Taiko Audio System) and Roon for music playback and there are sonic differences between the two solutions. This is why I used both TAS and Roon during my assessments. Fortunately, irrespective of the playback method, I heard precisely the same differences between the cables. For my USB cable assessments, I used both local and streaming Qobuz content.

My first impression is that the Jorma provides less incisiveness in the bass, which makes fast bass drum ghost notes appear less distinct. It has a more relaxed sound, less chunky and impactful, and less direct. While that may come across as a detracting factor, longer listening reveals that no detail is glossed over and after having listened to the Jorma for a while and then switching back to the FTA Sinope, the latter sounds comparatively "square" and staccato and a little matter-of-fact.

In return, the Jorma is airier and considerably more fluid, and like the FTA Sinope, the Jorma is incredibly neutral, yet also very natural, arguably more so than the admittedly quite strict Sinope. In addition, and this is something that you really start appreciating after listening for longer, while the Jorma is not strictly presenting the maximum in terms of chiseled-rock-kind of incisiveness, there is a decidedly "human" and organic quality to its presentation. I'd be tempted to use the term "analog" if that wouldn't conjure associations with overt lushness or rich creaminess.

The Jorma USB cable sounds significantly faster and tighter, as well as more incisive and more impactful than the Final Touch Audio Callisto or the Pink Faun Digital Interlink USB. The former has long been an HFA Favorite for its uniquely organic, ultra-refined, and utterly free-flowing presentation, even if it was not the last word in terms of bass solidity and slam. The latter is remarkable for sounding smoother, lusher, and richer than the Callisto whilst having a similarly organic and free-flowing presentation. But just as with the Callisto, you pay the price in the bass department.

With the Jorma USB Reference, there is never the impression of trading one quality for another and that is really the best compliment that I can give a cable.

Jorma Ethernet

For the Ethernet cable tests, I made sure to start with a Qobuz streaming source so that we actually have music flowing through the cable... although, with the Extreme, do we really listen to the stream directly? Certainly, with TAS, the server first buffers the stream and then plays from memory. This is another reason why I made sure to not only use TAS but also Roon.

Retaining the Jorma USB Reference cable and adding the Jorma Ethernet cable to the Taiko server in place of the OEM CAT6 cable makes for an absolutely dramatic increase in soundstage width and depth as well as a further increase in fluidity and flow. In addition, the singers and instruments gain deeper tonal saturation, leading to a meatier sound and more body within the soundstage, which further helps develop deeper 3D imaging.

Like the Jorma USB cable, but slightly more so, the Ethernet cable provides a presentation that is focused on the natural musical flow, rather than going out of its way to provide the utmost in terms of solidity and chiseled-rock-like bass. This is in line with what one expects from a Jorma cable: natural musicality with high resolution and a high level of refinement. While the Jorma USB cable by itself is perfectly centered between relaxed and free-flowing on the one hand and fast and incisive on the other, the Jorma Ethernet cable does lean more toward the relaxed side.

So far, I have been playing only from Qobuz. I know I'm going to be called out for this, but indeed, I hear the same differences between the cables when playing music that is stored locally on the server. Moreover, I hear this with TAS as well as with Roon. This supports the growing suspicion that it's not so much the data stream itself but rather superimposed factors that are messing with what we hear as the end result.

Swapping from the Jorma Ethernet cable to the FTA Metis Ethernet cable, the sound becomes more solid and impactful, as well as less organic, stricter, and more direct, in fact quite similar to the FTA Sinope USB cable. It's interesting how these two brands offer very different perspectives that are upheld through the different connections.

I contemplated also including a test with the Jorma Ethernet cable connected directly between the server and the DAC but I know from earlier experience that the Extreme sounds better via USB, so that would not have yielded helpful insights.

Swapping to the Pink Faun Digital Link LAN introduces yet another perspective, even richer, more liquid, and more free-flowing than the Jorma. In another setup than mine, one that verges on clinical or over-controlled, this can likely be an absolute blessing but in the context of my system, this cable pulls the sound too much toward mellow and relaxed. Like the Pink Faun USB cable, the LAN cable is lush at the expense of propulsion, momentum, and rhythmic expression.

