Sure Mike, agreed. But Emile's baby is a model of true lack of clutter and engineering hygiene in comparison.
Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème
- Thread starter CKKeung
- Start date
I totally understand the concern of comparing competitors pictures on the forum.
SOMusic, would you be willing to private message me the pictures? I don’t know if that’s possible from this site?
I’m really just curious. I’ve never seen such an impressive layout as on this Taiko. That’s not to say a competitor can’t produce a comparable or better product with a less fastidious internal lay out.
SOMusic, would you be willing to private message me the pictures? I don’t know if that’s possible from this site?
I’m really just curious. I’ve never seen such an impressive layout as on this Taiko. That’s not to say a competitor can’t produce a comparable or better product with a less fastidious internal lay out.
Fantastic machine. It looks like real hiend gear.
Will have to start collect cash to get one
From the pictures I see only one disadvantage
Why do you use asus hyper m2 ?
There is much better solution : ASRock Hyper Quad m2
It has shorter trace , lower temperature ( 10 degree ! So less noize), better cooling, utility to controll fan speed and other factors .....
and separate 12v supply for this 4 m2 chips.
Did you try AS Rock?
If so why you chose Asus ?
Will have to start collect cash to get one
From the pictures I see only one disadvantage
Why do you use asus hyper m2 ?
There is much better solution : ASRock Hyper Quad m2
It has shorter trace , lower temperature ( 10 degree ! So less noize), better cooling, utility to controll fan speed and other factors .....
and separate 12v supply for this 4 m2 chips.
Did you try AS Rock?
If so why you chose Asus ?
Thank you.
Also coud you please tell us if there is optical fibre internet card as standard here ?
I use to cover the memory chips with metal cover to protect the RF that is generated . Did you try it?
It was very effective
For what kind of options is the 12+5v supply on the lateral wall . (Very smart you did it !)
Do you still recommend the internal music storage on m2 ?
How far is the tidal / qubose SQ from the SQ of the internal stored files ?
Is totaldac you use (twelve) the best performer ?
If so please let me ask what connection you use ?
USB , Ethernet, AES or Spidf ?
Kris,
I understand your enthusiasm on computer hardware specs. I myself have been both a computer enthusiast and audiophile since my early youth. I chose IT as my professional career but am ultimately a more passionate audiophile which is why I took the gamble to quit my job and start a hifi company.
Ultimately better numbers do not directly translate into better sound.
With that said here are the answers to your questions:
-The Extreme comes with a fibre channel interface by default. It is ultimately the superior way to go if setup right.
-In the original sgm we machined custom heatsinks for memory modules, we stopped doing that in the EVO and Extreme as we discovered the actual reasons behind the improved sound quality and started adressing those at their source.
-The additional +5 and +12V is for possible future technology, we don’t need it now but we feel it’s important to have consumer mountable extension / upgrade options.
-Depending on network setup my pecking order for SQ is: 1) local pcie m2 based storage, 2) audiophile nas, qobuz 3) local ssd storage, 4) nas, tidal. Note there are many variables influencing the outcome.
-I reckon totaldac and msb offer the current sota dac’s. With the Extreme I get the best results to Totaldac D1-twelve mk2 with USB, with SGM2015 and SGM EVO I get better results with AES/EBU.
-VROC is only necessary to boot from a drive RAID array. The Extreme uses the drives in CPU data mode, meaning you cant boot from them, but you can easily extend your storage volume from within the OS. It’s around 4* SSD speed.
I understand your enthusiasm on computer hardware specs. I myself have been both a computer enthusiast and audiophile since my early youth. I chose IT as my professional career but am ultimately a more passionate audiophile which is why I took the gamble to quit my job and start a hifi company.
Ultimately better numbers do not directly translate into better sound.
With that said here are the answers to your questions:
-The Extreme comes with a fibre channel interface by default. It is ultimately the superior way to go if setup right.
-In the original sgm we machined custom heatsinks for memory modules, we stopped doing that in the EVO and Extreme as we discovered the actual reasons behind the improved sound quality and started adressing those at their source.
-The additional +5 and +12V is for possible future technology, we don’t need it now but we feel it’s important to have consumer mountable extension / upgrade options.
-Depending on network setup my pecking order for SQ is: 1) local pcie m2 based storage, 2) audiophile nas, qobuz 3) local ssd storage, 4) nas, tidal. Note there are many variables influencing the outcome.
-I reckon totaldac and msb offer the current sota dac’s. With the Extreme I get the best results to Totaldac D1-twelve mk2 with USB, with SGM2015 and SGM EVO I get better results with AES/EBU.
-VROC is only necessary to boot from a drive RAID array. The Extreme uses the drives in CPU data mode, meaning you cant boot from them, but you can easily extend your storage volume from within the OS. It’s around 4* SSD speed.