If also taking the OEM Cat6 cable into account then that cable would be positioned all the way over on the other end of the spectrum with lots of control but a bleak tonality and a flat and kind of forward soundstage. So here's the million-dollar question. Is the OEM Cat6 cable leaving out harmonics and fullness or allowing lots of malicious noise to come through, or is it simply relaying the truth, warts and all? In other words, are the high-end Ethernet cables beautifying the signal or do they provide a more truthful rendition? Honestly, I have no way of knowing and I'm afraid it comes down primarily to personal taste and system synergy. What cannot be denied, however, is that Ethernet cables really do matter, a lot, actually.

So, where does this leave the Jorma Ethernet cable on the sonic landscape? Well, if the Pink Faun is relaxed and mellow and the Final Touch Audio is strict and upfront, the Jorma falls in between but is positioned more toward the Pink Faun than the Final Touch Audio. In terms of tonality, I'd consider all three to be neutral, in spite of their large other differences. So far, it seems that an Ethernet cable is not capable of truly changing the tonality of a system. It can, however, strongly affect the balance between control and flow, and with it, the emotional involvement.
Hi Christian,

I’m interested in your and Emile’s expectation of how these differences in cables will or will not manifest with XDMS? My experience is that at least with highly optimized (highly accurate and resolving) systems, SQ is influenced by the data stream itself (the pattern of 1s and 0s) and by the ‘fabric’ from which the stream is built. This statement infers that the same bit-perfect data stream can sound very, very different according to how it was built/made.
This is a network cable review….i.e the cables used to connect different elements of the network. My experience is that SQ is indeed very much a product of the cables, but equally of the network modules and especially of the power supplies used to power those modules.
I understand that one of Taiko’s aims is to build a SW + OS that makes SQ independent of the network supply stream. If that is indeed the case, then the differences noted in your review should be mute once XDMS is employed. Would you concur?
 
Great reviews!
Out of curiosity, have you reviewed the Shunyata Omega USB? It’s what I use and what was recommended by Taiko; but I did not compare it to anything else…
Alas, I have not heard the Shunyata and I never come across people who use the brand. It seems to be flying somewhat under the radar in the Netherlands. But I certainly plan to use as many cables with the Extreme as I can, and report on this.
 
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Thanks Christiaan for the Jorma cable reviews.

A good Extreme owner friend of mine in Hong Kong employs the Jorma Statement powercord for his Extreme.
He is a tube lover and put higher priority on musicality.
I auditioned his system, it's very good.
:D
I know someone who uses a handful of statement power cables and based on what he told me, I'm really scared to try them in my system... I may never want to let them go!
 
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Hi Christian,

I’m interested in your and Emile’s expectation of how these differences in cables will or will not manifest with XDMS? My experience is that at least with highly optimized (highly accurate and resolving) systems, SQ is influenced by the data stream itself (the pattern of 1s and 0s) and by the ‘fabric’ from which the stream is built. This statement infers that the same bit-perfect data stream can sound very, very different according to how it was built/made.
This is a network cable review….i.e the cables used to connect different elements of the network. My experience is that SQ is indeed very much a product of the cables, but equally of the network modules and especially of the power supplies used to power those modules.
I understand that one of Taiko’s aims is to build a SW + OS that makes SQ independent of the network supply stream. If that is indeed the case, then the differences noted in your review should be mute once XDMS is employed. Would you concur?
In an ideal world, perfect software would result in perfect sound. But the reality is that the integrity of an audio signal is attacked on many levels. Taiko's continued aim is to reduce the impact of noise and other external influences on as many levels as possible by means of both hardware and software. XDMS is a massive improvement in that it threads a perfect path between the benefits of TAS and Roon without introducing any downsides. It does not, however, negate the influences of USB cables or ethernet cables. I wouldn't be surprised, though, if the upcoming Taiko Router and Switch will indeed negate most of the influences invoked by network cables.
 
We have used crates for a very short time, if customs can't open the packages they drill holes into it to insert drug checking probes! They damaged 6 or 7 extremes that way.

With all the nasty stuff flooding over the US southern border, I'm surprised they're even bothering with small European shipments (assuming US Customs was involved). I'm in Texas, and the border insanity is very real here.
 
My Taiko is playing music! Most files play with no issue, but several of the Pure DSD albums I bought recently either don’t play (quiet noise barely audible) or I can barely hear music. These are 256 and 128 DSDs. Some 256 and 128 DSD files play fine. What should I do to fix this? Red book and other PCM files all seem to play fine.

Did you get help? If not, feel free to PM and I can try. I have many large DSD256 files in my library.
 
Did you get help?
Thanks for asking. Edward responded to an email, but no progress yet.

I am running Roon. Folders and DIF/DSD files show up on the Taiko using my PC’s file explorer. I don’t see them on Roon. Some DSD files do show up, but don’t play correctly, others are fine.

One other question: what is the fastest/best way to transfer music from my Aurender?
 
Use VNC viewer and get the Extreme to drag the files in to internal memory that way. You will find it far faster than trying to do it through your network. The Extreme is a beast and extremely quick.

I have had my Extreme for 24 days now and it is sounding great. If anybody is perusing this thread contemplating whether to buy an Extreme or not, the first point I would make - as a new user myself - is don’t be put off by some of the very lengthy and complex reviews and feedback that you may come across. This is my fourth music server and I have not found it any harder to set up and get running than any that preceded it.

Other than the general plaudits that are prevalent on here about sound quality, some other points that may be of interest:

i) As mentioned already, the Extreme is quick - very quick. It will plough through data transfers far faster than using a computer and doing it that way through the network. In addition, if you use Roon, you will be delighted to see it operate at near instantaneous speed.

ii) Check your volume! Because of the sound quality and lack of digital ‘noise’, you may find yourself listening at much higher volume than you realise. A side benefit of this is that enjoyable sound quality can be achieved at lower volume than you may be used to using. I am finding very satisfactory sound at 10-15 dB lower than I have traditionally had to use and everything is still there in the music.

iii) Streaming - I use Qobuz - is now so good that it is perfectly acceptable for proper listening, not just exploration.

iv) The combined effect of these previous 3 points make music exploration using Roon a real delight and I have discovered more new albums in the last month than perhaps in the last year or two. The speed of response, sound quality and ability to listen at lower volumes together with the complete absence of digital fatigue makes trying new music a real pleasure.

There are two slight complications compared to previous music servers. The first is the need to use VNC viewer to control Extreme but, in practice, it is very easy and not really much different than using your network and a webpage in actual use. The second slight complication is around the USB options in Roon which does take a bit of thought to get your head around. The unit starts up in Roon with a WASAPI driver for your DAC as well as a Taikio ASIO driver which you can edit in Roon, select your DAC and it will configure itself and you can then fine tune in the usual way. This ASIO driver sounds better. Then, finally, there are 4 USB profiles which are DAC dependent and you can run them from the Extreme desktop using VNC viewer. I suspect that these are routines that somehow tweak the Taiko ASIO driver to best match with your DAC and you should definitely do this because it does significantly improve the sound. I’ve just discovered this - I’ve no idea how it works, but it is definitely not something you should leave out.
 
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@Malcng:I'm at day 10 or 11, with approx.100 hours on the Extreme. Also sounding great. Did you observe a settling in period? I did, it seemed to have awoken at about 50-60 hours. With my limitations I couldn't have set it up without Taiko's assistance. (Christiaan) Are you connected ethernet directly to the Extreme? If so I would recommend a inexpensive switch I'm using a Netgear GS 105. Simple little tweak that can work well in certain networks.
 
@Malcng:I'm at day 10 or 11, with approx.100 hours on the Extreme. Also sounding great. Did you observe a settling in period? I did, it seemed to have awoken at about 50-60 hours. With my limitations I couldn't have set it up without Taiko's assistance. (Christiaan) Are you connected ethernet directly to the Extreme? If so I would recommend a inexpensive switch I'm using a Netgear GS 105. Simple little tweak that can work well in certain networks.

Yes, definitely sound quality improved over the first couple of weeks when I had mine running 24/7. Hard to say beyond that because I was mucking around with other things. I did initially disregard the USB profiles because the ASIO driver found my DAC in Roon and allowed me to configure it, so I thought that was that. I’m certainly glad that I went back and tried it. I have two DAC’s in my system and, luckily, they both work with the same ASIO driver configuration and USB profile 4.

I currently use an 8Switch and will watch for any further developments in this area.
 
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@pleroma: I sent him a PM suggesting the same converting to PCM. Strange why some will play and some won't, which as you indicate suggests something with the file. Converting to PCM should indicate if its the file or not. I think??
 

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