Last edited:
"-Depending on network setup my pecking order for SQ is: 1) local pcie m2 based storage, 2) audiophile nas, qobuz 3) local ssd storage, 4) nas, tidal. Note there are many variables influencing the outcome."
This quote from the post above caught my attention. Surprisingly, #2 on the list is streaming through Qobuz. The conventional wisdom that I'm aware of has always been that Cd rips to SSD were the best, followed by downloads to SSD. Streaming, whether Tidal or Qobuz, has always been considered at the bottom.
I wonder if this is an improvement in the processing of streamed files unique to the Taiko Servers?
Would this apply to the SGM Evo and the SGM2015 models as well? I'm particularly interested in how this applies to an ethernet network.
Can you elaborate on this? Thanks,
This quote from the post above caught my attention. Surprisingly, #2 on the list is streaming through Qobuz. The conventional wisdom that I'm aware of has always been that Cd rips to SSD were the best, followed by downloads to SSD. Streaming, whether Tidal or Qobuz, has always been considered at the bottom.
I wonder if this is an improvement in the processing of streamed files unique to the Taiko Servers?
Would this apply to the SGM Evo and the SGM2015 models as well? I'm particularly interested in how this applies to an ethernet network.
Can you elaborate on this? Thanks,
Good spot Will and it is a situation that applies to all the SGM / Taiko servers as they were all developed for Tidal streaming to give similar SQ to NAS storage. In fact, that is how I have always used mine, streaming from Tidal. Roon was updated earlier this year to work with Qoboz and I have heard from a couple of people that it does sound noticeably better than Tidal though I have yet to make the transition myself.
Whilst on this subject, some care with your network implementation eg lps on router / good lan cable has a rewarding payback. The SGM is quite responsive to clean power (though not as much as the lampi dacs) and a decent cord plus SR Blue fuse are also worthwhile.
Whilst on this subject, some care with your network implementation eg lps on router / good lan cable has a rewarding payback. The SGM is quite responsive to clean power (though not as much as the lampi dacs) and a decent cord plus SR Blue fuse are also worthwhile.
Hi Wil,
I used to rate Tidal higher, I have downrated it because of the increasing MQA (grainy/harsh) and remaster (often compressed) content. Although the original recordings are usually available I find it annoying to have to check which version of an album I have selected.
With that said, a good internet connection and decent networking setup helps a lot increasing network based source sound quality, this will even increase local storage playback quality, though to a less extend then anything networked. And yes we have put in an effort to increase internet based streaming source quality relative to local storage/nas.
Emile, your product looks truly exotic!
It looks not so much just attention to detail, but also the workmanship, top notch right to the choice of film bypassing with rather spendy capacitors and resonance tuning in the power supply is just unthinkable to be ever available from any other server.
I am sure with such care in parts selection, build and finishing, you have a product which will have a one of a kind sonic sundae.
Emile, I see some Panzerholz within the Extreme. Would it have been fruitful to make the whole structure/casework of the unit out of Panzerholz?
Heat management and shielding would become an issue, Panzerholz is also rather "rough" looking. I'll attach some photo's to give you an idea. It's also much harder to machine then Aluminium, we use a CNC machine designed to machine stone, like granite kitchen tops. It would actually be a an even more expensive solution. So we went for damping in critical locations. There's more Panzerholz in there then visible on the photos along with several other measures.
Emile, I smile to myself everytime I look at the Panzerholz under my Zus. My lovely Ra thinks I'm in too deep into this hobby LOL.
I see that LessLoss are big into Panzerholz casework, incl their dac and Laminar streamer (only 4x pricier than yr Extreme LOL).
I see that LessLoss are big into Panzerholz casework, incl their dac and Laminar streamer (only 4x pricier than yr Extreme LOL).
Oh yes of course, you know how it looks. In lessloss defence, Panzerholz really is a PITA to work with. We wore out our first CNC machine in less then a year. We went through 3 high speed spindles and all axes and motors needed revision. We definitely lost money on the first few 100 Daizas and Setchis
Oh yes of course, you know how it looks. In lessloss defence, Panzerholz really is a PITA to work with. We wore out our first CNC machine in less then a year. We went through 3 high speed spindles and all axes and motors needed revision. We definitely lost money on the first few 100 Daizas and Setchis
The people at the factory warned me a few years ago about it. Panzerholtz is widely used in industry and is considered to have high workability but you must have the proper tools and knowledge. The modeling industry were the only people I could find that could consider working with it.
At that time my interest was not audio, but Panzerholz can be used as a shield to neutrons - it is made from phenolic resin and hardwood in a plywood structure having essentially light atoms, but it is heavy. The density is about half of aluminum - fortunately much lighter than the lead usually used in bricks to shield the gamma radiation. Should we suppose that screening from neutrons improves sound quality?
